The LGBTQIA-community

[mojotastic]

I posted about a woman murdered by Nazis, your reply was "LOL" and a cutie picture.

I will never leave that in the past. You showed all of us who you are.

An avocado toast eater? Now that would make me an awful person.

[Tugger]

This film is being referred to as the 'British Brokeback Mountain'. I haven't seen it yet but will do so at my first opportunity.

[Silvermoth]

Sounds interesting! I want to watch that and tom of finland

[Kieran_Frost]

Today I was informed that 2 of my friends who I have known for 10+ years do not support marriage equality because "the bible says...". All the years I have known them, they knew I was gay and have never acted or made aware they had any issues with it whatsoever. So I was in complete shock when I learned this. Apparently they had mentioned it to a mutual friend after another gay couple they knew had expressed an interest in getting married. The mutual friend of course told me, with the same disbelief.

I honestly do not know if I can, or even want to, maintain a friendship with someone who believes I don't deserve the same rights as they do. I feel like I would be betraying myself, my boyfriend, and the life we have built together.

I am very conflicted because these are people I consider good friends. Hoping maybe an outsider's opinion might help me get out of this fog.

This is a difficult situation, but if I'm responding honestly: I'm sorry to say but your friends are displaying bigottry.

Now this doesn't mean they are inherently terrible people, or black in soul, or kick puppies, or should be cast out of the world, etc. Many very kind, charitable, helpful and all round nice people are nonetheless bigots. Sometimes they are aware, but mostly it is UNAWARE prejudice. And in the grand scheme of homophobia, your friend's thoughts are quite low on the spectrum/list of horrible things a bigot can do or think. But they are bigots, be under no illusion. Just don't give them a pass, because they are your friends, they should be open to being challanged when they are wrong. And if you can't talk to your friends about serious issues or important issues to you... they aren't really friends worth keeping anyway. So you'd lose little but cutting them out.

Currently they see you as less than, because of your sexuality. No other reason. You are less deserving. Less worthy. Paper and ink matters more to them than flesh and blood. And it's hard to realise that. But two things will happen: a) either you confront them, talk to them, EDUCATE THEM, and make them see that it's not "just" their opinion, but it's rooted in genuinely believeing your happiness isn't as "valid" as str8 happiness. Open their eyes to prejudice b) IF YOU DON'T TALK TO THEM this will never go away. This will never end. You'll never forget how they thought or what they felt. And it will eat away at you. And then the friendship will be truly lost.

Now again their bigotry (and it IS bigotry) is on the minor end of the scale; since they aren't lawmakers, they are just people and they cannot really stop anyone getting married on their own. And once the law is won and past, it will be insignificant that they didn't support gay marriage... but if you want them to be your friends in 5 years, you need to talk to them; because the knowledge of what they think will eat away at you.

Believe it or not, there are some people who have no other issue with homosexuals. They just can't quite wrap their heads around the idea of a man marrying another man. So we should not treat them the same way we would treat those who would execute anyone committing a homosexual act. These people are not the enemy. They can be gently brought around. It's just going to take time, because we may have to do it one person at a time.

I agree they can be brought round, and I agree it takes time.

Wasnt roman/greek homosexuality something more hedonistic? Like it didnt matter if you got pleasure from a man or a woman, what matter is the pleasure you obtain from that.

No. It's far more complex than that, YES that was ONE train of thought, by some. SOME. But like the idea put around (starting from Victorian times) that Greek men only took underage lovers, and that is the full extent of homosexuality in that time (which is a lie)... this is the same insidious deflection. SOME thought this, but same sex relationships existed between adult men, between adult warriors, and who was the top or bottom was not relevant, or less manly. Hell there was an entire gay army in Ancient Greece. All adults, all warriors, all seen as "manly men."

I just don't get gay conservatives. There's one in my country called Tim Wilson who is so excited that straight people get to decide if we can get married or not because he doesn't want to be the odd one out with his mates.
That said though I don't really get conservatives at all

Next time Kieran is here you can ask him about tue subject, he is more open of his political alligment.

