Betty Kane / Bette Kane Appreciation 2018

[Aahz]

You have read Morrison's Batman run, right? Everything was brought back into continuity, in some form.

But in this case he explained it as a Hallucination.

And in the roughly 40 years before Morrison, it was mostly ignored what happened in the early silver age, and post crisis it was definitely erased untill Morrison came along.

And btw. I still don't like this "everyting is continuity" thing.

[Aahz]

You have read Morrison's Batman run, right?

And to give the question back, have you actually read the silver age stories with Bette as Bat-Girl?

[Oberon]

Not that everything was a hallucination, but that Batman and some of his cohorts were exposed to things that caused hallucinations. Somethings, like the energy forms to another planet stuff was for us today, a clear hallucination. But Batman thinking Kathy Kane was the love of his life was not. He got better, of course.

But I think Morrison wanted to be able to show that most things chronicled happened if only at times in his mind; fevered visions.

I'm quite happy with the idea and think that like Elton John said in a song, "comic book heroes never grow old". So the immense time compression works in that sense.
Let's be real, only about 3 years separate Bette/Bat-girl from Babs/Batgirl, so why can't they be in the same continuity? Hmmmm?

It is up to readers to decide when not totally clear, what happened or not. But some things are looked at again and come up as "real".

For my money... the definitive Bette story would

show the behind the scenes - how did she come to visit her Aunt Kathy that one summer?

Who really are/were her parents?

Why did she leave and not come back until some time later (leaving the 'y-e-a-r-s' to be months perhaps, or only 1 year or so).

How did she really get the name Flamebird - update to the Superman remembers he told Dick and Bette the legends, blahblahblah story.

In another thought that goes around, the only way to make Bette and Kate be 2nd cousins to Bruce would be if Martha was actually a cousin to Jacob/Bette's father/other siblings, rather than "sister".

There are some easy ways to do that, especially when you consider that rich folks have always 'doctored' paper work, birth certificates, etc to hide truths or set things up differently. Maybe it was inconvenient for Martha to be the daughter to someone when she was; let and Uncle and Aunt raiser her.

I'm not rich but something like this happened in my family about 100 years ago; still a good family secret.

[Assam]

Personally, I'd still like to see Bette partner up with Beast Boy again. Any plans for that to go anywhere were scrapped but I've never liked either character more than when with the other.

Being realistic though, that's never gonna happen, so after the scene in the last issue of 'Tec, I'm just hoping she gets a home again. Of course the idea of a second team book is still just a theory and if Batwoman was going to become her regular spot again, she probably would have been re-introduced there. Meaning, for 'Tec not to be even more overly crowded, 3 members would have to leave. And Hell, Harper is still in the picture and basically calls 'Tec home as well so I'm really not sure what's going on.

[Frontier]

I'm looking forward to seeing Bette out of West Point.

[Oberon]

I was not reading DC during those story/eras but I have seen some of the panels and you're right; they were written to have great chemistry between them. Whoever that writer was looked at Beast Boy who seems to be an underdog or less confident hero in his earlier days and matched up with a female character who had similar tropes.

Or the writers wanted to have less of the Robin/NW ~ Bette stuff going on?

[Assam]

I was not reading DC during those story/eras but I have seen some of the panels and you're right; they were written to have great chemistry between them. Whoever that writer was looked at Beast Boy who seems to be an underdog or less confident hero in his earlier days and matched up with a female character who had similar tropes.

If you want to ever check it out, look for the Beast Boy mini from 2000, #35-#36 of Jae Faerber's run on Titans, and Young Justice #21. I think they also had some interaction in the excellent Technis Imperative mini.

[Oberon]

Thanks! I can use my library to order them perhaps.

[Herowatcher]

I hate the direction they have taken the character becoming totally submissive to Kate's opinions. Even in continuity, it seemed that Bette was doing the hero biz longer than Kate. Sure she had one rough night where she got her butt handed to her, but most of them do at some point. (Wasn't Kate even turned into a vampire? That's hardly winning that fight...)
I can totally see Kate being protective, but I also (mostly in my own head cannon) see it as Kate being the all dark, shadowy grimgrim character not really caring for Bette's approach of a bright happy character. I would SO love to see a panel with Bette dressing back up and looking into a mirror with a smirk going "I love you Kate, but...no." Then totally winning it as Flamebird again.

