Stan Fires Back At Snyder, Talks Winter Soldier In "Civil War"

[Calighoula]

Goyer has nothing to do with Suicide Squad.

[Phil Clark]

I have to say that Stan definitely hit the nail on the head. Everything in the DCCU is being based off of the look, feel and tone of the Nolan Batman films. Whereas everything in the MCU has its own look, feel and tone. You can't make every characters movies exactly the same. THAT is what leads to people becoming burnt out on Superhero films. Changing things up is what keeps things fresh and keeps people interested.

[Calighoula]

I have to say that Stan definitely hit the nail on the head. Everything in the DCCU is being based off of the look, feel and tone of the Nolan Batman films. Whereas everything in the MCU has its own look, feel and tone. You can't make every characters movies exactly the same. THAT is what leads to people becoming burnt out on Superhero films.

The tone of Suicide Squad is close to what I'd expect a filmic adaptation to look like — especially if it opens the gate for a Batman & The Outsiders-type scenario.

As for the "rest of the DCEU," I'm not sure where you got your Magic 8 Ball, but I'd like one, too. With directors like Patty Jenkins and James Wan onboard, you've no idea what their movies will be like until they're here.

Changing things up is what keeps things fresh and keeps people interested.

I agree. Please pass that on to Marvel Studios. Thanks.

[SiegePerilous02]

I have to say that Stan definitely hit the nail on the head. Everything in the DCCU is being based off of the look, feel and tone of the Nolan Batman films. Whereas everything in the MCU has its own look, feel and tone. You can't make every characters movies exactly the same. THAT is what leads to people becoming burnt out on Superhero films. Changing things up is what keeps things fresh and keeps people interested.

The Nolan Batman films had none of the comic-accurate, colorful imagery we got in the BvS trailer. Batman looks like he stepped out of the comics or the Arkham games instead of wearing SWAT gear, and there's a lot more CGI in this film due to some of the characters that are present. Beyond a serious tone, which DC heroes have never been strangers to, there is nothing to connect it to the Nolan approach.

And Wonder Woman's films are confirmed to be myth-based, with the special effects guy from the Narnia films working on it. No way in hell is it going to look like the Dark Knight trilogy.

[taylortexas]

The Nolan Batman films had none of the comic-accurate, colorful imagery we got in the BvS trailer. Batman looks like he stepped out of the comics or the Arkham games instead of wearing SWAT gear, and there's a lot more CGI in this film due to some of the characters that are present. Beyond a serious tone, which DC heroes have never been strangers to, there is nothing to connect it to the Nolan approach.

And Wonder Woman's films are confirmed to be myth-based, with the special effects guy from the Narnia films working on it. No way in hell is it going to look like the Dark Knight trilogy.

Yep. After TDKR it was apparent that the next Batman would have to counter Nolan's "realism" approach and embrace some comic book ridiculousness. Not necessarily to the same degree as Batman 66 or Schumacher's movies but a place where characters like Clayface or Poison Ivy could exist without making you roll your eyes. I think that's what we got. The inclusion of Superman alone is something that would have never happened in Nolan's world. I think this is going to be the most comic accurate Batman we've ever seen on the big screen. Easily. Will that mean it's the best interpretation we've ever seen? Arguable. But accusing it of trying to copy Nolan is silly.

[Phil Clark]

The tone of Suicide Squad is close to what I'd expect a filmic adaptation to look like — especially if it opens the gate for a Batman & The Outsiders-type scenario.

I agree. Suicide Squad should feel as if it fits in a dark and foreboding world like Nolans Bat-Films. But that look suits the concept. Superman doesn't fit in that look, which is why so many people had a problem with MoS. And have concerns about BvS.

As for the "rest of the DCEU," I'm not sure where you got your Magic 8 Ball, but I'd like one, too. With directors like Patty Jenkins and James Wan onboard, you've no idea what their movies will be like until they're here.

I have no "Magic 8 Ball", and thanks very much for trying to trivialize my opinion with a lame backhanded slap. I can only go by the evidence of my eyes on what has been done so far. And so far Wonder Woman has been designed to fit into the darker take universe. It appears Aquaman will be the same way, but that is solely based on the one picture of him we have seen so far. Their solo films could be different in look and tone... only time will tell. But so far, the DCU seems to be a Nolan inspired universe, although not a Nolan controlled one.

