Jamie Madrox Appreciation thread

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

Giant-Size Fantastic Four #4 (February 1975)
"Madrox the Multiple Man"
Chris Claremont/Len Wein-John Buscema/Joe Sinnott/Chic Stone

[Purplevit]

PAD need to return with noir Madrox book.

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

Hear, hear!

[AJpyro]

Is there a way to get Marvel to produce more PAD XF Ultimate Collections?

[Dupe1979]

PAD need to return with noir Madrox book.

Hear, hear!

Is there a way to get Marvel to produce more PAD XF Ultimate Collections?

I feel Jamie Madrox in particular and the faux-noir world of X-Factor Investigations in general are such ripe properties for a Film/Television or other media adaptation that Marvel right now would simply rather not remind the world, ie. (FOX) of their existence right now. As such Madrox, Guido, Banshee, Wolfsbane and Rictor are all likely to sit in limbo status for a very long time.

- Eddie Vance/Sheila Desoto
- Clay
- Singularity Investigations
- Damian Tryp
- Josef Uber
- Jaime's journey of consolidation
- the Hell on Earth War

Along with Classic X-factor concepts such as

- the Nasty Boys
- the Hell's Belles
- Rhapsody
- Val Cooper

All add up to a rich pool of material to draw from. It is a shame.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

To be fair though the reason that some of them are in limbo is because of how PAD wrote them, he reduced Rictor to being little more than his sexual orientation, he messed up Siryn and then just dropped her at the end but not before making her entire existence all about Jamie, didn't he kill Guido off or is he still king of hell and then he killed of Rhane's kid so most of those characters are in limbo for a reason, they'd all need to be fixed or get some characterization before anyone else would write them. Siryn deserves better than another X-Factor and having her pine after Jamie again, a guy that's never loved her and never will.

If anything for a new detective X-Factor it'd have to be kept small like Jamie and Layla and maybe Rictor and one other but not Siryn. And it'd take a writer that LOVED Jamie as much as PAD does, otherwise I don't see him doing much of anything except for being cannon fodder due to his powers anytime soon.

[Dupe1979]

To be fair though the reason that some of them are in limbo is because of how PAD wrote them

You are crazy.

he reduced Rictor to being little more than his sexual orientation

You mean the same Rictor who was the heart of the team because he was continuing on, trying to fight the good fight, after being devastated by losing his powers and hating himself for not being the same man he use to be.... you didn't catch any of that?

he messed up Siryn and then just dropped her at the end but not before making her entire existence all about Jamie,

Also put through an emotional wringer but by no means irredeemably broken as a character, if Magik can function as a mutant/demonic character why can't Banshee?

didn't he kill Guido off or is he still king of hell

He left him as the new ruler of Hell which was an awesome character development when Guido stepped up and stole the show. I am a little bitter that Charles Soule almost immediately rewrote that development in his Thunderbolts series putting Mephisto back in charge... a move that not only ruins Guido's entire development but also completely neuters the Hell on Earth War story arc as a whole. What Soule actually ended up doing with Guido I have no idea after he was dethroned, (that entire TB relaunch honestly seemed so ridiculous and tacky that I never actually read it... I am sure if Guido ever shows up again the entire thing will be ignored).

and then he killed of Rhane's kid

Honestly, Teir is the character you are worried about not coming back? Not Rhane?

so most of those characters are in limbo for a reason, they'd all need to be fixed or get some characterization before anyone else would write them.

Characterization is at the heart of what PAD does that is so special, he takes throwaway characters that Marvel would otherwise be totally happy to ignore, (which is the real reason these characters are all back in limbo, it is simply where Marvel feels they belong), and he breathes life into them and make people relate to them and care about them.

Siryn deserves better than another X-Factor and having her pine after Jamie again, a guy that's never loved her and never will.

Part of Jaime does love Terry though... you and I have discussed that before so I will not rehash the whole thing. They clearly are not meant to be together the way Cyclops and Jean are, as a iconic embodiment of melodramatic romanticism. But once upon a time a literal part of Jaime fell for Terry and even though that part of him does not speak for the whole of Jaime it has made him close to Terry and has made him want to do right by Terry ever since. They are not a couple, but they are connected.

