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  1. #61
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Yes, really.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    Yes, really.
    I really can't believe this. it's clear the bad consequences and you choose to ignore it. ok so

  3. #63
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    I didn't choose to ignore anything. That you're saying that just shows you didn't pay attention to anything I said. Nowhere did I argue there's not consequences. Nowhere did I argue Wonder Woman didn't overlook something that will turn out significant (in fact I don't know how many times I can acknowledge it). I'm simply pointing out the fact that with Diana's complete ignorance of the true situation that the readers are privy to, what she was told was NOT an indicator that something was seriously wrong. It was an oddity. You're actling like Wonder Woman was told that Lois Lane was seeing hovering in the air cackling that she was going to destroy the world and did nothing.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 06-07-2014 at 03:05 PM.

  4. #64
    Ultimate Member Ascended's Avatar
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    Okay, Im skipping the last page or two here, because oh my god everything boils down into this stupid nitpicking crap about how badly treated Lois Lane is.

    Overall, good issue. Pak needs to be chained to his desk and fed raw meat and gun powder and forced to write Superman eternally. Loved Steel in this, really great to see him back in action. Hell of a way to push Superman overboard too. And I loved the "fist bump" scene. Lana Lang has quickly become one of my favorite supporting cast members, and I've always been of the mind that she has no place in an adult Superman's life.

    As for Diana.....this is the DCU. Are glowing eyes really all that rare? And if you know a reporter is snooping around a place she shouldn't be, but holy crap Superman is about to become a monster that no one will ever be able to stop....where, exactly, do you put your priorities? So this reporter chick, she had psionic powers at one point and now someone is saying that other people were saying her eyes were glowing. Third party information, that has no obvious direct connection to an alien super-virus. Diana may have forgotten about it but isnt that understandable? Let's see.....virus infected god-like being on the verge of killing the entire planet. Reporter with, maybe, glowing eyes. If you're going to drop everything and go after Lois, then you've got a serious problem working out priorities. Sure, the Lois thing bears investigating but if you dont deal with Superman right now there wont be a later anyway. And calling this a "rookie mistake" or "lazy writing" is ignoring everything about the writers. How many titles is Soule writing right now, and among them how many are being critically acclaimed? Oh yeah, all of them, from She-Hulk to Red Lanterns. And Pak has been around for years and years and everything he's written with Action has been pure quality. Just because you're impatient and/or dont like a particular choice doesnt mean they are bad writers, it means you cant accept something you dont personally like. Simply put, deal with it.

    There's also no evidence that Diana can mind control soldiers. She's the god of War. She obviously knows them and can speak to them and/or their subconscious but if Wonder Woman could mentally command entire armies, do you really think that she'd allow violence to continue? Of course not, and anyone saying otherwise is just pursuing their own agenda to the exclusion of common sense. Sort of like politicians.
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  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    I didn't choose to ignore anything. That you're saying that just shows you didn't pay attention to anything I said. Nowhere did I argue there's not consequences. Nowhere did I argue Wonder Woman didn't overlook something that will turn out significant (in fact I don't know how many times I can acknowledge it). I'm simply pointing out the fact that with Diana's complete ignorance of the true situation that the readers are privy to, what she was told was NOT an indicator that something was seriously wrong. It was an oddity. You're actling like Wonder Woman was told that Lois Lane was seeing hovering in the air cackling that she was going to destroy the world and did nothing.
    WW choose to ignore lois problem. simply like that. she probably was too much focused on clark to check for Lois glowing eyes.

    As for Diana.....this is the DCU. Are glowing eyes really all that rare? And if you know a reporter is snooping around a place she shouldn't be, but holy crap Superman is about to become a monster that no one will ever be able to stop....where, exactly, do you put your priorities?
    well Clark was just missing, so because her BF was missing screw lois? At least call somebody that can help or really confront her about it. before doing a bigger crap
    Last edited by Blacksun; 06-07-2014 at 03:37 PM.

  6. #66
    Astonishing Member misslane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    No, she didn't see that something was "wrong" with Lois. She was told an odd detail about her appearance. While I've agreed since the beginning that's something that deserves further questioning, its not an automatic indication of something terribly wrong. And, to boot, Wonder Woman didn't see this, she was told it second-hand. Thus far with her own two eyes she has noticed absolutely nothing odd about Lois's behavior nor appearance. No one close to her has. S/he's really good at the subterfuge.

