Emma Frost = Bad Xmen

[Gray Lensman]

Emma only supplied Mastermind that model that lets him project illusions in others minds. There was no other proof that she took part further part in his plans. That's like blaming a gun manufacturing company for the deaths a serial killer committed with one of their weapons. Mastermind and Dark Phoenix (Who didn't even commit those deaths directly) are the ones responsible.

And Jean forgave Mastermind (on his deathbed, but she still did).

[Baby_Hater666]

I don't hate Emma as a character. In fact I really enjoy her as a snarky foil, she's really fun to read but I just never felt her switch from villainy to working with the Xmen and (to a lesser extent) dating Scott ever felt truly justified. It was always felt like a clunky leap of character. Magneto I kinda get, Rogue makes sense but Emma---as much as I enjoy her presence I have trouble realistically wrapping my brain around that one.

Morrison tried, a bunch of writers tried I'm just not convinced. I just kind of have to ignore half of her history and enjoy her as she is now because otherwise she makes less and less sense to me.

[yogaflame]

Emma only supplied Mastermind that model that lets him project illusions in others minds. There was no other proof that she took part further part in his plans. That's like blaming a gun manufacturing company for the deaths a serial killer committed with one of their weapons. Mastermind and Dark Phoenix (Who didn't even commit those deaths directly) are the ones responsible.

No Emma, no Mastermind, no Dark Phoenix.

[FluffyCyclopsRLZ]

I'm not reading UXM. Care to post spoilers?

Bendis throwaway line. Hilariously mean diss at the JGS. Which means Emma's eviiil or whatever, right?

[Londo Bellian]

I pointed that out two pages ago. Thanks for finding the pic; it's better.

But what if the ANAD writers are actually crazy/stupid enough to go for it? Will it work?

Emma only supplied Mastermind that model that lets him project illusions in others minds. There was no other proof that she took part further part in his plans. That's like blaming a gun manufacturing company for the deaths a serial killer committed with one of their weapons. Mastermind and Dark Phoenix (Who didn't even commit those deaths directly) are the ones responsible.

Wasn't this case won against the gun manufacturing company in the film version of "Runaway Jury"? Or was it merely Artistic License of the Law at work?

Maybe the D'Bari thing was was just "circumstances beyond anybody's control".

[FluffyCyclopsRLZ]

But what if the ANAD writers are actually crazy/stupid enough to go for it? Will it work?

Can't for the life of me see how. The Hellfire Bratz turned the HFC into the mother of all bad jokes. For anyone - not just Emma - to genuinely want to have anything to do with this wretched circus act would be beyond embarrassing. Don't even get me started on that Sentinels business of late. It wouldn't make any sense for Emma to go anywhere near these clowns without committing mass murder. It wouldn't make any sense either for the HFC to want Emma anywhere near them.

Thus why I assumed it was Ex!Supervillain humor.

[Hariel0079]

Emma only supplied Mastermind that model that lets him project illusions in others minds. There was no other proof that she took part further part in his plans. That's like blaming a gun manufacturing company for the deaths a serial killer committed with one of their weapons. Mastermind and Dark Phoenix (Who didn't even commit those deaths directly) are the ones responsible.

Emma is still an accomplice. She's even admitted her hand at messing with Jean/PF.

[yogaflame]

Can't for the life of me see how. The Hellfire Bratz turned the HFC into the mother of all bad jokes. For anyone - not just Emma - to genuinely want to have anything to do with this wretched circus act would be beyond embarrassing. Don't even get me started on that Sentinels business of late. It wouldn't make any sense for Emma to go anywhere near these clowns without committing mass murder. It wouldn't make any sense either for the HFC to want Emma anywhere near them.

Um, Emma and Sebastian financed Sentinel production back in the day too. In fact, the Sentinels that Fitzroy unleashed on the Hellfire Club, that killed the Hellions(and almost Jean and Emma herself), were HER OWN creations.

That's right. "Mama" Frost profited on mutant-death machines.