I was summoned? Most gay conservatives I know (including myself) fall into the "liberal conservative" category, i.e. liberal on social values and issues, but conservative on spending, taxes, benefits, etc.

In general no group should ever be assumed to vote or think or be one specific way, it's glorified stereotyping. There are far more gay conservatives (and conservatives in general) than people realise. Now bare in mind; the UK is very liberal when it comes to LGBT+ issues. And in general all four major parties (Conservatives, Labour, SNP, LibDems) all fall around the middle on the spectrum of politics. Yes the Conservatives are right of the centre, but they're not far from the centre when compared to the rest of the world. UK politics in general is very centralist. So finding gay conservatives isn't that shocking. I mean it was under a conservative lead coalition that gay marriage past, champion by the (then) Conservative PM David Cameron and the now Conservative PM Theresa May. The head of the Scottish Conservative Party is an open lesbian. And the UK just elected into Parliament more LGBT+ MPs than any other government in the history of the world. Were a great place LGBT+ acceptance (it's not perfect, but no place is, but of places to be, it's bloody good).

Do you think this community needs role models in 'real life'?

Absolutely, every group needs positive reinforcement, and role models who are open and proud of being LGBT+ are still very much needed in this world. And I would say its incredibly important to LGBT+ people because so many still DENY the sexuality of LGBT+ icons (e.g. Shakespeare, Alexander the Great, Malcolm X). That is why it's so important our heroes are don't get str8 washed.

Who, if anyone, inspires you?

Oh, god, so many...
LIVING: Sir Ian McKellan, Ellen Degeneres, Prime Minister Xavier Bettel , RuPaul, Pedro Almodóvar, Sue Perkins and many many more.
DECEASED: Alan Turing, Marsh P. Johnson, Freddie Mercury and Bayard Rustin

Anyway i want to ask, have any of you guys/ladies being dating someone?

Married.

[Tugger]

Welcome back Kieran

[Kieran_Frost]

Welcome back Kieran

Cheers buddy. Fiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinally got a moment to myself off tour, and thought it's been a while since I trundled in to CBR. To catch-up with the two biggest things:
- I LOVE THE ICEMAN SOLO SERIES!!! It is everything I hoped it would be, wonderful character work, proudly gay, it's just giving me every kind of feel. And Daken and Iceman are so hot together, so glad he's coming back so quickly as a great foil to our hero.
- gay characters in Star Trek. I'm... hmmmm... I really like them. I had the biggest smile on my face during the scene they were confirmed a couple. It felt SO GOOD to finally see someone like me in a franchise I've loved since a kid. And the actors are good, and their characters can require some level of work to like BUT that's rewarding, and I enjoy it. And the gruff characters (when they then do something nice) makes you loved them even more. The series... errrr... I like it. I do. I don't like the swearing (even Battlestar said frak and not f*ck). And it really should be called Star Trek: Michael. Because it's the most solo driven Star Trek I've ever come across. Basically any episode where she doesn't save the day by being so much better, smarter and more talented than every crew member and enemy is my favourite (so.... episode 4, ha!). And it's a shame, she's gorgeous and a bloody good actress. But the character is waaaaaaay too Mary Sue'd by the writers. They are doing her a disservice. It's the Wesley Crusher of Discovery. I really love Doug Jones, and I knew spoilers:

Michelle Yeoh was too big to not kill, but it made me sad nonetheless

end of spoilers. And the Cadet... again, I wish writers wouldn't spend so much time trying to make a kookie character. It's not working, and she's annoying. The Neelix of Discovery (HA!). I was also spoilers:

pleased they killed off Rekha Sharma because I did NOT like her performance in Battlestar Galactica

end of spoilers.

Anything else to add... hmmmm... Steven might win Bake Off, which would be our first openly gay winner? Well... he's "open"-ish. It's not mentioned on the show, but it's certainly a known fact not hidden by the press.

[Silvermoth]

Yeah it's good to have you back Kieran.

