Gwen Stacy Appreciation 2018

[Miles To Go]

The original plan was to kill off Aunt May, but Romita said that would prove problematic narratively. Considering how many people demand May's head nowadays, they weren't wrong to consider it.

[KurtW95]

The original plan was to kill off Aunt May, but Romita said that would prove problematic narratively. Considering how many people demand May's head nowadays, they weren't wrong to consider it.

I don’t see why they had to kill anybody off.

[Miles To Go]

I don’t see why they had to kill anybody off.

Even Uncle Ben?

[KurtW95]

Even Uncle Ben?

It doesn’t count if they die in their first appearance or were created to be killed off.

[AngelJD]

It doesn’t count if they die in their first appearance or were created to be killed off.

While a heavy part of Spider-man lore even Uncle Ben could be spared if written correctly. Somebody else could take his place if death is demanded or on some Alternate worlds we find a Peter whom unlike most Peters when gaining powers didn't have to have that "My God what have I done" trope to have morals knocked into him but could instead say that Peter raised lovingly and right was already placed with a high moral code thanks to Ben and May and: A: didn't go forth trying to bank on his power in that weasting match resulting in Peter and Ben being together when the robber comes along and Peter stops him (and maybe just stopping a evil that was going to happen motivates Peter alone) or B: At the wrestling match when the robber is running up to them the words of Ben play in Peter's mind and thinking not much about it stops the robber as Ben would want him too plus the robber would be no problem for Peter at all thanks to his powers.

In the Spider-Gwen series in Spider-Gwen annual issue Gwen was present with a choice to go after the robber or go to the Wrestling match hoping for fame and glory. She chose to go after the Robber resulting in Ben's life being saved and Uncle Ben body slamming the robber with glee. Gwen was in shock Ben was there and understood if she avoided the robber Ben would of been dead. Her choice highly liking motivated by her father's teachings as a good cop.

Death can be a story and character tool but also a marketing tool but also a imagination/opportunities killer. If a writer wants to use a character they have a idea for and motivated to do so it could be creatitly choking to find another writer killed them off for whatever reasons. Sometimes if a character isn't been used by a couple of writers doesn't mean come the future that another writer might show up and have a great idea for them but will NEED to be able to use them (and character coming back to life has to be done right and show long term results to positive ends to warrant it vs a one and done tale now).

Romita was motivated based on stories he read/saw I think I one time read to have characters killed off that boost sales with death (like they do even today) plus wanted Peter and MJ as the couple. Romita instead could of had Peter and Gwen dating to discover while they did care about each other and bonded in science in the end both Gwen and Peter were both agreed to the "let's just be friends" link. MJ could have her own character journey kickstarter that didn't also involve death to get her going in a direction. Writing that it seems for writers Uncle Ben's death changed Peter which we see is common for other alternative presented Peters however 616 Gwen's death changed 616 MJ however many alternate media presentations of other Gwens dying simply because '616 did it' yet no MJ growth as a result is hollow and unnecessary as if the death doesn't have a long term aftermath at least then best avoid it plus you could be killing off a character that was written well and acted well if on TV or Movie and killing one of the 'golden goose' that a writer made will resulted in some fans saying 'forget this'.

[AngelJD]

Just wanted to post a reminder that August 13, 2018 (which is today for some people reading this post as soon as it's written) on Disney XD is "Marvel Rising: Initiation" shorts that will feature "Ghost-Spider/Gwen Stacy" of that animated universe.

Just wanted to post it as it seemed to me that Disney/Marvel isn't advertising/marketing the show. Had some youtube videos but not alot and on the Channel it will be playing on I had not seen a commercial ad for it (then agian I don't normal watch that channel mostly due to that most new shows now have be transferred over to the main "Disney Channel" while many speculate that Disney XD is a dead sub-channel now.
I was wondering when the show would air not seeing any real ads and by chance upon looking up saw the release date and where.