[Sutekh]

Wolverine is(was) a man split between feral animal and noble samurai. For most of his time as an X-Man he wrestled with his ferocity. It had undeniable efficacy, but he was also afraid of it. Emma is unapologetic and wrote off all her sadistic acts with "I was high on drinks and drugs." And that was pretty much the end of it, while continuing to be bitch.

Yeah, but Wolverine can have an epic body count, even of his own children, be a total jerk to other X-Men, even have stabbed a few (like Rachel and Jean-Paul) in the heart (one died, both got better), attack allies (even cute little Pixie!), and regularly denigrate his allies and teammates, without being considered to be a 'bitch.'

'Cause he's a dude.

Emma's not a dude, so even though she hasn't killed nearly as many people as Wolverine, hasn't attacked and tried to kill nearly as many X-Men, and has as her worst crime of the last decade or so the poor taste of sleeping with Tony Stark, and a surfeit of epic put-downs (generally handed out to people who achingly deserved them...), she gets to be called a 'bitch,' because she's a woman.

[yogaflame]

Yeah, but Wolverine can have an epic body count, even of his own children, be a total jerk to other X-Men, even have stabbed a few (like Rachel and Jean-Paul) in the heart (one died, both got better), attack allies (even cute little Pixie!), and regularly denigrate his allies and teammates, without being considered to be a 'bitch.'

'Cause he's a dude.

Emma's not a dude, so even though she hasn't killed nearly as many people as Wolverine, hasn't attacked and tried to kill nearly as many X-Men, and has as her worst crime of the last decade or so the poor taste of sleeping with Tony Stark, and a surfeit of epic put-downs (generally handed out to people who achingly deserved them...), she gets to be called a 'bitch,' because she's a woman.

Don't try this new wave feminism with me. Emma let Sebastian rape Ororo. She's a fucking bitch. She messed with Phoenix and got 5 billion sentient beings killed. I don't care how many ninjas or horribly conceived kids Wolverine hacked, it simply doesn't compare. Not to mention Logan's constantly remorseful while Emma continues to be the same materialistic snob she started off as.

[FluffyCyclopsRLZ]

Um, Emma and Sebastian financed Sentinel production back in the day too. In fact, the Sentinels that Fitzroy unleashed on the Hellfire Club, that killed the Hellions(and almost Jean and Emma herself), were HER OWN creations.

That's right. "Mama" Frost profited on mutant-death machines.

And? I specified 'Sentinels business OF LATE'.

Also, didn't Storm willingly join the Hellfire Club back in the 80s, lol?

[Gray Lensman]

I pointed that out two pages ago. Thanks for finding the pic; it's better.

But what if the ANAD writers are actually crazy/stupid enough to go for it? Will it work?


Wasn't this case won against the gun manufacturing company in the film version of "Runaway Jury"? Or was it merely Artistic License of the Law at work?

Maybe the D'Bari thing was was just "circumstances beyond anybody's control".

I believe artistic license. In the U.S. firearms manufacturers have shield laws that mean they CAN'T be sued for what people do with their stuff.

[yogaflame]

And? I specified 'Sentinels business OF LATE'.

Also, didn't Storm willingly join the Hellfire Club back in the 80s, lol?

So the Hellfire Club profiting off of Sentinels is bad now, but wasn't then?

I don't remember Storm or Magneto lobotomizing anyone, or torturing anyone, during their 'tenure'.

[Londo Bellian]

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She's also the Trope Page image for Psychic-Assisted Suicide.

Despite the fact that she is NOT listed in the list of examples for that trope. Kinda like a metaphor for her character.

[FluffyCyclopsRLZ]

So the Hellfire Club profiting off of Sentinels is bad now, but wasn't then?

Go back and read the original post. I didn't say anything about Emma being a paragon of morality. This isn't about right or wrong. This is about what Emma might do to the people responsible for recent Sentinel attacks on mutants. Maybe she'll let it slide, maybe she won't. Her recent track record seems to suggest she'd go for the latter. Violently so, to boot. If the HFC folks are smart, they wouldn't take their chances.

I don't remember Storm or Magneto lobotomizing anyone, or torturing anyone, during their 'tenure'.

Of course they didn't. That's the whole point. They didn't lobotomize/torture anyone. Emma might, though.