LGBT+ Marvel Characters Discussion

[Anduinel]

YEP. Some people on Twitter noticed as well. Love that Marvel so underuses their LGBT characters that no one noticed it wasn’t even *their* characters. Most likely was supposed to be Billy & Teddy.

I guess the most likely answer is that whoever got assigned to do that cover wound up snatching an image from some "Top Ten Worst/Best Gay Moments In Comics" list without looking very closely at who the characters actually were. Though, really? Alan Scott and Sam are pretty damn obscure at this point; DC seems to have done their best to kick sand over that whole sorry blip on the radar. I wouldn't be surprised if that picture was included deliberately just to see if anyone in the Marvel offices noticed.

ETA: Yeah, the artist yoinked an internet image and didn't check the character names closely.

[Dermie]

I agree that the whole "they're not humans so it doesn't count" logic doesn't really work with the reality of the Marvel universe – but, it isn't anything new. Not at all different from Secret Invasion.

"They're not human so it doesn't count" logic WOULD work for some characters. And as others in the thread have already noted, the fact that it is a war--these beings have invaded their planet and it is literally a kill-or-be-kill situation--would be enough to justify it for just about every character. It is not a normal circumstance. Its true that most of these characters would not kill under normal circumstances...but this isn't normal.

Atlas absolutely would kill and has killed before. He was a soldier and a mercenary before becoming a super-villain, and has killed and attempted to kill people since getting his powers.

Scott Lang has also showed a bit of a dark side on occasion (especially if it involves a threat to Cassie or other children -- like when he was prepared to murder the man who kidnapped Cassie, but instead let Jack Of Hearts do it since he was about to die himself anyway), so I have no trouble believing that he would kill if the situation called for it.

As for Raz and Tom, I don't really think either of them would normally use lethal force--but again, this is a kill-or-be-killed situation and I think both of them would rather be on the "kill" than "be killed" side of that equation.

[NexusTenebrare]

"They're not human so it doesn't count" logic WOULD work for some characters. And as others in the thread have already noted, the fact that it is a war--these beings have invaded their planet and it is literally a kill-or-be-kill situation--would be enough to justify it for just about every character. It is not a normal circumstance. Its true that most of these characters would not kill under normal circumstances...but this isn't normal.

Atlas absolutely would kill and has killed before. He was a soldier and a mercenary before becoming a super-villain, and has killed and attempted to kill people since getting his powers.

Scott Lang has also showed a bit of a dark side on occasion (especially if it involves a threat to Cassie or other children -- like when he was prepared to murder the man who kidnapped Cassie, but instead let Jack Of Hearts do it since he was about to die himself anyway), so I have no trouble believing that he would kill if the situation called for it.

As for Raz and Tom, I don't really think either of them would normally use lethal force--but again, this is a kill-or-be-killed situation and I think both of them would rather be on the "kill" than "be killed" side of that equation.

The general conceit of superhero comics is that aside from antiheroes or outright militaristic characters, heroes don't kill. It might happen in an extremely stressful, split decision moment, but for the most part heroes are supposed to be idealistc figures.

This also isn't some kidnapped daughter situation. They were asked by some quasi-mythological figure they barely know to kill another quasi-mythological figure they don't know as revenge for the killing of the first's son, who in the past has had a major antagonistical role in the lives of their compatriots.
And on top of all of that, the one they're supposed to kill isn't even directly responsible for the death of that son.
But yeah, sure. That totally sounds like something heroes would do.

[Ticomat]

tumblr_inline_ps0mwmll8R1qfyy4i_1280.jpg

Soooo, I just love this so much! I mean, Sailor Moon Billy! Teddy using Excelsior to hold his cereal bowl! It's so good!

Bigger image: https://tinyurl.com/yxsom3k8

[The Cool Thatguy]

"They're not human so it doesn't count" logic WOULD work for some characters. And as others in the thread have already noted, the fact that it is a war--these beings have invaded their planet and it is literally a kill-or-be-kill situation--would be enough to justify it for just about every character. It is not a normal circumstance. Its true that most of these characters would not kill under normal circumstances...but this isn't normal.

Atlas absolutely would kill and has killed before. He was a soldier and a mercenary before becoming a super-villain, and has killed and attempted to kill people since getting his powers.

Scott Lang has also showed a bit of a dark side on occasion (especially if it involves a threat to Cassie or other children -- like when he was prepared to murder the man who kidnapped Cassie, but instead let Jack Of Hearts do it since he was about to die himself anyway), so I have no trouble believing that he would kill if the situation called for it.

