Your DC-Only controversial opinions...

[Lorendiac]

It occurred to me that although I've participated in this thread intermittently, I don't think I've ever offered a selection of my own "Controversial Opinions" in it. Better late than never!

1. One of the worst things that ever happened to Dick Grayson was when Chuck Dixon moved him to Bludhaven and started letting him have lots of solo adventures in his own title. Because Dick ended up just coming across as, at best, "Batman Lite." ("Look at me! I run around in a corrupt cesspool of a city, but it isn't nearly as large as Gotham. I fight some weird villains, but they aren't nearly as scary as the ones in Batman's regular Rogues Gallery. I try to talk grim-and-gritty, but Batman is so much better at it. I'm good at martial arts and detective work, but not as good as Batman is. All in all, I come across as a second-rate version of the original Dark Knight.") Dick should have stuck to his strengths -- specifically, the fact that he's more more likeable as a team player in a group title than Batman (usually) is.

2. I don't care where the Justice League (any version of the Justice League) has its current headquarters; nor what they call it. (If they bother to give it a special name at all.) "The Watchtower?" "The Hall of Justice?" "The Secret Sanctuary in a cave in Happy Harbor?" "Our Satellite?" "The facility in Detroit?" "The New York Embassy?" "The Paris Embassy?" I can accept any of the above without losing a wink of sleep over it!

3. I think most of Jack Kirby's "Fourth World" stuff in the 1970s would have been significantly improved if he'd gotten someone else to script the actual dialogue (and maybe offer friendly suggestions on the plots for the characters whom Jack created in that era).

4. After he died in "A Death in the Family," the best thing Jason Todd could have done for the Batman continuity was to stay dead. Forever. (Unless the whole thing got rebooted, of course, with all previous Batman stories never having happened.)

5. The Giffen/DeMatteis version of the Justice League in the late 80s and early 90s could be very entertaining, but there was one humongous problem: It had no business being called "the Justice League." They should have used some other name for the group that included all those "Bwah-hah-hah!" moments with Booster Gold and Blue Beetle and Fire and Ice and Guy Gardner and the others.

6. The monthly title "Captain Carrot and His Amazing Zoo Crew" from the early 1980s should never have been cancelled. (Does anyone besides me even remember it? )

[Assam]

It occurred to me that although I've participated in this thread intermittently, I don't think I've ever offered a selection of my own "Controversial Opinions" in it. Better late than never!

1. One of the worst things that ever happened to Dick Grayson was when Chuck Dixon moved him to Bludhaven and started letting him have lots of solo adventures in his own title. Because Dick ended up just coming across as, at best, "Batman Lite." ("Look at me! I run around in a corrupt cesspool of a city, but it isn't nearly as large as Gotham. I fight some weird villains, but they aren't nearly as scary as the ones in Batman's regular Rogues Gallery. I try to talk grim-and-gritty, but Batman is so much better at it. I'm good at martial arts and detective work, but not as good as Batman is. All in all, I come across as a second-rate version of the original Dark Knight.") Dick should have stuck to his strengths -- specifically, the fact that he's more more likeable as a team player in a group title than Batman (usually) is.

2. I don't care where the Justice League (any version of the Justice League) has its current headquarters; nor what they call it. (If they bother to give it a special name at all.) "The Watchtower?" "The Hall of Justice?" "The Secret Sanctuary in a cave in Happy Harbor?" "Our Satellite?" "The facility in Detroit?" "The New York Embassy?" "The Paris Embassy?" I can accept any of the above without losing a wink of sleep over it!

3. I think most of Jack Kirby's "Fourth World" stuff in the 1970s would have been significantly improved if he'd gotten someone else to script the actual dialogue (and maybe offer friendly suggestions on the plots for the characters whom Jack created in that era).

4. After he died in "A Death in the Family," the best thing Jason Todd could have done for the Batman continuity was to stay dead. Forever. (Unless the whole thing got rebooted, of course, with all previous Batman stories never having happened.)

5. The Giffen/DeMatteis version of the Justice League in the late 80s and early 90s could be very entertaining, but there was one humongous problem: It had no business being called "the Justice League." They should have used some other name for the group that included all those "Bwah-hah-hah!" moments with Booster Gold and Blue Beetle and Fire and Ice and Guy Gardner and the others.

6. The monthly title "Captain Carrot and His Amazing Zoo Crew" from the early 1980s should never have been cancelled. (Does anyone besides me even remember it? )

I agree with these...except for #5. And I disagree rather strongly. Rather than explain myself why I disagree, I'm gonna let Booster do it.

booster tells it like it is.jpg

[Frontier]

Justice League Action is the best Superhero cartoon on TV right now.

