Emma Frost = Bad Xmen

[Carabas]

As for Emma doing horrible crimes to others. So have many other X-villains and even a few X-men. The whole Samurai angle was tacked onto to Wolverine because Marvel realized that they had a stone cold killer on a superhero time. Who was and is popular. So they tried to soften that image by making him a "samurai". It's not to say Emma is a saint but if one is going to call out the character for her crimes. Remember that others have done far worse imo.

Yeah, not sure how that was supposed to work because samurai, they weren't exactly nice guys, and most of them were not overly concerned with honour when they thought nobody was looking, or when the people they were killing were not other samuri but mere peasants.

[sureshot]

Eh? No, Logan wasn't a stone cold killer, cable, punisher, and him come from similar backgrounds. The samurai angle had nothing to do with his image to soften, it was more up played for his time in Japan and mariko

Wolverine is a killer. Except it gets overlooked by the fans because they like the character. Out of all the X-men he is the most likely to stab a villain in the head. if the need requires than open a can of beer. If he gets angry all bets are off. Even his friedns are at risk imo. I'm not saying he is a bad as Sabertooth. He is no saint either. The Samurai angle was to soften up his image as killer on a superhero time imo. As well as his time in Japan and Mariko.

Yeah, not sure how that was supposed to work because samurai, they weren't exactly nice guys, and most of them were not overly concerned with honour when they thought nobody was looking, or when the people they were killing were not other samuri but mere peasants.

I'm assuming Marvel was going for the romantized image of a Samurai imo. I still think my theory of the writers realizing they had a superhero who not only kills other characters. If gets angry enough might even attack his friends. Need to be santized so that some parents would not complain. So they added the Samurai angle both as character development and to hide the fact that they had a character who kills on a super team in a popular comic. The whole Samurai angle I think was ruined when he murdered a bunch of his illigetimate kids in a berserker rage. Granted he was in a rage but it still happened. I won't say anything negative about his running a school. If someone like Emma who is no saint can be a teacher in a school so can Wolverine.

[Hariel0079]

Wolverine is a killer. Except it gets overlooked by the fans because they like the character. Out of all the X-men he is the most likely to stab a villain in the head. if the need requires than open a can of beer. If he gets angry all bets are off. Even his friedns are at risk imo. I'm not saying he is a bad as Sabertooth. He is no saint either. The Samurai angle was to soften up his image as killer on a superhero time imo. As well as his time in Japan and.

No, that's YOUR insertions. You point out Logan and leave out cable? Logan first intro into comics wasn't a killer, that came later on and even then No beer just cigars. You'd know that if you actually Read the x-books. The beer was just a replacement for cigars because of real world politics.

[SicariiDC]

I really had no problem with Emma's progression though the 90's with her being mostly redeemed through Generation X (though the end.) I did have problems with her being a full blown X-Man at first though, and I really had issues with her and Scott being in a relationship, but after a while she grew on me. She has proven herself a hero. A snarky hero but a hero nonetheless. I don't like Fantomex. But I have followed many books with him in it, and he has failed to grow on me at all, so I feel justified in saying when I don't like Fantomex.

If you start out not liking a character, and then decide that you just will avoid that character, you never give the character a chance to see them redeemed or go through whatever character evolution they go through. It's kind of like saying you don't like a certain food when you've never eaten it. I will give you the writing under Bendis though because Bendis is just bland in general.

This is pretty good. I like Fantomex tho, even from the start in Morrison's stuff.

Emma is kinda of a staple now. Her and Scott. With him dying, it would be interesting to see how she handles herself on her own again

[Fokken]

This is pretty good. I like Fantomex tho, even from the start in Morrison's stuff.

Emma is kinda of a staple now. Her and Scott. With him dying, it would be interesting to see how she handles herself on her own again

Agreed.
She really has a heartbreaking track record of losing those she cares about.
Her brother Christian.
Her teaching mentor Ian Kendall.
Trevor Killkelly, her first boyfriend.
Her Hellions: Beef. Bevatron. Catseye. Jetstream. Roulette. Tarot.
Her Xavier students: Synch. Skin.
Her former co-head: Banshee.
Countless Genoshan students.
Her Cuckoos: Sophie Cuckoo. Esme Cuckoo.
Her and Scott's students from the Purifier Massacre.
Her and Scott's M-day students on the infamous BUS.

Now Scott.

[sureshot]

No, that's YOUR insertions. You point out Logan and leave out cable? Logan first intro into comics wasn't a killer, that came later on and even then No beer just cigars. You'd know that if you actually Read the x-books. The beer was just a replacement for cigars because of real world politics.

So because I have a difference of opinion on a character it means I don't read the books. Really. That's the galaxy sized cop-out of a excuse you choose to use. "You opinionson character XYZ is different than mine. Aha! your not reading the comics". No that simply means I feel differently about a character. One you don't necessarily have to agree with. How about instead of claiming fellow posters don't read the comics actually respect they may have a difference opinion. Than yours. I respect yours clearly you don't mine or others.

I began reading the X-men when the individual issues were numbered between 185 or was it 190. So long ago. Once I began working full time I bought more trades and older issues. While Wolverine is no Sabertooth. Neither is he some kind of saint like some fans make the character out to be either. I still think the character is killer. The X-men killer but a killer nonetheless. Just because he does it for the X-men and for what he thinks are good reasons does not make him any less of one. I might be wrong but that's my feelings on the character. I also never liked the Samurai element they added to the character. It's not going to stop me from reading more stories that involve the character. I can respect those that do. That's the difference between me and you.

[Fokken]

Yeeeaaaaah......Harry tends to be weirdly aggressive, sureshot.

[sureshot]

Yeeeaaaaah......Harry tends to be weirdly aggressive, sureshot.

I understand defending a character he likes. I can respect someone who does that. I do the same. It's just seems here that someone with a difference of opinion is tagged with "oh you don't agree with me aha! proof positive you never read the comics". It's a BS argument because it makes no sense. To use another example I like a specific type of car another person likes a different one. I have to dislike the other person model of car then go told "you don't know what your talking about and I bet you never ever drove a car" . See how stupid and silly that sounds. to me the lowest form of counter-argument on a comics forum is claiming someone else has not read comics. Now sometimes when a person is writing stuff say about the Avengers and it's all of base and completely wrong. Then and only then will I say that person has not read the comics. Even then it has to be proven wrong. Never on having a difference of opinion. If I ever forget my own advice I deserve to get the same treatment.

[SicariiDC]

It's crazy how as Logan got softer, Scott got harder...thats why I rock with the x-men tho, who'd a thought that back then. Still, I loved seeing both of them in killer mode, around kyost run and stuff...wish we got more of that