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  1. #16
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    I'm really not sure why there's any concern. Miller's books (and art, and style), while they might've contributed to the redefinition of DC in the late 80s in a big way, have always been fringe, always been hyper-stylistic, but more importantly, always been sort of a place where he can just do what he wants, tell the story he wants, and have the freedom to do it his way. That Superman drawing is just that. My favorite ever? Nah. But that's why I've always been keen on them giving him his own Dark Knight Universe to play in.

    I mean granted, there's certainly a difference between that Superman and the guy you see in DKR, you know, just keeping it in the Millerverse, but hey, not only does art get harder for older guys, but the emphasis on style and dramatic sketchiness versus a more classical portrayal changes. Shit changes, basically. Denys Cowan is often a lot looser than he was during say, The Question, but I still love everything he does, even that weird unnecessary Joker Origin retelling where Joker had too many teeth.

    I'm eager to see what he does. I'm not the world's biggest Miller fan, I find a lot of his work problematic, but it's always worth picking apart and critiquing for one reason or another. And look how rad The Atom looks!
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  2. #17
    BANNED Joker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeathFalcon182 View Post
    So many of you guys don't even realise the physical condition Frank is in. Just google Frank Miller 2014-15 and compare it to 2009-10. I like that he's enthusiastic enough to do this. Also Liefeld and Capullo defended him on social media as well.
    And yet he's been drawing this way since long before his recent illness. Family Values was where I remember the shift taking place.

    I won't defend the work as a whole, but Holy Terror is some of the best art Miller's produced in his career. That work is fucking completely fearless. As it should be, the man has earned the right to draw however he wants. Not that you have to earn that right, but to be so disrespectful to an amazing artistic talent because you don't like where's he's taken his art is ridiculous. Frank owes you nothing. It's his art, and art isn't about what you, the audience, want.

  3. #18
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    I don't think it's poorly drawn at all and I actually dig his style, it's just not how I want to see the Champion of the Opressed. I've grown so weary and tired of Superman being deconstructed, missing the whole point of the character. I get that Miller is going off of the law and order Superman of the Post-Golden Age climate, but that was such a short amount of time in the character's long history and it kind of pigeonholded him Post-Crisis due to its success.

    Lately I'm very careful with the way I approach the character. Thoughts are things, and all that jazz. I'm more interested in Golden Age strips, Maggin novels, Morrison comics, etc.

  4. #19
    Extraordinary Member t hedge coke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post
    I don't think it's poorly drawn at all and I actually dig his style, it's just not how I want to see the Champion of the Opressed. I've grown so weary and tired of Superman being deconstructed, missing the whole point of the character.
    He's also drawn Superman looking beautiful with wildlife and the sun and grass practically in adoration of him.

    We don't even know that this is Clark Kent. For all we know, so far, it's a descendant of his. A robot. (It's not going to be a robot.) Who knows.

    Let's wait for more than a cover before we worry too much of Superman being "deconstructed" (not the word you want, but w'ev) or missing the point of the character (whichever point that may be).

    The first thing we saw in Morrison's Action Comics, of Superman, was Superman taking a businessman and throwing him down several stories, catching him, hauling him up, and threatening to do it again before the police opened fire on him.
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  5. #20
    Were You There? Michael P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeathFalcon182 View Post
    So many of you guys don't even realise the physical condition Frank is in.
    I realize it; I've seen the pictures.

    I don't think that's all that's going on here, though. Like Busiek, I think this is the vision Frank Miller wanted to give us. My analysis of that vision (and here I don't know how Busiek feels, and am not attempting to speak for him in any way) isn't very kind; I think it's in line with a series of values Miller seems to hold that I find increasingly repulsive. The seeds of them were even there in Dark Knight; for all its beautiful technique, it's got some very ugly ideas. This is a procession along that same line.

    My take? Miller's just as much a master as he ever was, but his worldview just don't appeal to me anymore, if it ever did.
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  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeathFalcon182 View Post
    So many of you guys don't even realise the physical condition Frank is in. Just google Frank Miller 2014-15 and compare it to 2009-10. I like that he's enthusiastic enough to do this. Also Liefeld and Capullo defended him on social media as well.


    I read that he couldn't even speak at an event.

  7. #22
    Not a Newbie Member JBatmanFan05's Avatar
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    I can't believe those two pics....does he have some illness? What is going on? Stan Lee looks younger.
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  8. #23
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    Apparently quite the alcoholic, but he doesn't even have eyebrows in those recent pics. I'm pretty sure he was going through chemotherapy. He wasn't able to stand very long at the Sin City two premier, I think it was.

    He seems to be on the mend if he's back at the drawing table.

  9. #24
    Savior of the Universe Flash Gordon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by t hedge coke View Post
    He's also drawn Superman looking beautiful with wildlife and the sun and grass practically in adoration of him.

    We don't even know that this is Clark Kent. For all we know, so far, it's a descendant of his. A robot. (It's not going to be a robot.) Who knows.

    Let's wait for more than a cover before we worry too much of Superman being "deconstructed" (not the word you want, but w'ev) or missing the point of the character (whichever point that may be).

    The first thing we saw in Morrison's Action Comics, of Superman, was Superman taking a businessman and throwing him down several stories, catching him, hauling him up, and threatening to do it again before the police opened fire on him.
    Yeah, and that's the Superman I like. The Superman that isn't authoritarian. More a man of the people, saving lives without interest in the consequences. That's more a criticism of Miller's politics admitedly.

    I like Frank Miller'so style so of course I'll be reading this, just not so keen on his Superman. I understand where he's coming from with it, surely, just not a place I personally would visit.
    Last edited by Flash Gordon; 10-06-2015 at 01:12 PM.

  10. #25
    Astonishing Member RobinFan4880's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbgo View Post


    I read that he couldn't even speak at an event.
    That is unfathomable. The difference is so stark. I feel really bad for him.

  11. #26
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    Keep in mind that ten years at that age does start to make a pretty substantial difference, but there's clearly a serious health problem going on there. He seems to be keeping it to himself, whatever it is, but the complete lack of hair is rather telling.

  12. #27
    Fantastic Member db105's Avatar
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    I wish him the very best, if he is in bad health as that picture seems to suggest.

    Regarding the drawing, what Busiek says makes perfect sense to me. I do not like the drawing, but I do not think Miller drew him that way because he thought that's how people look like. It's his artistic choice. We can like it or not.

  13. #28
    Astonishing Member dan12456's Avatar
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    I don't get the big hoopla over this. I've personally never been a fan of Miller's art (just my personal taste) but I don't really see how this is a big departure from his previous work. It's always been heavily stylized.
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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by dan12456 View Post
    I don't get the big hoopla over this. I've personally never been a fan of Miller's art (just my personal taste) but I don't really see how this is a big departure from his previous work. It's always been heavily stylized.
    People parody everything these days whether it makes sense or not. Miller's work is very popular for internet critics to hate, and I swear I even see more people go on about TDKR, Year One, Daredevil all being overrated than I see them get praised nowadays.

  15. #30
    Invincible Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeathFalcon182 View Post
    So many of you guys don't even realise the physical condition Frank is in. Just google Frank Miller 2014-15 and compare it to 2009-10. I like that he's enthusiastic enough to do this. Also Liefeld and Capullo defended him on social media as well.
    That would account for a lot.


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