And as for Terry "pining" for Jaime, for a majority of the series after the Syrin/Madrox/Monet debacle she was always just as likely to kick him in the jewels as anything else so I am not really seeing that. Yeah, love wasn't Jaime's primary motivator in his proposing to her.... but it was hardly her primary motivation in saying yes either.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

But by your logic then part of Jamie would love anyone that he met so it's not accomplishment for a small sliver of Jamie to have ever loved Terry or that it means any more than his feelings for anybody else, and Jamie prime made it clear that he had no romantic love for her at all and that hasn't changed. No I'm not worried about Tier, only saying that after PAD killed him off that Rhane might not be so quick to jump back into the fight.

People who didn't read every issue like you only know of Rictor in PAD's run because of his sexuality. Not sure how he's supposedly wanted to do right by her, most of it is him being backed into a corner and doing what he really had no choice about. The ending where it seems that she only got the new goddess powers so that she could turn Jamie back to his old form, she got all of those new powers and that's all that she did with them, and I'm not the only one that thinks that. That whole baby storyline was never about Siryn is was all about Jamie from the start. That whole storyline could be retconned out very quickly and wouldn't disrupt anything.

I don't view Siryn as a throwaway character, Rictor and Shatterstar and Jamie really yeah they fit, M obviously isn't as she's been used since and Siryn could easily be used again.

[Dupe1979]

But by your logic then part of Jamie would love anyone that he met so it's not accomplishment for a small sliver of Jamie to have ever loved Terry or that it means any more than his feelings for anybody else, and Jamie prime made it clear that he had no romantic love for her at all and that hasn't changed.

I do not think you understood what I was saying, by my logic anyone whom Jaime was already a close friend with whom one of his Dupes then had an extended romantic relationship with would always have a close connection to Jaime, (especially after he reabsorbed that Duplicate). The Duplicate Jaime was what I meant by "a literal part of him", I was not implying anyone he walks past on the street (which seems to be your interpretation).

No I'm not worried about Tier, only saying that after PAD killed him off that Rhane might not be so quick to jump back into the fight.

She doesn't have to, she's in Limbo and a relatively serene one at that with pastor John Madrox. For a writer that you implied broke all his characters and left them unusable for others, to take the last 6 issues of is run to set up personal tailored send offs for as many of his team members as possible, seems to contradict itself.

People who didn't read every issue like you only know of Rictor in PAD's run because of his sexuality.

Now earlier you said, To be fair though the reason that some of them are in limbo is because of how PAD wrote them, he reduced Rictor to being little more than his sexual orientation, but now you are saying PAD's writing damaged Rictor's character for those who did not read the series? now this does more then seems, this genuinely does contradict itself. How does someone's writing effect how those who do not read it react?

Not sure how he's supposedly wanted to do right by her, most of it is him being backed into a corner and doing what he really had no choice about.

He offered to marry her to help raise their child together.... I don't know if you have looked around at society nowadays but not a lot of accidental fathers seem to feel that's a no choice about it decision anymore.

The ending where it seems that she only got the new goddess powers so that she could turn Jamie back to his old form, she got all of those new powers and that's all that she did with them, and I'm not the only one that thinks that.

Why do you see it as only helping Jaime? The point of that scene was to allow Jaime to save Layla from Damien Tryp's one last stab at her... why do you not draw the conclusion then that her new goddess powers were only so she could keep Layla alive? I get it you feel Terry was disconnected from the series at the end and it could have worked out better for her, I can see that, however I feel more of it may have had to do with Polaris rejoining the team and their two voices maybe overlapping a bit for both of them to be involved at the same time, and their was the ANAD X-Factor launch in the works so guess which one ended up with the short straw. It is hardly Jaime's fault however and a I really fail to see where Terry was ever harmed to try to put over Madrox like you suggest.

[Complexed]

I'm excited to see Jamie return! You know someone will scoop him up at some point. He's too useful to leave untouched.

[LoganAlpha30X33]

I do not think you understood what I was saying, by my logic anyone whom Jaime was already a close friend with whom one of his Dupes then had an extended romantic relationship with would always have a close connection to Jaime, (especially after he reabsorbed that Duplicate). The Duplicate Jaime was what I meant by "a literal part of him", I was not implying anyone he walks past on the street (which seems to be your interpretation).



She doesn't have to, she's in Limbo and a relatively serene one at that with pastor John Madrox. For a writer that you implied broke all his characters and left them unusable for others, to take the last 6 issues of is run to set up personal tailored send offs for as many of his team members as possible, seems to contradict itself.



