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  1. #121
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boots View Post
    and this is where we might all have common ground- i can see sony wanting to hold on to the one element that was universally loved (though its debatable whether it was stone herself or the all-too-real chemistry between her and garfield).

    if you want to argue from a point of story cohesion that losing gwen is problematic, i can agree.

    but from a production or studio pov? not so much. just ditch webb's vision for the franchise, bring stone back in asm 3. clone her, make it a bad dream, give her powers- superhero comics are not the only ones that can play at that game. the transformers franchise shat itself after the backlash from killing off optimus prime in the 80s and brought him back twice (and liked it so much they've made a running theme of it ever since). if sony wanted emma to continue being in the films, sony would do it. she would most likely have been contracted for more than 2 films anyway (which also points to how the thought process on that side of the camera works. think about that for a second). it would not be an issue. the issue was whether the ASM brand image was already too damaged. it's a cumulative effect starting from ASM 1.

    as much as i admire yours and confuzzled's purist approach to story telling, and as much as i wish things would work that way, they often don't. especially in film and tv. often you're learning brand new lines inserted into a script on the morning of a shoot and you have no idea why.

    "gladiator" shot without a bloody script and that thing won five academy awards. "stength and honour"? that's russ' high school motto- he just chucked it in there to sound cool.
    Given how the studio panicked after ASM 2, it didn't really seem like they had much vision.

  2. #122
    Loony Scott Taylor's Avatar
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    What you say about Robert Redford is what this thread is about with respect to Emma Stone. The expectations for the audience that knows her acting chops are not to have her be the sweet girlfriend who gets bridged, the expectation is for her to go Wichita on the Green Goblin's ass.

    Casting is important. People even get typecast if they are good enough at playing certain types of characters, while others are just popular for their looks or whatever reason and get put in movies to ride that wave of popularity (Benedict Cumberbatch and Hugo Weaving come to mind).
    Last edited by Scott Taylor; 07-21-2015 at 04:08 PM.
    Every day is a gift, not a given right.

  3. #123
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeitgeist View Post
    How the hell did this get to 8 pages
    15 hour work day + procrastination + me. soz, promise not to do it again.

  4. #124
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel22 View Post
    For me, it's gotten to nine pages because a couple people are having a conversation, not trying to win an argument, and it's really nice. I wish it happened more often.
    wanna fight?

  5. #125
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel22 View Post
    So while if I had to guess I would say that the producers had a long-term plan in place, much of that went out the window as soon as the first movie underperformed, and got completely scrapped once the second one came out.
    pretty much my feeling too, though even if it hadn’t under-performed, there are still a crazy amount of changes from go to wo on any production (in fact, a film doing well can sometimes cause the follow up to try and emulate it to replicate success). there’s not a plan so much as a rough guideline.

    I buy your view on the actor not being as important to the guys who control the pursestrings as the fans make it out to be. I would think that they wouldn't want to be too beholden to any one person, or have anyone feel like they were irreplaceable. They would want to avoid a Favre in Greenbay or James in Cleveland situation at all costs.
    to be a bit clearer today- it depends on the situation. if it’s an indie film or “a risk” or a “passion project” a studio will often only back it if a particular star agrees (sean penn “at close range”, bradley cooper “american sniper” mel Gibson “braveheart”- though all those actors also produced those films so they were already involved). if the studio has purchased a blockbuster franchise and they intend to have it roll out by a certain date, they will do it no matter what.

  6. #126
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyberhubbs View Post
    Yeah. The third could coulda been him meeting MJ, like they planned, a sorta segue from teen life into young adulthood. That there's life after death. That you'll have several OTLs in your lifetime, each for different reasons. That even if he doesn't stay with MJ after the third film, at least he's moving forward.
    essentially i can agree that it’s all in the execution. the storyline and arc itself could have been amazing if handled well.