Yeah I'm so glad the new Star Trek has gay characters. I remember bringing it up on a Star Trek forum once (why there were no out gay characters) and quite a few respondents told me in the wonderful utopian future of Star Trek homosexuality had been cured

Anyone watching the remake of Dynasty? It's actually so good! So over the top and trashy. I love it

[NewMutant]

https://www.cbr.com/iceman-7/

"Your lips are cold." is so cute.

[Charmed]

I'm always wary about the term 'Mary Sue' being used to describe a character outside of fan-fiction.

Anyone watching the remake of Dynasty? It's actually so good! So over the top and trashy. I love it

I am enjoying it! I live for shows with messy characters and story lines. Steve and Sam look good together, but I feel like the latter is playing a long con with Steven by throwing him that little party to make him feel good. I know that Sam is based off of Sammy Jo from the original series, which I never watched, but, I assume toying with the emotions of others would be right up that character's alley, would it not?

[Kieran_Frost]

Yeah it's good to have you back Kieran.

Yeah I'm so glad the new Star Trek has gay characters.

Me too. And I'm very happy it's a character I like. If it was that cadet... ugh. I'd feel cheated! HA!

I remember bringing it up on a Star Trek forum once (why there were no out gay characters) and quite a few respondents told me in the wonderful utopian future of Star Trek homosexuality had been cured

And when you bring it up, people like that ALSO cry the loudest saying "Star Trek isn't about sex" (oblivious to the entire existence of Kirk, and Riker, and the entire Ferengi race, or Worf's countless love interests -- I could go on).

I'm always wary about the term 'Mary Sue' being used to describe a character outside of fan-fiction.

I agree it can be over used (I don't use it lightly), but Michael Burnham fits the definition. I mean it's FROM STAR TREK we have that term

[PaulBullion]

I'm liking "America" (the comic book) better and better. That whole "let's cross George Perez' Wonder Woman with Love and Rockets" may still be a bit more ambitious than the writer is up to, but the issue with Hawkeye was a lot of fun.

[Charmed]

I agree it can be over used (I don't use it lightly), but Michael Burnham fits the definition. I mean it's FROM STAR TREK we have that term

Comparing Michael Burnham to one of the definitions of a Mary Sue that I found on TVTropes.org, and after watching the most recent episode, I can definitely see now why you would think she is a Mary Sue. She pretty much checks off all of the boxes. The only one she leaves empty is the one where everyone, even the really surly "I'm grumpy to others" character (can't spell his name but he's played by Anthony Rapp) likes her. Outside of the cheery cadet, who I happen to like lol, she's not really liked/loved on the ship. Those characters who don't care for her are not portrayed unsympathetically, either. However, her spoilers:

getting back the science position on the bridge just moves her closer to the label

end of spoilers, so maybe I'm just talking in circles here xD

Part of the reason I am so reluctant to label her a Mary Sue is because I find Sonequa Martin-Green so likable in the role.

---

So, for my college English class we're doing argumentative essays/research papers and I've decided to do mine on the inclusion of LGBTQ+ figures in non-collegiate history books. (Technically, we are already in them, but, unless you know intimate details about the life of Alexander the Great through other texts, you are sure as hell not going to learn them in high school)

Anyway, I'm really excited to dig into why I feel our community should be discussed outside of college courses specific to us. I just hope my instructor doesn't consider it a "controversial" moral issue because she mentioned that those are too divisive for the course. If only she knew what my first topic was going to be lol

[Silvermoth]

I try not to use the term Mary Sue anymore. It just seems pointless. Captain America is technically a Mary Sue and apparently so I Mario. Anyway who is halfway decent is apparently a Mary Sue. I would rather nice characters than always explaining why someone has to grab a gun and kill everyone

[PaulBullion]

I try not to use the term Mary Sue anymore. It just seems pointless. Captain America is technically a Mary Sue and apparently so I Mario. Anyway who is halfway decent is apparently a Mary Sue. I would rather nice characters than always explaining why someone has to grab a gun and kill everyone

Obama was a total Mary Sue in hindsight.

[PaulBullion]

Very sad that Kevin Spacey sexually assaulted a 14 year old when he was in his 20s.