Is It Weird Now That Marvel Has More Legacy Characters Than DC?

[Expletive Deleted]

While I don't dispute the premise, I'm curious if you have any numbers on this, or if it's just a general impression? DC isn't as legacy-focused as it was in the late '90s, but they're still all over the place.

[Omega Alpha]

Uhmm... the Falcon? Or am I misunderstanding you?
I have another general question also, was there this same backlash and pushback when Bucky became cap for a while?

Or was it much less because people were sure it was temporary?

There was much less backlash (very few actually) because the writing was fantastic and part of the most acclaimed run the book ever had.

[Carabas]

what about Ka-Zar, Jim Hammond & Namor who's been around forever but have'nt really had any successors?

Kevin Plunder is not actually the first Ka-Zar...

[Kusanagi]

what about Ka-Zar, Jim Hammond & Namor who's been around forever but haven't really had any successors?

Johnny Storm? Granted it's more along the lines of Alan Scott Green Lantern to Hal Jordan Green Lantern, but Johnny was a successor to the Human Torch name.

[themasething]

Both Marvel and DC is in a current habit of changing their characters to new people in old roles.

Captain America is no longer Steve Rogers
Spider-Man (to a degree) is no long Peter Parker... again.
Thor is no longer Thor (I still will debate forever and a day that you cannot strip someone of their NAME; and that Thor is a name, not a title)
Batman is no longer Bruce Wayne
Deathstroke is no longer the original Deathstroke (From what I've been reading he's been replaced by a younger clone)
Batgirl is no longer a woman, she's a high school/early collage student

Now we're adding Wolverine, Hulk, and many others to that fold. I'm not sure why they have done it or if they'll revert it. Personally, I'm having a HUGE disconnect with the comics with these new replacements in roles I grew up with. I no longer identify with the Teen/Early to mid Twenties people in general as someone in his 30s. As a lot of these "legacy" character grew older and moved into the next phase of life with me, I was drawn into their stories; but these new younger replacements... I've dropped so many of these books that I went from 20-30 books a month to 3 books a month. Change is harder for the older set to relate to, but at the same time it would be nice to see that we are still thought of by the comic companies.

[Kusanagi]

Both Marvel and DC is in a current habit of changing their characters to new people in old roles.

Captain America is no longer Steve Rogers
Spider-Man (to a degree) is no long Peter Parker... again.
Thor is no longer Thor (I still will debate forever and a day that you cannot strip someone of their NAME; and that Thor is a name, not a title)
Batman is no longer Bruce Wayne
Deathstroke is no longer the original Deathstroke (From what I've been reading he's been replaced by a younger clone)
Batgirl is no longer a woman, she's a high school/early collage student

Huh? You might need to explain this one. There are other spider characters around but Peter Parker is still starring in Amazing Spider-Man as Spider-Man.

[marvelousmetalmouse]

Huh? You might need to explain this one. There are other spider characters around but Peter Parker is still starring in Amazing Spider-Man as Spider-Man.

Pete's still around and kicking as Spider-Man but he won't be "the" Spider-Man.

[Kusanagi]

Pete's still around and kicking as Spider-Man but he won't be "the" Spider-Man.

That seems extremely nitpickey, Pete's still far and away the most recognizable Spider-Man, still has his own book, and is appearing in two others.

[HUTHAIFA]

I dont see this as legacy characters, I see it as franchise building. There is no way I think this will be the status quo 5 years from now, the toys always go back in the toy box. What I do see is Falcon,Amadeus Cho,Jane Foster, and so forth still having books or being part of major team books.

[sunofdarkchild]

Not really considering that DC has basically been 'we're the 1960s, but edgier!' for over a decade.

[skyvolt2000]

Pete's still around and kicking as Spider-Man but he won't be "the" Spider-Man.

Until there is a Miles Morales film, toys with him unmasked, shirts, lunch kits and his won tv show-Peter is still the Spider-Man.


Here is the major difference between Marvel & Dc on legacy guys.

Marvel's eventually give up that name and get a new id or go back to the old ID.

Dc guys do not.

Marvel legacies with the exception of She Hulk, X-23, Miles & Julia Carpenter don't appear outside of comics.

DC guys you do see outside of comics like John Stewart, Jaime Reyes, Jason Rusch, Tim Drake, Jason Todd, Damian Wayne, Wally West and Michael Holt (a gay version of him anyway).

Marvel legs get a solo series or mini series after giving up that mantle.

DC tend to BURY the legacy as they have the Batgirls, Jason Rusch, Jaime Reyes, Aqualad, Wally West and Conner Hawk. Superboy & Girl are also exceptions.

Marvel legs tend to stay ACTIVE in Marvel.

DC ones get buried badly and you can look at Cassandra Cain and Wally West as examples. Show me a company that would bury it's most successful female minority at BOTH companies and the only female minority to have a solo run last longer than 10 issues. Gambit, Antman and a ton of white guys don't have 70 solo issues to their name yet are still around.

Marvel will bring everyone back as soon as they think they have given enough exposure to the ones who took their place.

This is about having enough material to toss in trades and put in stores for if or when Marvel wants to try something like a solo series, movie, tv series or web series.