I agree. Please pass that on to Marvel Studios. Thanks.

Uhm, Marvel IS changing things up, thank you very much. Captain America was a classic War Movie, Winter Solider was a political thriller. Ant Man was a heist film. Guardians of the galaxy was a Sci-Fi actioner. Thor was a Sci-Fi Fantasy hybrid. Doctor Strange will be a head trippy Mystical Arts film. Each film is tailored to the individual character, and not shoehorned into the look and feel of the most popular/profitable of the marvel films. But hey, thanks for trying to be sarcastically snippy... AND FAILING!

[Hypestyle]

Things need to eventually be taken to the next level with a cross-company crossover. Dimensional travel works every time.

[taylortexas]

Things need to eventually be taken to the next level with a cross-company crossover. Dimensional travel works every time.

I was actually thinking about that the other day and whether it's something I'd get to see in my lifetime. We're still lucky to be getting Spider-Man in the Marvel universe so we're probably a long ways off. But a hypothetical Batman/Spider-Man team up movie would make somewhere between a trillion and a gazillion dollars. C'mon, people! Yachts for everyone!

[JustAnotherFan]

LoL, even the actors and directors are now part of the old as time debate of Marvel vs. DC. It's really kind of funny that this question that has divided mostly just comics fans for all these decades is now starting to divide larger audiences (and even Hollywood) as well through the movies and when you factor in that it's now Disney/Marvel vs. Warner/DC we just might have a war in our hands sooner or later. Maybe some day in the future people will talk about WWIII aka the Great Entertainment Wars.

[SiegePerilous02]

I agree. Suicide Squad should feel as if it fits in a dark and foreboding world like Nolans Bat-Films. But that look suits the concept. Superman doesn't fit in that look, which is why so many people had a problem with MoS. And have concerns about BvS.



I have no "Magic 8 Ball", and thanks very much for trying to trivialize my opinion with a lame backhanded slap. I can only go by the evidence of my eyes on what has been done so far. And so far Wonder Woman has been designed to fit into the darker take universe. It appears Aquaman will be the same way, but that is solely based on the one picture of him we have seen so far. Their solo films could be different in look and tone... only time will tell. But so far, the DCU seems to be a Nolan inspired universe, although not a Nolan controlled one.



Uhm, Marvel IS changing things up, thank you very much. Captain America was a classic War Movie, Winter Solider was a political thriller. Ant Man was a heist film. Guardians of the galaxy was a Sci-Fi actioner. Thor was a Sci-Fi Fantasy hybrid. Doctor Strange will be a head trippy Mystical Arts film. Each film is tailored to the individual character, and not shoehorned into the look and feel of the most popular/profitable of the marvel films. But hey, thanks for trying to be sarcastically snippy... AND FAILING!

There is room for debate about how "dark and foreboding" the world presented in MoS was. The film had a serious tone, but there were still bits of humor in it, and it's not like it's full blown nihilist. Superman is no stranger to darker stories either, the films putting him in these situations is not something that's come out of nowhere

What is it about Wonder Woman that looks like she's been re-designed to fit the darker universe? She's worn costumes like that and wielded swords before in the comics. She killed Decay and Deimos in her debut post-Crisis story. And even if they're basing a lot of her off of the Azzarello run, despite some of my complaints about that run, she was very much represented well as a character several times there. Aquaman's look is also based off of the Peter David run. So there's precedent for both of them to look like they do, and it has nothing to do with being reshaped to become like Batman. Not to mention that rumored characters like Ares and Circe would never show up in a Nolan film, so there's no Nolan inspiration there either.

The Marvel films all have variations in genre, but they also have the same brand of humor in all of them, and bland villains. In most cases, if you've seen one, you've seen them all. TWS is the only one to really establish a unique identity for itself, and that's why it's so highly regarded. GoTG was good, but it did seem like the Avengers in space. It had some of the same basic plot beats (alien invasion, Infinity gem, group of personalities who don't get along until they regroup and learn to work together at the halfway point).