    Worthy of further questioning, yes. Indisputable red flag of a disaster to Lois' person and the rest of the world, hell no.
    It was worthy of further questioning. Yet, Diana proceeded as if nothing ever happened. That's the problem here. Also, not "an indication of something terribly wrong"? Excuse me, but it could have been or could not have been. I don't like that Diana apparently decided it was nothing. That would be like a dermatologist noticing a strange mole on your skin and not at least sending it to a lab to see if it is cancerous. It may be benign, or it may not. The point is to find out not let something just go without even questioning it or having someone else look into it if you're too busy forgetting that your boyfriend has an apartment he might go to to be alone.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blacksun View Post
    yes, something is wrong when a person eyes glow and she escapes the military without any explication.
    This. God, there was so much wrong with that scene Soule wrote in SM/WW #8. Diana has to use mind control powers to save Lois when Lois has mind control powers of her own. Diana isn't wearing any sort of disguise. Diana gets information about Lois having glowing eyes and treats it as if someone told her that Lois had brown hair and nothing more.

  7. #67
    Incredible Member Xarek's Avatar
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    I agree with Ascended. These discussion threads are boiling down to the same thing over and over again and get abandoned fairly quickly by those who only want to discuss the issue as a result.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blacksun View Post
    WW choose to ignore lois problem. simply like that. she probably was too much focused on clark to check for Lois glowing eyes.
    well Clark was just missing, so because her BF was missing screw lois? At least call somebody that can help or really confront her about it. before doing a bigger crap
    Blacksun, I think your points would be more relevant if they were discussed in the Superman Wonder Woman #8 thread. Or better yet, create your own thread with the topic (ie. Lois Lane & Brainiac's Mind Control - Consequences and Discussion). I think you would find plenty of people who would share your point of view and might even exchange some useful ideas and opinions.
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  8. #68
    Astonishing Member misslane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ascended View Post
    Okay, Im skipping the last page or two here, because oh my god everything boils down into this stupid nitpicking crap about how badly treated Lois Lane is.
    There's no need for straw men here. No one is arguing that everything boils down to how badly Lois Lane has been treated. First of all, the consequences of Diana's inaction do not amount to the hyperbolic "everything" you described. Secondly, this is about how badly Wonder Woman is being treated. It's a shame sloppy writing makes her look so inept.

    As for Diana.....this is the DCU. Are glowing eyes really all that rare? And if you know a reporter is snooping around a place she shouldn't be, but holy crap Superman is about to become a monster that no one will ever be able to stop....where, exactly, do you put your priorities? So this reporter chick, she had psionic powers at one point and now someone is saying that other people were saying her eyes were glowing. Third party information, that has no obvious direct connection to an alien super-virus. Diana may have forgotten about it but isnt that understandable? Let's see.....virus infected god-like being on the verge of killing the entire planet. Reporter with, maybe, glowing eyes. If you're going to drop everything and go after Lois, then you've got a serious problem working out priorities. Sure, the Lois thing bears investigating but if you dont deal with Superman right now there wont be a later anyway. And calling this a "rookie mistake" or "lazy writing" is ignoring everything about the writers. How many titles is Soule writing right now, and among them how many are being critically acclaimed? Oh yeah, all of them, from She-Hulk to Red Lanterns. And Pak has been around for years and years and everything he's written with Action has been pure quality. Just because you're impatient and/or dont like a particular choice doesnt mean they are bad writers, it means you cant accept something you dont personally like. Simply put, deal with it.
    Glowing eyes are rare in humans who normally do not possess supernatural abilities whether they belong to reporters who are snooping where they shouldn't be or not. Diana's priorities would have been exactly in the right place if she had made Superman priority number one and delegated the Lois issue to someone else. You're wrongly applying all or nothing thinking here. Wonder Woman is capable of focusing her attention on Superman while still doing due diligence on other potentially extenuating concerns. She, at the very least, should have followed up on the information with Lois herself or discussed the matter with someone who might have been able to do the bare minimum to keep an eye on Lois while Wonder Wonder was otherwise occupied.

    Good writers sometimes make mistakes, especially when it isn't a writer issue but more of a mistake I would attribute to bad editing. No one is accusing Pak or Soule of being bad writers because even good writers sometimes let a few little things slip through. I have not offered a single criticism that I have gone on to use to label an author or his entire work as poor. If you can't deal with a tiny criticism without resorting to hyperbolic generalizations and straw men, then maybe you should just learn to deal with it.