As for Raz and Tom, I don't really think either of them would normally use lethal force--but again, this is a kill-or-be-killed situation and I think both of them would rather be on the "kill" than "be killed" side of that equation.

Minor point of fact with Atlas, though. Once he gained his ionic powers, they messed with his mind. So his attempted murders, like Herc and Genis, were due to outside influences more than say, a complete disregard for human life.

That said, Erik is easily led and likely killed some people as a Zemo merc. But left to his own devises, and his powers working correctly, he's not inclined to kill.

[Holt]

Billy doing the Sailor Moon pose is all I ever needed.

[Fokken]

This War of the Realms entry is SO GAY.



Dazzler. Sailor Moon. She-Ra. Mimosas. Teen Girl Squad. Frozen. Drag Queens. X-Men references.

I. Am. So. Hard.

lol

[legion_quest]

Awww, it's so sweet.

God damn people in their happy functioning relationships.

Break up now! :P

[Dermie]

The general conceit of superhero comics is that aside from antiheroes or outright militaristic characters, heroes don't kill. It might happen in an extremely stressful, split decision moment, but for the most part heroes are supposed to be idealistc figures.

Yes, I agree. But again, this isn't a typical superhero fight situation. It is a war, with a full scale planetary invasion. One of the horrors of war is that it puts people into situations where they do things that they normally would not do.

I don't disagree that as a general rule, most heroes don't kill--although that has become somewhat less true over time, with fewer heroes having a firm "killing is a last resort" position. But there are exceptions, and there are situations that push characters to do different things.

Minor point of fact with Atlas, though. Once he gained his ionic powers, they messed with his mind. So his attempted murders, like Herc and Genis, were due to outside influences more than say, a complete disregard for human life.

That said, Erik is easily led and likely killed some people as a Zemo merc. But left to his own devises, and his powers working correctly, he's not inclined to kill.

I'm not saying Atlas is a cold blooded murderer. I'm just saying there is precedent for him to kill and to use lethal force.

And while you can certainly make an argument for his murder of Genis as being due to mental instability (although his ionic powers had been dormant until that exact moment when his rage and desire to lash out at Genis triggered them to re-emerge), I don't think that argument really works with Hercules. Erik was still pretty stable mentally and emotionally in those days. It was around the start of Wonder Man's solo book where Erik really started to lose his grip.

[Drops Of Venus]

So...the Marvel 1000 collage cover. Anyone see Alan Scott(DC) and Sam kissing? I'm thinking its supposed to be Billy and Teddy or Northstar and Kyle?

YEP. Some people on Twitter noticed as well. Love that Marvel so underuses their LGBT characters that no one noticed it wasn’t even *their* characters. Most likely was supposed to be Billy & Teddy.

Someone pointed out on Twitter how the DC image looks incredibly similar to the Billy/Teddy kiss from Children's Crusade, so yeah, I believe it might've been supposed to be them indeed.




Marvel is reportedly changing the cover now that they've been notified of the gaffe. Hopefully they won't just delete the DC picture but actually replace it with a Marvel gay kiss, 'cause it would be nice to still have that on the cover.

[Silvermoth]

Haha someone just said “we need some ‘mos in here” and googled “comic book gay kiss”

[Anduinel]

BTW, The X-Tremists #4 is out this week. This one is Northstar's spotlight issue and lands the day after my birthday. I may be counting minutes until the issue drops on ComiXology.

[Punisher007]

Having seen the film several times, if they wanted to make Carol lesbian or bi in the MCU, which I'd be fine with BTW, they could do it and it wouldn't be out of place. I mean her and Maria lived together apparently, spent Christmas together, and raised a child together, and at no point is there a hint of a man in Carol's life. Even her dynamic with Fury is very much "buddy cop" like. So yeah I could buy it (especially if you're aware of the Don't Ask Don't Tell policy that existed in the military at that time).

[Tycon]

House of Jumbo Carnation really had me tearing up. No matter how much or little money it makes, I would buy multiple copies of a prequel of Mother Carnation rescuing runaway gay/trans mutants of color and building a family.

[Kurisu]

tumblr_inline_ps0mwmll8R1qfyy4i_1280.jpg

Soooo, I just love this so much! I mean, Sailor Moon Billy! Teddy using Excelsior to hold his cereal bowl! It's so good!

Bigger image: https://tinyurl.com/yxsom3k8

Tini Howard and Anthony Oliveira, the saviors we didn’t know we needed.