To me this lack of marketing will ensure that the characters featured on the show will not earn any new fanbase blood as many who don't follow the comics but might watch TV will not even know of the show and various characters existence. If feels like they had ambition for the show in the beginning but then decided not to widely support and market it. Many reviewers seem favorable to the characters and show but even if the show is fantastic by everybody that finds and watches it the high numbers I feel might not be attained as most will still not know it exists. Thus wanted to make sure people knew here and reminded.

Just once more a reminder plus looking up the times it's going to be on at 7:30 pm today on Disney XD (I hope it will also be online uploaded on Youtube so that the many that don't have Disney XD or have the time during 7:30 pm will still be able to see it most of all as it's mostly 5 minutes shorts linked together).

[Digifiend]

Why does this four year old thread now have 2018 in the title? I've seen a lot of threads like that today - change them back, admins!

[KurtW95]

Why does this four year old thread now have 2018 in the title? I've seen a lot of threads like that today - change them back, admins!

Some of them are new threads (after the old threads were locked) combined with the old threads. Others are just new threads that aren’t combined with the older ones. I supposed they may have put the year on them to indicate it’s the current version. Maybe?

Though, if they are playing with these threads, like I said before, I would actually be in favor of splitting this one with one for Spider-Gwen, since this one was started before she was a thing, and the two of them are pretty different characters.

[Digifiend]

This one was never locked in the first place - I think only Miles and MJ's threads got locked in the spider section. I haven't noticed any thread mergers.

[Mike_Murdock]

If anyone is interested, the Marvel Rising show more or less starred Gwen Stacy in the first episode. I didn't like Dove Cameron when she was on Agents of SHIELD, but she was a ton of fun here. I think the show is worth checking out for her alone as long as you don't mind it being a kid's cartoon.

[Digifiend]

[AngelJD]

If anyone is interested, the Marvel Rising show more or less starred Gwen Stacy in the first episode. I didn't like Dove Cameron when she was on Agents of SHIELD, but she was a ton of fun here. I think the show is worth checking out for her alone as long as you don't mind it being a kid's cartoon.

Having just saw it it was fun and better than I expected. I like this version of Gwen and Dove did a fantastic job with her. Dove was great voicing a alternate Gwen before in Ultimate Spider-man series but was only in one episode (and i like that Gwen also plus the two Gwens personality wise were different yet Dove did a great job with both versions.

I hoped Dove would of been MCU's Gwen Stacy/Spider-Woman not only voicing her now twice but she looks like a great casting choice for Gwen Stacy but in the end in AoS (which some people was thrilled thinking that she might be Gwen Stacy/Spider-woman only to discover she wasn't) she played a different role.
Unless that character gets cloned influenced by the various clone sagas in Spider-man lore but also still a new fresh story also.

HYDRA wanting to make clone soldiers of fallen powerful or loyal HYDRA members to strengthen and add once more to their now falling ranks after losing so many members. Among the few chosen was Ruby as Ruby was a skilled fighter breeded for HYDRA in the past thus they didn't want to lose a valuable 'resource' and further tested out if they could be clones with the heroes powers. In this case Spider-man's powers.
Hiring Miles Warren after many failed attempts the one clone being successfully born after tons of failures is not treated like a person but as a tool and as a weapon. Learning about Ruby she doesn't see herself as that other girl that died whom she's clone and given life from. Learning about her just made her disgusted by her and enhanced her choice that she doesn't want to be anything like that other heartless girl whom she was made from but she hates but instead find and be her own self.