How many solo stories does Amadeus Cho have?

Look at War Machine-since taking over for Tony twice he has had more solo shots, minis, exposure and merchandise than a lot of other guys. That is what Marvel wants.

[dragonmp93]

Pete's still around and kicking as Spider-Man but he won't be "the" Spider-Man.

You mean "the" Spider-man "of New York", that's the only thing that Peter stops being in ANAD Marvel.

Until there is a Miles Morales film, toys with him unmasked, shirts, lunch kits and his won tv show-Peter is still the Spider-Man.


Here is the major difference between Marvel & Dc on legacy guys.

Marvel's eventually give up that name and get a new id or go back to the old ID.

Dc guys do not.

Marvel legacies with the exception of She Hulk, X-23, Miles & Julia Carpenter don't appear outside of comics.

DC guys you do see outside of comics like John Stewart, Jaime Reyes, Jason Rusch, Tim Drake, Jason Todd, Damian Wayne, Wally West and Michael Holt (a gay version of him anyway).

Marvel legs get a solo series or mini series after giving up that mantle.

DC tend to BURY the legacy as they have the Batgirls, Jason Rusch, Jaime Reyes, Aqualad, Wally West and Conner Hawk. Superboy & Girl are also exceptions.

Marvel legs tend to stay ACTIVE in Marvel.

DC ones get buried badly and you can look at Cassandra Cain and Wally West as examples. Show me a company that would bury it's most successful female minority at BOTH companies and the only female minority to have a solo run last longer than 10 issues. Gambit, Antman and a ton of white guys don't have 70 solo issues to their name yet are still around.

Marvel will bring everyone back as soon as they think they have given enough exposure to the ones who took their place.

This is about having enough material to toss in trades and put in stores for if or when Marvel wants to try something like a solo series, movie, tv series or web series.

How many solo stories does Amadeus Cho have?

Look at War Machine-since taking over for Tony twice he has had more solo shots, minis, exposure and merchandise than a lot of other guys. That is what Marvel wants.

Well, one of reasons of why the Green Lantern movie had a horrible box office was because a lot of people was confused about why Green Lantern wasnt a black guy named John Stewart.

And i think that Damian was in one of those animated Batman movies.

[Inhuman X]

You don't build diversity into your line up by replacing the original heroes with stand ins to pick up an identity forged by some one else. A comic book hero is made up of more than a power set and nifty tights with the underwear on the outside. The person in them matters. Thor isn't Jane Foster any more than Amadeus Cho will ever be the Hulk. It doesn't work long term. By implication they indicate that these people aren't interesting enough to readers to be a hero in their own right but rather can only be stomached by putting them in some old white man's boxer shorts for a Halloween pageant. If they want to diversify, fine. Create a new and original hero for people to care about. It does work. Writers are creative and come up with cool things still.

The real problem is that Marvel has been lazy looking for quick fixes to bypass the honest time and work required for some fast food satisfaction and gives up too easily. It takes lots of comics and many years of stories to build up a comic book hero from scratch into a recognizable household name and they have to be dedicated to including them. Smaller comic companies pull it off all the time. There is no easy out of the work nor instant fame no matter how badly they want a minority figure to put into the next movie. It's a real cop out and an insult to fans. You can't rightfully build a future franchise character by relying on some one else's name.

Oddly, I am reminded of Vince McMahon, the wrestling promoter, who thought he could use his trademarked names for wrestlers and put them on any old muscle head when several of his employees went to another company. The fake Diesel and Razor Roman he introduced were booed out of the company within days by the fans...

[dragonmp93]

You don't build diversity into your line up by replacing the original heroes with stand ins to pick up an identity forged by some one else. A comic book hero is made up of more than a power set and nifty tights with the underwear on the outside. The person in them matters. Thor isn't Jane Foster any more than Amadeus Cho will ever be the Hulk. It doesn't work long term. By implication they indicate that these people aren't interesting enough to readers to be a hero in their own right but rather can only be stomached by putting them in some old white man's boxer shorts for a Halloween pageant. If they want to diversify, fine. Create a new and original hero for people to care about. It does work. Writers are creative and come up with cool things still.

The real problem is that Marvel has been lazy looking for quick fixes to bypass the honest time and work required for some fast food satisfaction and gives up too easily. It takes lots of comics and many years of stories to build up a comic book hero from scratch into a recognizable household name and they have to be dedicated to including them. Smaller comic companies pull it off all the time. There is no easy out of the work nor instant fame no matter how badly they want a minority figure to put into the next movie. It's a real cop out and an insult to fans. You can't rightfully build a future franchise character by relying on some one else's name.

Oddly, I am reminded of Vince McMahon, the wrestling promoter, who thought he could use his trademarked names for wrestlers and put them on any old muscle head when several of his employees went to another company. The fake Diesel and Razor Roman he introduced were booed out of the company within days by the fans...

Well, according to the track record, that approach only works on the X-books, but given the feud with FOX, Marvel wont do that any time soon....................................

[Hypestyle]

there need to be legacy heroes created for the older, forgotten, obscure folks, especially those who were originally Golden Age characters. Where's the Phantom Reporter now?