Yeah....there's no way I would want to see Bette being that submissive to Kate again. They gave Bette this big turning point in her life and I don't see her taking anymore crap from anyone...Batman included.
Bette should be through caring how other heroes see her and starting kicking butt her way...even if that means going it alone. I don't see her losing her positive attitude, but I do expect to see a little more, for lack of a better word, grimness about her. You don't have something that traumatic happen to you and not become changed in some way. I do see Bette showing others you can be a hero without going totally dark.

[Oberon]

... and I don't think she will.

Her history actually shows something else if one cares to look at it:

Aunt Kathy Kane told her as "Bat-girl" that though she was clever (to figure KK's ID) she must never be BG again. But she was, and saved the day at least several times.

Years later, Dick, Nightwing, told her that she should give it up too, but she didn't, and went on to have some adventures with Beast Boy that were somewhat notable.

Then we have Kate in her first series also tell Bette that she couldn't cut it... but she ended up saving the day as well as avenging herself.

Are they just all jealous? More likely they are just unable to see something that is there and has always been there.

Why would that be, is the question that any writer or fan of these comics should ask themselves.

[Man-Thing]

I mean, I'm glad we're getting an update on her activities, but I hope she's more involved in the series moving forward...

[Herowatcher]

History shows Bette can save the day, but she's still questioned by other heroes about her capabilities.
Writers really need to give that a rest. It's getting ridiculous.

From what I'm hearing Bette is at West Point sporting a buzz cut hairdo?
Definitely a big change for her.

[Oberon]

Couple of things with that.

In rich families it is not uncommon for the youngest son/daughter/cousin/niece/nephew to receive some infantizalation or whatever. Treated as the 'pet', or 'baby' long after it should be acceptable.

What am I saying, this happens in lots of families despite class or station. So Bette has possibly always been treated as the youngster, the callow youth or maiden, etc.

I've said something about this in Batwoman's thread recently but the other idea is that to Kate (who I see as a Batman to Bette's Nightwing - not a total reliant partner but a healthy trusted partner)

sees Bette as one of her few relatives that she hasn't had some sort of problem with. Bette may be the only person that Kate feels good about in most respects.

Jacob - very troubled relationship

Cathy Kane, stepmother - not sure how well explored, but Kate has always seemed to be at odds or not really seeing eye to eye with her.

Beth - obviously her most confusing relationship because as twins there must have been deep love and devotion. I can' t imagine what it would be like to lose someone so close. I lost my own brother several years ago, but we were only super - close as children and young adults.
With Beth, Kate may also have found the thing that drives her guilt.

To answer Caivu in that thread, perhaps I now see, that thing that happened in BW # 9 (still haven't seen it yet!) is also a reflection on her guilt for not being able to save her mother and sister and then the continuing miasma of dealing with everything since she realized Beth is still alive, but very different.

So back to Bette, Kate's harder edge against her, which I first saw in Elegy - not being against her actually, but being rather indifferent, colder, is because Bette is the last person/family, she cares about that she could lose. Its a little bit like the mother in "The Yearling" that didn't want to embrace her youngest child because she was afraid he would die if she loved him too much - - like all her previous children. Subconsciously or on certain levels, Beth even takes the place of Bette or vice a versa in Kate's mind.

Similarity of names, appearance/blond, etc.

Bette saves the day - and always reluctantly assumes her place, per her elders. She actually is a good soldier, she just needs to become more confident and I see this as the challenge in her relationship with Kate. The mentor/student model with some rough diamonds on each side.

[OBrianTallent]

I was not reading DC during those story/eras but I have seen some of the panels and you're right; they were written to have great chemistry between them. Whoever that writer was looked at Beast Boy who seems to be an underdog or less confident hero in his earlier days and matched up with a female character who had similar tropes.

Or the writers wanted to have less of the Robin/NW ~ Bette stuff going on?

The writer of the Beast Boy mini was Ben Raab, who (sadly for us comic book fans) has found a better road in Hollywood than in comics.

[Oberon]

I generally don't follow creators that much. Some seem to shine above the rest, as in the case of Batwoman's first volume.

It would be interesting to see how Bette might react to Basil, in Detective, if such opportunity occurs. His ability is similar to Beast Boy's. Despite her appearance in the recent Detective I think her story will show more in Batwoman. I could be wrong. The more of her the merrier!

In the new 'Rebirth' fashioning of the DC-verse, it will be more interesting if and when Dick and Bette finally meet. Any speculations on that?
Are they still in closer age proximity to each other, even? In the years ago Titans Tomorrow arc, it was Tim who seemed more Bette's age.