  7. #127
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    Given how the studio panicked after ASM 2, it didn't really seem like they had much vision.
    working off my quote that you highlighted- i was driving at the fact that even though the storyline and “vision” was always to kill emma’s character, the studio had her signed for “several films” which implies they are ready and willing to change that “vision” at a moments notice and if needs be, kill her and bring her back to life in every damn film.

    they didn’t handle it very well though, i can agree.

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by boots View Post
    wanna fight?
    Yeah! Lets do it like those old "Choose your own adventure" YA books. Should I:

    A. Accuse you of stating your opinions as facts?
    B. One of us accuses the other of "fanboying"?
    C. Use the others grammar mistakes as a way to discredit their thoughts?

    No keeping your finger on the decision page in case you choose wrong and the story ends.

  9. #129
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boots View Post
    working off my quote that you highlighted- i was driving at the fact that even though the storyline and “vision” was always to kill emma’s character, the studio had her signed for “several films” which implies they are ready and willing to change that “vision” at a moments notice and if needs be, kill her and bring her back to life in every damn film.

    they didn’t handle it very well though, i can agree.
    I love making cheap jokes when I see an opportunity.

  10. #130
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    I love making cheap jokes when I see an opportunity.
    hey, who doesn't?

  11. #131
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel22 View Post
    Yeah! Lets do it like those old "Choose your own adventure" YA books. Should I:

    A. Accuse you of stating your opinions as facts?
    B. One of us accuses the other of "fanboying"?
    C. Use the others grammar mistakes as a way to discredit their thoughts?

    No keeping your finger on the decision page in case you choose wrong and the story ends.
    but that’s my favourite move! cheating.

    my other favourite move is to use big words i don’t fully understand in an effort to make myself sound more photosynthesis.

  12. #132

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    To answer Kevin imo no it wasn't, the storyline they chose to adapt maybe, to have the payoff happen in the second film also possible but not her casting. I think what Sony major problem with ASM2 was they tried to have their cake and eat. they wanted to world build and move the personal story along and didn't execute it well. That's just me
    Truth is the best policy

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by boots View Post
    but that’s my favourite move! cheating.

    my other favourite move is to use big words i don’t fully understand in an effort to make myself sound more photosynthesis.
    That, and adding superfluous "U"s to words to appear exotic...?

    I'm guilty of showing off my vocabulary sometimes, too. Then when I hear someone else misuse a fancy word, I have a moment of self-doubt, wondering if I am the one who has been misusing that word... I have dictionary.com bookmarked for just such occasions. "Risibility" means having the ability or disposition to laugh, by the way (it's their word of the day!).

  14. #134
    Mighty Member Zeitgeist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Confuzzled View Post
    No amount of updating would have changed the fact that Gwen was a sacrificial lamb from the start. Also, the way the TASM films played out the story was just like another half-baked and rushed fridging story, without the nuances and pathos of the comics.
    Oh I totally agree that the TASM films shanked what was meant to be a touching and moving arc regardless. It wasn't perfunctory because the character was Gwen though - she didn't have to die - but because the script was just so easily telegraphed.

    Quote Originally Posted by boots View Post
    15 hour work day + procrastination + me. soz, promise not to do it again.
    Bewts

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel22 View Post
    That, and adding superfluous "U"s to words to appear exotic...?
    I hope you're kidding about the Queen's English there
    ♪ღ♪*•.¸¸¸.•*¨ ¨*•.¸¸¸.•*•♪ღ♪¸.•*¨ ¨*•.¸¸¸.•*•♪ღ♪•*

    ♪ღ♪░NORAH░WINTERS░FOR░SPIDER-WAIFU░♪ღ♪

    *•♪ღ♪*•.¸¸¸.•*¨ ¨*•.¸¸¸.•*•♪¸.•*¨ ¨*•.¸¸¸.•*•♪ღ♪•«

  15. #135
    Astonishing Member boots's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeitgeist View Post
    I hope you're kidding about the Queen's English there
    kiddinguous?

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