When SHIELD began a assault on the hidden lab her cell and the protocols to keep her contained were damaged and she escaped. However just as she's about to have freedom she turns back. Understanding that if she left while the data and DNA samples was out there in still in HYDRA's hands could spell doom for the world. She reenters the lab and makes sure in blocking that data from getting loose and destroys it and everything in the lab so no super clone soldiers could be made thus keeping the world safe. She also saves a Agent that came in and was about to be jumped by a few clones under orders by HYDRA that had no free will and was unstable with a short lifespan but still deadly enough. She saved the agents in the lab with her powers but by saving the agents also makes her captured by SHIELD as a result.
Many at SHIELD wanted to keep her locked away but the Agent that she saved, Agent Stacy, spoke on her behalf. Stacy was getting close to retirement but still wanting to help others and be where the action was applied in a position in the NYPD. Stacy also always wanted a daughter but was dedicated to the job that ate his time away from a personal life.
Selecting her own identity "Gwen" and changing her hair a bit with some highlights Gwen would have to prove to others and herself that she was good, her own person, and earn her freedom. In the end she proves that she's a sweet apple that fell far FAR away from the wicked tree and her own person to the other Agents including Yo Yo who hated her the most due to 'circumstances'. Stacy takes the high level job in the NYPD and adopts Gwen making her officially "Gwen Stacy". Gwen is informed to stay under the radar 'like a ghost' knowing that possible HYDRA members that known about the project could be looking for her as her DNA was still the only clue to make successful clone super soldiers into being. At first Gwen just wanted to be a normal girl...with Spider powers and subconscious killer training she was born with. But the call to help others won out and making a costume and a mask to hide her identity she became Spider-Woman (she considered 'Ghost-Spider' but it didn't work for her).

[eratas123]

I'll give Rising something. Much as I find Kevin as a character weird, mostly cause he feels like Peter with a different paint job, the relationship with Gwen felt like what the Spider-Gwen comic should have had with 65-Peter. Peter's death in the SG comics was portrayed as a tragedy but it's hampered by him not being shown with any of the supposed good things that Gwen and his family loved about him. Literally every flashback is just him being depressed, angry, sullen or jealous (or all of the above).

Imagine if Uncle Ben's flashbacks just have him being distant and cold to Peter and you see what it does to the motivation. In Rising the two are portrayed as being really sweet friends:







Spider-Gwen's comic run needed more scenes like these. Gwen had sweet moments with her dad, but the rest of her supporting cast is sorely underfocused. We have no idea why she's friends with her bandmates, especially since Mary Jane was such a self-centered jerk in the early run, or why she's so close to Ben and May apart from being friends with Peter. Here we feel Gwen's loss of her friend the same way we feel Peter's loss when Uncle Ben dies.

A couple of pages showing the characters just having fun would go a long way to show why they're close and why we the audience should care about them. The Persona series, particularly 4 and 5, did this very well by showing the characters just being friends and having fun rather than focusing exclusively on how tragic their relationships were.

[Huntsman Spider]

I'll give Rising something. Much as I find Kevin as a character weird, mostly cause he feels like Peter with a different paint job, the relationship with Gwen felt like what the Spider-Gwen comic should have had with 65-Peter. Peter's death in the SG comics was portrayed as a tragedy but it's hampered by him not being shown with any of the supposed good things that Gwen and his family loved about him. Literally every flashback is just him being depressed, angry, sullen or jealous (or all of the above).

Imagine if Uncle Ben's flashbacks just have him being distant and cold to Peter and you see what it does to the motivation. In Rising the two are portrayed as being really sweet friends:







Spider-Gwen's comic run needed more scenes like these. Gwen had sweet moments with her dad, but the rest of her supporting cast is sorely underfocused. We have no idea why she's friends with her bandmates, especially since Mary Jane was such a self-centered jerk in the early run, or why she's so close to Ben and May apart from being friends with Peter. Here we feel Gwen's loss of her friend the same way we feel Peter's loss when Uncle Ben dies.

A couple of pages showing the characters just having fun would go a long way to show why they're close and why we the audience should care about them. The Persona series, particularly 4 and 5, did this very well by showing the characters just being friends and having fun rather than focusing exclusively on how tragic their relationships were.

Actually some very good points here. Once I got past being slightly put off by Kevin taking Peter's place in Ghost Spider's backstory, I rather enjoyed his interaction with Gwen. You're right; we definitely should've had this with Peter in the comics proper, or with Gwen and her other friends and loved ones.

[Frontier]

I just appreciated an animated adaption of Spider-Gwen that actually nailed her personality from the comics, compared to the current cartoon or her appearance in Ultimate. Although the Ghost Spider name still seems so random .

I did find it amusing that Max Mittelman went from voicing Harry Osborn to a Peter Parker stand-in with Iceman's powers .