Proof that it isn't just the X-books getting jobbed.

[Tiamatty]

Still ranked higher than several "more important" books. (5 out of 10) It was therefore popular with the fans.

Marvel says it wants to grow a fanbase. Well you can't grow a fanbase without expanding your offerings to the fanbase. Marvel needs a much stronger B-roster. Not everything is Avengers (or, if you count their half-hearted "AvengX" books, Avengers/X-Men) related, nor should it be.

Correction: It's popular with a segment of the fan base that takes part in online polling. And actually, was that listing even from a poll? Or was it just some random Marvel.com staffer putting the list together?

Either way, it is not popular with anyone who actually buys comics. It wasn't making Marvel money, so it got cancelled. That's how things work.

[Dog]

It becomes pejorative when a significant character who is otherwise written as being successful and powerful finds themselves being written as losing out to a "bigger" or more popular character, or the needs of the narrative.

Nope to the bolded. Maybe some comic fans have hijacked the term to mean that, but in the words of George Carlin, "**** popular usage." And "significant," "powerful" characters rarely do clean jobs. If that's what you think the New Warriors did, maybe they're actually dedicated jobbers and not as "successful" as you think they are.

Stamford was a classic case of jobbing in the pejorative sense, and the continuing lack of push and development for the team and it's characters in favor of more AvengX is a clear cut case of jobbing in the meta-textual sense.

Nah. By the pro wrestling definition "doing the job" for Nitro and his gang would have resulted in a "push" for them, or at least it would have been done to make them look good. That wasn't the intent. Instead, it served as the kick-off for something totally unrelated.

[Moriarty]

i agree that Marvel needs to give us more team books than just Avengers/X-Men stuff. but you can hardly fault them for canceling a book that does not sell. right now, Avengers stuff sells. its been this way for several years now.

[Juggernaut Punch]

i agree that Marvel needs to give us more team books than just Avengers/X-Men stuff. but you can hardly fault them for canceling a book that does not sell. right now, Avengers stuff sells. its been this way for several years now.

X-Men books sell more, yet it's clear that the X-Men are being pushed aside. This does make some business sense. Properties that Marvel owns across the board, like Avengers, are in a position to be used in synergy by having them available in various forms and media. By using their most popular comic book franchise, X-Men, they can prop up other franchises that they want to promote (Inhumans, Avengers) by having them cross over with X-Men books (AvX. AXIS, Uncanny Avengers, the upcoming Inhumans/Mutant conflict, the Avengers being antagonists in a ton of post-AvX X-Books, and so on).

Honestly, at this point, it's hard to believe anyone wouldn't believe that Marvel isn't setting aside the X-Men to promote other franchises. Otherwise, they wouldn't be under utilising their most profitable franchise.

[Evan]

I bought due to Scarlet spider which was also canceled earlier

[Huntsman Spider]

I liked the basic idea posited by Yost in promoting the last New Warriors series, "Can a hero in the Marvel Universe still be a hero without being an Avenger?" I liked the idea of a group of young heroes coming together to prove that they could still be heroes without consigning themselves to being cogs in the massive machine that the Avengers had become, and say what you will about the overall quality of the book, they did save the world from a massive genocide of altered/engineered/enhanced people at the end of their run. Of course, such a thing would be too iconoclastic in this day and age where, as having been said before, Marvel = Avengers (and S.H.I.E.L.D.) and vice versa, at least for the Earthbound stories.

[THANOSRULES]

As much as I loved the original series, I think the failure of the various revivals (some good, some bad, some indifferent) over the years have been telling. The New Warriors are no longer viable. Existing fans don't want new characters and they don't want to bring the old characters back to square one after all their development over the years; new fans don't have the carryover affection for those early years to attract them to the title.

The first two or three years of the '90s New Warriors were lightning in a bottle. The right creative team with the right approach at the right time. I liked the most recent series, but it's time to let it die.



Also, what he said.

I don't drastically disagree the property is sucking bad...but still before I finally write it off....which maybe I never will, I also think giving the original roster a chance, letting them progress from more or less where they where headed circa vol. 1 IE not a group of bumblers and stumblers but a growing team of Young Adults. I mean Defenders hasnt worked for forever either, etc.. I find it really difficult to say that there is ever a reason to just throw something away.