[Phil Clark]

SiegePerilous02, you and Calighoula are obviously on the DC camp versus the Marvel camp. And nothing that I can say will sway you, so I will stop trying. You have your strong opinions, and I have mine. Lets just agree to disagree and move on.

[Doctor Know]

I never understood the criticism that MOS was "dark", "grim" or "gritty. When you look at actual dark comic book movies and compare them to MOS, there is no correlation.

Now ask yourself, what are the "darkest" comic book movies?

Batman Returns - Tim Burtons's second Batman film scared kids, and Burton seemed more interested in creating a horror film (with clowns, ugly/gross Penguin, gore) with Batman characters.

V for Vendetta - Deals with mass murder, ethnic cleansing (on homosexuals, and muslims), human testing virals, murder of children and civilians on a massive scale, a gustapo and totalitarian government.

Watchmen - Has murder (civilians, a pregnant woman, a little girl eaten by dogs, entire cities bombed), graphic violence/gore, attempted rape, and Earth being a dystopia.

The Dark Knight - Dozens of people die (innocent and guilty) by gunshots, bombings, immolation, mutilated and fed to dogs. The film also touches on terrorism, hostage taking and the good guys turning to corruption and acting immoral in order to "beat" the villain in the end.


Now, I don't think anyone would argue the aforementioned films aren't dark, grim and gritty. Now, does MOS have anything in common with films like the ones I mentioned? Tone, imagery, genre etc.


If someone is able to articulate how MOS is dark/grim/gritty, I would love to hear their argument.

[Calighoula]

SiegePerilous02, you and Calighoula are obviously on the DC camp versus the Marvel camp.

Incorrect. I like both companies. I always have. I'm tired of the "DCEU already sucks even though we haven't seen their 2016 movies" silliness which runneth rampant here and every comics web board.

[Darrell D.]

You know you could also say MOS, TDKR and a dozen other movie used the so called formula.

These are superhero movies the villain always wants to rule/kill and the hero ends up saving the day.

All super-hero movies use the basic formula, because they are, at their core, juvenile adolescent power fantasies.
The fact that grown ass men want to fetish them into something else is irrelevant.
You can make all the Michael Mann type Batman movies you want, but at the end of the day you are still making a movie about a rich guy that dresses like a bat and likes to beat up muggers.

[Calighoula]

I agree. Suicide Squad should feel as if it fits in a dark and foreboding world like Nolans Bat-Films. But that look suits the concept. Superman doesn't fit in that look, which is why so many people had a problem with MoS. And have concerns about BvS.

To argue MoS is like Nolan's films simply because we finally got a Superman who doesn't wink at the camera and spill coffee on himself in the Daily Planet is a wholly artificial argument. At the very least.

I have no "Magic 8 Ball", and thanks very much for trying to trivialize my opinion with a lame backhanded slap. I can only go by the evidence of my eyes on what has been done so far. And so far Wonder Woman has been designed to fit into the darker take universe. It appears Aquaman will be the same way, but that is solely based on the one picture of him we have seen so far. Their solo films could be different in look and tone... only time will tell. But so far, the DCU seems to be a Nolan inspired universe, although not a Nolan controlled one.

There is no evidence of Wonder Woman being "Nolanized." What we know for certain is she will be akin to a lesser god. We also know she won't have a talking tiger sidekick. Aquaman will not be a blonde Anglo-Saxon. That only means he'll more closely resemble somebody who comes from warm seas, not lands of cold ice. Your argument is a straw man.

Uhm, Marvel IS changing things up, thank you very much. Captain America was a classic War Movie, Winter Solider was a political thriller. Ant Man was a heist film. Guardians of the galaxy was a Sci-Fi actioner. Thor was a Sci-Fi Fantasy hybrid. Doctor Strange will be a head trippy Mystical Arts film. Each film is tailored to the individual character, and not shoehorned into the look and feel of the most popular/profitable of the marvel films. But hey, thanks for trying to be sarcastically snippy... AND FAILING!

Pat yourself on the back. The discussion of a consistent tone, especially where recycled story beats and one-dimensional villains are concerned, is something the MCU has been criticized for plenty. Three Iron Man movies, one Thor movie, two Avengers movies, and Ant-Man support this point pretty well.