Why do so many people want to take away Superman's magic weakness?

[mathew101281]

He's not a being of magic like Diana or Shazam. He really has never shown any natural proclivity towards magic like Zatanna and other magic users in the DCU ( Homo Magi I believe its called). It makes no sense for him to be invulnerable to magic. Would taking away his weakness to magic make his stories better(not really)? If the only weakness Superman had was kryptonite it would be lame and stories would get real redundant really fast. Superman is hard enough to write convincing challenges for as is. There is no need for him to be invulnerable to magic. Plus it makes no sense for him to be given his power set and the source of his powers.

[jimishim12]

Because he already defy's natural physics and basically go outside his power's established limits due to plot reasons, magic has never realy weaken him only hurt him and thats because Superman surpresses his body's superhuman efficiency to basically hold back. It's not counter productive to have the greatest superhero of all time to have mystical weaknesses since Magic is basically science in a different language.

[JBatmanFan05]

Magic is basically science in a different language.

Some write it as that. Some not.

I'm fine with the magic weakness. Like anything, it can be abused though.

[dancj]

I'm fine with it when writers get it right.

When got right, Superman is exactly as vulnerable to magic as every other character who doesn't have a specific invulnerability to magic.

[nepenthes]

When got right, Superman is exactly as vulnerable to magic as every other character who doesn't have a specific invulnerability to magic.

Nailed it. He's no more vulnerable than anyone else, it's just that he's not a wizard.

[jimishim12]

Some write it as that. Some not.

I'm fine with the magic weakness. Like anything, it can be abused though.

You can make science as relative and estoreic as Magic as well. To me, they are just different sources of fictional power to impose reality on to the story.

[Carabas]

The magic weakness is problematic because it's been played so incredibly inconsistantly over the years.

And besides, the only weakness that ever seems to really affect Superman is getting punched in the face by people in his own weight class, not these outdated silver age silver bullet weaknesses.

[manofsteel1979]

I think the push to get rid of the magic and red sun (and even Kryptonite) weaknesses is due to the perception, which is both true and not true, is that Superman seems to get unfairly nerfed or taken out way too easily for someone who is supposed to be "invincible" or "unstoppable". While there have been many times over the last 20 years where writers have missunderstood how those weaknesses work (particularly red sun stuff in the New Krypton era),I don't think It's wise to get rid of any toys in the toy box when it comes to a character like Superman...and yes, his weaknesses are indeed toys and parts of the mythos. I agree sometimes these things get used too often,but if you get rid of all of Superman's weaknesses...well, it could get boring pretty quickly. You can't always have him going up against cosmic level entities every issue or story.

What I WOULD do if I where editor is create a BIBLE establishing the "rules" and fundamentals of the Superman mythos and universe, and part of that is defining in very explicit terms how the Kryptonite, Magic and Red Sun weaknesses work and make sure every writer who writes for me read the thing from cover to cover, especially the Weakness chapter so they understand how to use those ideas properly with the understanding that if you misuse or get something wrong about the execution, you will either get notes or, if time is not on our side, I reserve the right to rewrite or omit it as i see fit UNLESS there is a good and valid reason to depart from the rule book.

[Powerboy]

His "Magic weakness" is immensely inconsistent. I think that has a lot to do with it, that and the fact that it was created, like Kryptonite, during a time when he was so much more powerful than everybody else that he had to have some glaring weaknesses. So the cause seems long since gone but the effect is still there, the weakness still exists.

[Carabas]

....I don't think It's wise to get rid of any toys in the toy box when it comes to a character like Superman...and yes, his weaknesses are indeed toys and parts of the mythos.

I don't think it is even theoretically possible to remove toys from the toybox. At best you can have a situation where the editor says you can't play with that particular toy, for now. Until somebody changes his mind about that.
At some point Supergirl, multi-coloured Kryptonite, Krypto, Superman breathing in space... were all supposedly eradicated from the toybox.

What I WOULD do if I where editor is create a BIBLE establishing the "rules" and fundamentals of the Superman mythos and universe, and part of that is defining in very explicit terms how the Kryptonite, Magic and Red Sun weaknesses work and make sure every writer who writes for me read the thing from cover to cover, especially the Weakness chapter so they understand how to use those ideas properly with the understanding that if you misuse or get something wrong about the execution, you will either get notes or, if time is not on our side, I reserve the right to rewrite or omit it as i see fit UNLESS there is a good and valid reason to depart from the rule book.

And then you transfer to another franchise, or get a better offer from Marvel, or set up your own company, and the new Superman editor goes "Nah, don't like that one bit. I'm making me a new Bible with less silver age stuff in it. It's my book now."

[Johnny Thunders!]

I just don't like a special weakness to magic, if you think about it, they all have a weakness to magic. Odin, Dr. Fate, Captain Marvel, Zatanna, magic hurts them all. I just don't like when suddenly Supermans super speed doesn't cut it but everyone else seems to work fine, or whatever. In Justice League Dark, first issue, it's raining teeth, it's a nuisance for the entire League but Superman is the only one that bleeds. If the spell is specifically anti Superman, okay, but if it doesn't slow the Elongated Man down and it's not tailor made for Supes, he should have all his tools.

[Sacred Knight]

It shouldn't go away. He shouldn't be immune. He just shouldn't be any more vulnerable to it than anyone else of a non-magical nature, is all. That was the issue I had in the past, acting like he had some sort of enhanced vulnerability to it. One, its never explained why a Kryptonian would be extra vulnerable to magic, and two, he already has that type of weakness in Kryptonite. I don't think many fans want a complete immunity though. At least I don't. That makes even less sense than an extra special weakness.

[JBatmanFan05]

He just shouldn't be any more vulnerable to it than anyone else of a non-magical nature, is all. That was the issue I had in the past, acting like he had some sort of enhanced vulnerability to it.

I think I can agree with that. I think what you mean is: His powers still count for something, some defense, like anyone else of a non-magical nature. But maybe if a spell is specfic, Superman can be affected more.

[ManSinha]

I just don't like a special weakness to magic, if you think about it, they all have a weakness to magic. Odin, Dr. Fate, Captain Marvel, Zatanna, magic hurts them all. I just don't like when suddenly Supermans super speed doesn't cut it but everyone else seems to work fine, or whatever. In Justice League Dark, first issue, it's raining teeth, it's a nuisance for the entire League but Superman is the only one that bleeds. If the spell is specifically anti Superman, okay, but if it doesn't slow the Elongated Man down and it's not tailor made for Supes, he should have all his tools.

Completely agree!

[manofsteel1979]

I agree that unless a spell is specifically for Superman, that he shouldn't be rendered useless.

I think the larger issue is writers over using the trope of nerfing Superman early on just to show everyone how serious a situation is, like the aforementioned "teeth" thing in the first issue of JL DARK. It's an effective quick hand to show the level of threat and the odds the other heroes face, however conversely when said other heroes (usualy wearing a cowl with a scalloped cape attached) find a way out of the situation as always must happen, it makes Superman look ineffectual and weak. It seems like a paradox,but it creates an impression he isn't so "super", especially as it has been done so often.

However, that isn't just or can't be blamed on magic. Red Son, Kryptonite....even stuff like whatever Super-villain of the month coming in, promptly hands Superman his "S" and then ending with the cliff hanger "OMG! Mr Genericvillainman just took out Superman!!! How do the other heroes stand a chance???".

i think it comes back to lazy writing and using easy tricks without thinking critically.