Now earlier you said, To be fair though the reason that some of them are in limbo is because of how PAD wrote them, he reduced Rictor to being little more than his sexual orientation, but now you are saying PAD's writing damaged Rictor's character for those who did not read the series? now this does more then seems, this genuinely does contradict itself. How does someone's writing effect how those who do not read it react?



He offered to marry her to help raise their child together.... I don't know if you have looked around at society nowadays but not a lot of accidental fathers seem to feel that's a no choice about it decision anymore.



Why do you see it as only helping Jaime? The point of that scene was to allow Jaime to save Layla from Damien Tryp's one last stab at her... why do you not draw the conclusion then that her new goddess powers were only so she could keep Layla alive? I get it you feel Terry was disconnected from the series at the end and it could have worked out better for her, I can see that, however I feel more of it may have had to do with Polaris rejoining the team and their two voices maybe overlapping a bit for both of them to be involved at the same time, and their was the ANAD X-Factor launch in the works so guess which one ended up with the short straw. It is hardly Jaime's fault however and a I really fail to see where Terry was ever harmed to try to put over Madrox like you suggest.

He only offered marriage because he was backed into a corner and was trying to fix things, it wouldn't have lasted. Terry's goddess powers were not about Layla but were about returning Jamie to his human form after he got changed. As for Rictor for those that didn't read the series and thus didn't get all of the particulars as you pointed out the whole series for him was really all about his sexuality, just that PAD's writing reduced Rictor to that for many. As for his dupes Jamie explained it to Terry that Jamie prime felt absolutely nothing for her in terms of romance, he said that it was like he was watching a movie of Terry and his dupe being together, any amount of love that dupe had for her was gone the second that he reabsorbed it, leaving him viewing her as nothing more than a normal friend.

Terry's storyline basically revolved around Jamie from start to finish, after he broke her heart earlier she pined after him from pretty much day one and then without anything on Jamie's part jumped at the chance to sleep with him after he really did nothing to deserve it, then the entire pregnancy storyline was never about Terry, it never involved her family or the fact that at that time any mutant pregnancy would have been HUGE, but it was kept all in X-Factor and over and done with by the end. PAD gave Terry all of those new powers and in the end she only used them to save Jamie's future wife and help him, not really anything for her. And with Jamie we know that he never would have been able to make it last and help Terry raise the kid, they'd just retcon it into him having pawned her off onto a dupe or something like that later on anyway. And with PAD being as big of a fan of Jamie as he was I doubt that he would have allowed Jamie to ever look to bad during his run.

As for Rhane a lot of writers I could see not wanting to write her because they wouldn't want to mess with the whole her having a kid, eating her father, then losing the kid and all of that storylines, and it's kind of convenient that she went off with one of Jamie's dupes that PAD wrote as pretty much perfect.

Now as for Jamie I have no problem with he and Layla living happily ever after together and having a family, I just don't want Jamie anywhere near Terry, he's only ever brought her heartbreak and pain.

[Sea Hound]

image.jpg

I really miss X-Factor. The snap, the wit, the crazy unpredictability of it all.

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

The Madrox mini-series remains the quintessential Madrox story for me.

He must be as closely associated with one writer as just about any character in the Marvel canon.

My favorite picture of Peter David, because he's rocking a Madrox/Multiple-Man t-shirt!

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

I feel Jamie Madrox in particular and the faux-noir world of X-Factor Investigations in general are such ripe properties for a Film/Television or other media adaptation that Marvel right now would simply rather not remind the world, ie. (FOX) of their existence right now. As such Madrox, Guido, Banshee, Wolfsbane and Rictor are all likely to sit in limbo status for a very long time.

- Eddie Vance/Sheila Desoto
- Clay
- Singularity Investigations
- Damian Tryp
- Josef Uber
- Jaime's journey of consolidation
- the Hell on Earth War

Along with Classic X-factor concepts such as

- the Nasty Boys
- the Hell's Belles
- Rhapsody
- Val Cooper

All add up to a rich pool of material to draw from. It is a shame.

Agreed! Wish they'd show up in LEGION

[616MarvelYear is LeapYear]

I'm excited to see Jamie return! You know someone will scoop him up at some point. He's too useful to leave untouched.

He is indeed.