What I see as a huge problem is Marvel keeps New Warriors as some sort of code for a group of ad hoc bumbling teen heroes, with a few familiar faces since volume 1, that's essentially what we get incarnation after incarnation. Worse, the relaunches are almost always low priority series left to more or less flap on their own.

Personally, I think the property was in a solid position to mount a good series post Avengers: The Initiative, but a run never materialized.

The only roster that ever worked was the original plus or minus the issue 25 volume 1. The last hook for one more go should be something like that...or else the New Warriors are just some name.

Personally, when I think of the NW still...i think of that original roster , the creative team and the time...

Like I said, the nostalgia is real, but its only one aspect. Its not more relevant to say, hey its time for the Avengers to get back to a roster that always worked, which the series often did in leaner times...as would defenders too.

But , as for others on this thread saying NW was "never a hit" , thats not really accurate. VOL 1 was a sales success. It was so for about 30 issues until Bageley left.

[ian0delond]

X-Men books sell more, yet it's clear that the X-Men are being pushed aside. This does make some business sense. Properties that Marvel owns across the board, like Avengers, are in a position to be used in synergy by having them available in various forms and media. By using their most popular comic book franchise, X-Men, they can prop up other franchises that they want to promote (Inhumans, Avengers) by having them cross over with X-Men books (AvX. AXIS, Uncanny Avengers, the upcoming Inhumans/Mutant conflict, the Avengers being antagonists in a ton of post-AvX X-Books, and so on).

Honestly, at this point, it's hard to believe anyone wouldn't believe that Marvel isn't setting aside the X-Men to promote other franchises. Otherwise, they wouldn't be under utilising their most profitable franchise.

They pushed the X Men how. By letting Bendis stop his terrible run, selling because the name of Bendis and XMen. They put Lemire on Extraordinary and Old Man Logan.
I mean Jeff Lemire on X Men.
They put the guy responsible for Trillium, Sweet Tooth, Essex County and Bloodshot Reborn on the X Men.

They could have just left Bendis put his name on a barely draw X Men comic and continue to sell a safly stupid amount of books each month.

[Moriarty]

nope. Marvel clearly hate X-Men. Complex! Complex!

[Evan]

I liked the basic idea posited by Yost in promoting the last New Warriors series, "Can a hero in the Marvel Universe still be a hero without being an Avenger?" I liked the idea of a group of young heroes coming together to prove that they could still be heroes without consigning themselves to being cogs in the massive machine that the Avengers had become, and say what you will about the overall quality of the book, they did save the world from a massive genocide of altered/engineered/enhanced people at the end of their run. Of course, such a thing would be too iconoclastic in this day and age where, as having been said before, Marvel = Avengers (and S.H.I.E.L.D.) and vice versa, at least for the Earthbound stories.

I guess the answer was no. and didn't the series end with Justice telling tony stark no, he wouldn't join the Avengers? Should have said yes cuz now he's in limbo.

[Evan]

Nope to the bolded. Maybe some comic fans have hijacked the term to mean that, but in the words of George Carlin, "**** popular usage." And "significant," "powerful" characters rarely do clean jobs. If that's what you think the New Warriors did, maybe they're actually dedicated jobbers and not as "successful" as you think they are.


Nah. By the pro wrestling definition "doing the job" for Nitro and his gang would have resulted in a "push" for them, or at least it would have been done to make them look good. That wasn't the intent. Instead, it served as the kick-off for something totally unrelated.

doing the job doesn't result in a "push" or serve as kickoff. 9 times out of ten jobbers remain jobbers.

[shgs]

Maybe some comic fans have hijacked the term to mean that, but in the words of George Carlin, "**** popular usage."

Well now that's silly, given that popular usage is where dictionaries derive their definitions from.

[shgs]

I guess the answer was no. and didn't the series end with Justice telling tony stark no, he wouldn't join the Avengers? Should have said yes cuz now he's in limbo.

He'd still have been in limbo, even if he'd said yes.