[Agent Z]

Mera doesn't have magical powers her hydrokinesis ability comes from her Xebel heritage similar as Jackson only Garth in Aqua-family has the magical powers not including Arthur Trident other relics etc I think your getting confused whole Young Justcie version of Mera as for training stick by my choice having Arion be one to train Garth in his Magical abilities.

Bunn's run stated that Mera is a magician

[Assam]

Bunn's run stated that Mera is a magician

Bunn's run said a lot of things which will forever be ignored.

[Timothy Hunter]

1. One of the worst things that ever happened to Dick Grayson was when Chuck Dixon moved him to Bludhaven and started letting him have lots of solo adventures in his own title. Because Dick ended up just coming across as, at best, "Batman Lite." ("Look at me! I run around in a corrupt cesspool of a city, but it isn't nearly as large as Gotham. I fight some weird villains, but they aren't nearly as scary as the ones in Batman's regular Rogues Gallery. I try to talk grim-and-gritty, but Batman is so much better at it. I'm good at martial arts and detective work, but not as good as Batman is. All in all, I come across as a second-rate version of the original Dark Knight.") Dick should have stuck to his strengths -- specifically, the fact that he's more more likeable as a team player in a group title than Batman (usually) is.

I really dislike how Dixon set the city of Bludhaven up as being worse than Gotham, I think that's farcical because it aims to make Gotham tame by comparison in which case would be harmful to the Batman brand.

3. I think most of Jack Kirby's "Fourth World" stuff in the 1970s would have been significantly improved if he'd gotten someone else to script the actual dialogue (and maybe offer friendly suggestions on the plots for the characters whom Jack created in that era).

I disagree with you on this one. I personally think that the dialogue is the strongest aspect when it comes to Kirby's writing, it's very snappy and you could sort of see that Grant Morrison took influence from the King with his own dialogue.

[Timothy Hunter]

Justice League Action is the best Superhero cartoon on TV right now.

What other "really good" superhero cartoons are out there at this point in time that might be considered a candidate for "the best Superhero cartoon on TV right now" besides Justice League Action? I think that the quality of superhero cartoons fizzled out around the time The Mighty Avengers and Young Justice were cancelled, which is strange because animated television is at it's peak quality wise. What other good superhero cartoons are there, I haven't really been paying attention as of late, but the only contemporary Superhero cartoons that I'm aware of are that Teen Titans show, which the majority of people seem to hate, and some of those Marvel shows on the Disney channel, (Ultimate Spiderman, Avengers Assemble) which I think a large amount of people dislike as well.

[Lorendiac]

5. The Giffen/DeMatteis version of the Justice League in the late 80s and early 90s could be very entertaining, but there was one humongous problem: It had no business being called "the Justice League." They should have used some other name for the group that included all those "Bwah-hah-hah!" moments with Booster Gold and Blue Beetle and Fire and Ice and Guy Gardner and the others.

I agree with these...except for #5. And I disagree rather strongly. Rather than explain myself why I disagree, I'm gonna let Booster do it.

booster tells it like it is.jpg

Booster isn't addressing (much less contradicting) my opinion at all!

I never said the Giffen/DeMatteis League was just a bunch of useless screwups. I never said they didn't risk their lives on numerous occasions. I never said they didn't beat anybody really scary who was ready to slaughter huge numbers of civilians if he got the chance. I never said that such seasoned veterans as Batman and Martian Manhunter never developed any respect for the younger, newer heroes on the team roster of that era.

I only said that the Giffen/DeMatteis version should not have called itself "The Justice League." I didn't say what my reasons were! (Maybe I should have elaborated at the time, but I believe I wanted to finish up that post and go to bed.)

But on previous occasions I have gone into more detail on that very point. (Just not in this thread!) My feelings are pretty much as follows:

1. A real Justice League has Superman as a regular member.
2. A real Justice League has Batman as a regular member.
3. A real Justice League has Wonder Woman as a regular member.
4. A real Justice League is written in a fairly "serious" tone -- there can be jokes, humorous banter, amusing plot twists, etc., but there should be some degree of dignity overall.

Failing in any one of those areas is enough to make me think "this is not really a Justice League team title -- it's a hollow imitation." In 1989, the Giffen/DeMatteis lineup in the Justice League International failed on multiple counts: #1, #3, and #4. I enjoy rereading some of that material from time to time, but I have to keep suppressing the natural urge to wince in pain at the thought that this was what DC was peddling as a "Justice League" at the time. If the exact same scripts had been attached to a comic book called "Guardians of the Globe" or "Extreme Justice" or pretty much anything else, it all would have been fine and dandy with me!

