More news on Hercules and iceman's sexuality ?

[Inhuman X]

When you step back, distance yourself to a degree, I am not sure I would use ancient Greek Myth as an example of anything being accepted in that it really does read like a drama of the extreme with incest and patricide running rampant amongst all kinds of inflicted tortures on good folks who couldn't be allowed to win as just heroes by those in power for all the jealousy and pride and need to keep the small folks in line. Look at Prometheus. There are times I almost want to call it rebel propaganda against the ruling class. Some recent films have even taken to playing it that way too.

[ExodusCloak]

Shouldn't the Norse Gods also be bisexual or actually Omnisexual? I don't think many would be happy to see Thor sleep with a man

[ExodusCloak]

... hinted on one panel of one story about the death of Hercules.

It parallels that Sentry and Rogue scene.

[Omega Alpha]

Shouldn't the Norse Gods also be bisexual or actually Omnisexual? I don't think many would be happy to see Thor sleep with a man

Thor not so much, but Loki definitively.

It parallels that Sentry and Rogue scene.

Yeah, not really, since it wasn't supposed to be a huge revelation, nor a big love story either.

[ExodusCloak]

Thor not so much, but Loki definitively.



Yeah, not really, since it wasn't supposed to be a huge revelation, nor a big love story either.

Neither was the Rogue/Sentry scene.

[shgs]

I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many male lovers from his old myth's in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.

So easy to do, subtle enough that it would probably not even cause a controversy, and leaves plenty of room for future writers to develop further down the line if they should wish (not that Alonso's words really mean anything in an industry where continuity u-turns are so frequent they invented the word retcon to talk about them).

Am I the only one uncomfortable with this recent re-appropriation of the word "queer" to define gay characters and gay people in general?

A man who identifies as queer can be gay, but all men who identify as gay are not queer. These terms are not synonymous to my knowledge, otherwise the Q in LGBTQ is redundant.

But on-topic, I consider Hercules bi. Lets just wait for the right writer who isn't afraid to take a stand and say so.

Queer is an umbrella term for anyone who is not straight or not cis-gender, and has been used as such since the late 80s so I'd hardly call it a recent reappropriation. The Q in LGBTQ sometimes refers to 'questioning', other times it does refer to queer; in both instances it is a way of acknowledging that not everyone who isn't straight or cis-gender fits neatly into the L, G, B or T box. So you could say it is redundant, but not because it means the same thing as LGBT but because LGBT are all subsets of queer.

You're definitely not the only person who takes issue with the term, though: many oppose it because of its historical (and still not quite gone away) negative connotations, some associate it with radical or academic circles (and don't, themselves, want to be associated with them), and many straight people avoid the term because they don't want to accidentally cause offence.

So, despite the fact that that's precisely what, Darth Phoenix wrote -- I somehow read it wrong?!?

Since English has dropped the vast majority of its case system it is often ambiguous which parts of a sentence refer to what. The sentence Darth Phoenix used can be read (at least) two ways, though context makes it pretty obvious which one s/he meant.

Look at Prometheus. There are times I almost want to call it rebel propaganda against the ruling class. Some recent films have even taken to playing it that way too.

The depiction of Prometheus as a rebellious hero goes back a lot further than recent films. It was during and after the renaissance that it really took off (think of the subtitle Mary Shelley gave Frankenstein -- 'The Modern Prometheus' -- whilst her husband, in Prometheus Unbound, compared him to Milton's heroic Satan as well using him as an analogue for the French revolution).

[Joe Acro]

I can't say I'm seeing any new or exciting commentary in this article. So I think I'd hesitate to call it "more news", but instead just another opinion in the discussion.

[MindofShadow]

... hinted on one panel of one story about the death of Hercules.

its the internet... thats all it takes

[MasterOfMagnetism]

... hinted on one panel of one story about the death of Hercules.

There isn't as much room for interpretation in that "hint" as the people who don't want Herc to be bi would like to think.

And what does it even matter if it's just one panel in one story?

If there was a hypothetical character that was never shown in a relationship and made no reference to their sexuality except for one panel in one story where they say the character had sex with someone of the same gender and then later gets killed and resurrected would it be ok for them to be portrayed as straight afterwards? Would the writer, editor, whatever be able to brush it off as just one panel of one story?

[idisestablish]

So, despite the fact that that's precisely what, Darth Phoenix wrote -- I somehow read it wrong?!?

Yes, it is often possible for a sentence to have two or more interpretations. Punctuation is the tool most commonly used to combat such ambiguity, but often, the writer does not realize there is a possibility of confusion until after it has occurred. For example "We have more important documents" can mean either that there we have additional important documents or that we have some documents that are more important than others.

Original Sentence
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many male lovers from his old myth's in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.

Interpretation #1
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many-male-lovers-from-his-old-myth's-in-the-616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many male lovers from his old myth's [that occur] in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.

Interpretation #2
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many-male-lovers-from-his-old-myth's in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many male lovers from his old myth's [in the real world, and mention them] in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.

If spoken aloud, there would likely be no uncertainty, but when read, the inferred emphasis, grouping, separation, and inflection can yield different meanings, depending on the reader's interpretation.

[Omega Alpha]

There isn't as much room for interpretation in that "hint" as the people who don't want Herc to be bi would like to think.

And what does it even matter if it's just one panel in one story?

If there was a hypothetical character that was never shown in a relationship and made no reference to their sexuality except for one panel in one story where they say the character had sex with someone of the same gender and then later gets killed and resurrected would it be ok for them to be portrayed as straight afterwards? Would the writer, editor, whatever be able to brush it off as just one panel of one story?

Yeah, it's kind of like that scene in The Wire in which someone enters a gay bar and Rawls is there drinking. It's the only scene in the entire series that makes an allusion to him being gay, yet you can't deny it happened, nor that it adds to the character.

[Kieran_Frost]

... hinted on one panel of one story about the death of Hercules.

Out of curiosity, what do you think that panel is about, if not to say they had sex???

[ZNOP]

Yes, it is often possible for a sentence to have two or more interpretations. Punctuation is the tool most commonly used to combat such ambiguity, but often, the writer does not realize there is a possibility of confusion until after it has occurred. For example "We have more important documents" can mean either that there we have additional important documents or that we have some documents that are more important than others.

Original Sentence
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many male lovers from his old myth's in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.

Interpretation #1
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many-male-lovers-from-his-old-myth's-in-the-616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many male lovers from his old myth's [that occur] in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.

Interpretation #2
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many-male-lovers-from-his-old-myth's in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.
I still wish some random hero would bring up Herc's Many male lovers from his old myth's [in the real world, and mention them] in the 616 and have him shrug it off like what's the big deal.

If spoken aloud, there would likely be no uncertainty, but when read, the inferred emphasis, grouping, separation, and inflection can yield different meanings, depending on the reader's interpretation.

It's beyond me why you're still trying to convince me that Darth Phoenix's original statement can have two or more interpretations -- when Darth Phoenix has already replied to my query (some 16 post ago) and cleared up things (for me) already?

[jeanvaljean]

Pretty sure there was an issue of Incredible Hercules that shows a flashback of him grieving for his male lover who had passed away. I'll have to flip through the trades when I find the time.

[ZNOP]

Pretty sure there was an issue of Incredible Hercules that shows a flashback of him grieving for his male lover who had passed away. I'll have to flip through the trades when I find the time.

Gee, IIRC there was only 30 issues... What was the name of this Male lover or story arc then? I have Incredible Hercules I'll look for it myself.