    There's also no evidence that Diana can mind control soldiers. She's the god of War. She obviously knows them and can speak to them and/or their subconscious but if Wonder Woman could mentally command entire armies, do you really think that she'd allow violence to continue? Of course not, and anyone saying otherwise is just pursuing their own agenda to the exclusion of common sense. Sort of like politicians.
    There you go again with the straw men. It has not been suggested that Wonder Woman use her God of War powers to command entire armies. What has been suggested, however, is that if she is the ultimate authority for any soldier, then her godly powers would have been better applied to a few soldiers in strategic positions following the news broadcast that named Superman an enemy of the state.
    Last edited by misslane; 06-07-2014 at 04:02 PM.

  9. #69
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    well Clark was just missing, so because her BF was missing screw lois?
    Ah, so that's what this is all about. You're trying to paint a picture that Diana is uncharacteristically focused on her "boyfriend" at the expense of everyone else. Too bad the story doesn't back this up at all.

  10. #70
    Astonishing Member misslane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    Ah, so that's what this is all about. You're trying to paint a picture that Diana is uncharacteristically focused on her "boyfriend" at the expense of everyone else. Too bad the story doesn't back this up at all.
    Actually, I think it does, especially since that seems to be the prevailing defense for her inaction in this thread (e.g. Superman was Wonder Woman's priority, so it is understandable why she put Lois on the back burner). If Diana had spoken to Bruce, Lex, or Veritas about what glowing eyes might mean before giving Lois the okay to speak to Superman (her number one priority), then I doubt the most serious events of Action Comics #32 would have happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xarek View Post
    These discussion threads are boiling down to the same thing over and over again and get abandoned fairly quickly by those who only want to discuss the issue as a result.
    What would you like to discuss about the issue? Change the subject, please. Perhaps you'd like to talk about the military's actions? Atomic Skull? What do you think is going on with the coma victims whose minds are apparently communicating with something in space (probably Brainiac)? Why was Smallville chosen of all places? What do you think made Diana want to bring Hessia into the action? Is there a difference between trusting Superman and having faith he'll get better?

    I'm not interested in much else that happened in the issue, and you'll find in many reviews of this issue a primary focus of interest and criticism is Lois Lane's Brainiac story line because it was a significant factor in this Doomed entry. I think now that her possession has led to Corben's death and the release of Doomsday, it is pertinent to examine how this situation has gotten out of hand.
    Last edited by misslane; 06-07-2014 at 04:09 PM.

  11. #71
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    No, it doesn't. The prevailing defense for her inaction is that the known threat is freaking humongous, taking all priority appropriately, regardless whether its her boyfriend or not. Superman is everyone's top priority right now, and he's not everyone else's lover too, so that falls completely flat. He's the top priority because the threat is enormous, period.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 06-07-2014 at 04:13 PM.

  12. #72
    Incredible Member Xarek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by misslane View Post
    There you go again with the straw men. It has not been suggested that Wonder Woman use her God of War powers to command entire armies. What has been suggested, however, is that if she is the ultimate authority for any soldier, then her godly powers would have been better applied to a few soldiers in strategic positions following the news broadcast that named Superman an enemy of the state.
    You mean... manipulate other soldiers to do her will just because of Superman? That would be completely out of character. And... Diana has no mind control powers full stop. She has a form of empathy transmission. Instead of having just animal empathy she has now war empathy, so to speak.
    Can I ask you how can Diana or any other character who has talked to Lois till this point, be able to detect that she was being mind control by Brainiac?
    Searching for Samus Aran. Still.

  13. #73
    Astonishing Member misslane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    No, it doesn't. Superman turning into Doomsday is the only known threat right now, and its by far the bigger threat anyway. This is about not only the only known priority at this point but also the bigger priority anyway.
    Yes, Superman is the bigger threat right now, which is why figuring out what was up with Lois before letting her see him would have been a good idea. It's top priority meets potential concern. I also don't know what part of delegating a potential problem worth further study to someone who isn't preoccupied with Superdoom is so difficult to grasp. Look, even Wonder Woman admitted that her single-mindedness is a flaw in Superman/Wonder Woman #8.

  14. #74
    Ultimate Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Not saying it wouldn't have been a good idea. Saying it was a misstep but an understandable oversight given the conditions, and one that only the most myopic of viewpoints in the writing would equate to something as small as the "he's my boyfriend so screw everyone else" interpretation, which is what Blacksun was clearly insinuating.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sacred Knight View Post
    Ah, so that's what this is all about. You're trying to paint a picture that Diana is uncharacteristically focused on her "boyfriend" at the expense of everyone else. Too bad the story doesn't back this up at all.
    Not exactly like that. But most of comics show some unhealth care from her to Superman, remember Trinity war? WW didn't learn nothing

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