[Ascended]

I really dislike how Dixon set the city of Bludhaven up as being worse than Gotham, I think that's farcical because it aims to make Gotham tame by comparison in which case would be harmful to the Batman brand.

Did they try to say the Haven was worse than Gotham? I remember the early issues and they marketed the city as being a sort of twisted mirror of Gotham, but not necessarily a worse one.

Like, in Gotham, the crime and corruption bubbled up from the bottom; psychos and the mob blackmailing good people at the top (like many of the cops who were forced on the take) whereas the Haven's corruption started at the top with the mayor's office and chief of police and trickled down through the political system and into the streets. It was a cesspool of a city, but I dont recall them ever trying to really sell the idea of it being a worse cesspool than Gotham, just a different kind of cesspool.

But I loved Bludhaven and those early Dixon stories so if there was mention of it being worse than Gotham (a notion I'd dislike) I'd probably force myself to forget it.

[phantom1592]

1. One of the worst things that ever happened to Dick Grayson was when Chuck Dixon moved him to Bludhaven and started letting him have lots of solo adventures in his own title. Because Dick ended up just coming across as, at best, "Batman Lite." ("Look at me! I run around in a corrupt cesspool of a city, but it isn't nearly as large as Gotham. I fight some weird villains, but they aren't nearly as scary as the ones in Batman's regular Rogues Gallery. I try to talk grim-and-gritty, but Batman is so much better at it. I'm good at martial arts and detective work, but not as good as Batman is. All in all, I come across as a second-rate version of the original Dark Knight.") Dick should have stuck to his strengths -- specifically, the fact that he's more more likeable as a team player in a group title than Batman (usually) is.

? )

I feel the exact opposite.

For me, Nightwing the BETTER Batman. He was the detective, the acrobat, the martial artist.... he had the tools and the talent.... But not that overwhelming 'Bat-God' reputation that bores me to death with late 90's+ Batman.

He was fallible. He was allowed to laugh and have friends, and then still put his life on the line to bring a city back from the brink. He rented an apartment, joined the police force... Being 'Batman-lite' humanized him in a way that Batman himself is never allowed to be. And it made him a more grounded character than being with the Titans with the green Changeling, demon daughter and dating the super-hot alien princess never did. He could actually walk into an ambush.

He's worn a lot of hats since his Robin days... but this one really seemed to fit the best. At least through Infinite Crisis... then it kind of spiraled with much of the rest of DC.

I DO think that considering the treatment of the rest of the Titans and Robins over the years... had it NOT been for Dixon and Bludhaven... I think Dick would have been killed off years ago just to keep Bruce Young.

[Stryfe8]

- i vastly preferred new52 wonder woman over the current one
- i loved superman/wonder woman
- im more then tired of the anti monitor
- final crisis blew chunks

[CRaymond]

Nearly all DC supervillain names as laughably bad.

[DGraysonWorldsGreatestSpy]

I feel the exact opposite.

For me, Nightwing the BETTER Batman. He was the detective, the acrobat, the martial artist.... he had the tools and the talent.... But not that overwhelming 'Bat-God' reputation that bores me to death with late 90's+ Batman.

He was fallible. He was allowed to laugh and have friends, and then still put his life on the line to bring a city back from the brink. He rented an apartment, joined the police force... Being 'Batman-lite' humanized him in a way that Batman himself is never allowed to be. And it made him a more grounded character than being with the Titans with the green Changeling, demon daughter and dating the super-hot alien princess never did. He could actually walk into an ambush.

He's worn a lot of hats since his Robin days... but this one really seemed to fit the best. At least through Infinite Crisis... then it kind of spiraled with much of the rest of DC.

I DO think that considering the treatment of the rest of the Titans and Robins over the years... had it NOT been for Dixon and Bludhaven... I think Dick would have been killed off years ago just to keep Bruce Young.

Eh Bludhaven was blown up and didn't return till last year, Dicks longevity since 1940 made him unkillable and that's why he survived Infinite Crisis. Bludhaven made him expendable in the eyes of DC, Morrison made him Batman which provided a classic run along with Snyder Black Mirror then the New 52 happened returning him to Nighwing where he fell to the same mediocrity until Grayson revived him, even now the international stories in this Rebirth Nightwing surpass his Bludhaven. Last but not least D.C. Butchering the Titans still does not take away NTT being the most classic run which is still strong in media

[JackDaw]

Superman should be able to fly in space faster than Flash can run.

[Old Man Ollie 1962]

I'm not the least bit interested in DC's new genderfluid superhero Dr. Endless. In fact, the very concept of "gender fluidness" is preposterous.