Thor Odinson Appreciation 2018

[WaxHawk]

, I mean she sees how much it hurts Odinson that he is not worthy, but she never even discusses how and why he is unworthy.

Am I an idiot and misread the issues, or is Aaron saving all of this for the future?

This is something that has clearly and deliberately been avoided by Aaron. I think it is very important and strongly suspect that we will see this conversation in the next two or three issues.

[charliehustle415]

This is something that has clearly and deliberately been avoided by Aaron. I think it is very important and strongly suspect that we will see this conversation in the next two or three issues.

I think so too, I wonder if the conversation will take place on her death bed. I wish they had a better relationship throughout the run, I mean I get that Odinson has regressed into his younger oafish self; but it would have been nice if Odinson and Jane went on a normal adventure together and not always bickering or fighting.

[juan678]

[Tofali]

Marvel Studios has kicked off its 31-day social media initiative known as "HelaWeen," named after the villainous Hela, played by Cate Blanchett, in Thor: Ragnarok. For the entire month of October, ending with Halloween/Helaween, Marvel Studios will unveil a new piece of content for Thor: Ragnarok, with this first item being a new poster that gives fans a closer look at Hela and her deer antlers/headdress thing. It remains to be seen if every piece of content unveiled this month will revolve around Hela, but it will surely be a month where we get to see more from this movie than ever before.

Source

[GreenScar1990]

Y'know what I really appreciate the most about Ragnarok?

Thor loses his hammer, but instead of wallowing in self-doubt and acting like a drunken savage demanding mead all the time, he picks himself up and forms a group of heroes ready to stop Hela and her takeover of Asgard.

It's the kind of stuff you expect from a hero and main character when they're in a leading role, which is probably why we won't be getting that with Thor in the comics anytime soon.

Sad, but very true. Thor's been mistreated for the last 3 years. And us Hulk/Banner fans have had his character mistreated for about 7 years now and killed off in a most disgusting, disrespectful manner.

Anyway, do you know what I hate the most, along with Thor's character being mistreated in the current comics? The way the writer is constantly trying to force his PC/SJW/Feminist agenda down our throats constantly. It needs to stop. Stick with telling good stories and stop trying to force your political/social agenda into everything.

I like Jane, I like her as Thor. But I do not like having a writer's agenda shoved in my face every damn issue, nor do I like characters being mistreated/thrown under the bus for the sake of such agendas.

All of the writers need to stop this. We buy comics for these reasons:

1) Solid storytelling
2) Escapism/Fun
3) Great Art
4) Great Characters

[Dolores - The Worst Poster Ever]

Anyway, do you know what I hate the most, along with Thor's character being mistreated in the current comics? The way the writer is constantly trying to force his PC/SJW/Feminist agenda down our throats constantly. It needs to stop. Stick with telling good stories and stop trying to force your political/social agenda into everything.

I like Jane, I like her as Thor. But I do not like having a writer's agenda shoved in my face every damn issue, nor do I like characters being mistreated/thrown under the bus for the sake of such agendas.

All of the writers need to stop this. We buy comics for these reasons:

1) Solid storytelling
2) Escapism/Fun
3) Great Art
4) Great Characters

I'm digging Aaron's "PC/SJW/Feminist agenda". It's part of his storytelling.

Without it, I don't see Mighty Thor maintaining it's overall level of quality, which has been great in my eyes.

I'd like if the book delved into it even deeper, but I don't see that happening.

[JKtheMac]

Just pointing out that a feminine perspective is not political correctness, can hardly be seem as a minority issue, and you don't need to be a political campaigner to espouse or write about a female taking on a traditionally masculine role. Exactly how having an overt feminist element to the story (Freyja) and having two prominent female characters (Jane and Roz) is forcing an agenda is beyond me. Stories inevitably deal with the day to day issues of our world and over half of the people in that world are women.

If the current Thor had been chosen as a male character very little of this story would have played out differently, so I don't see any evidence that this story is pushing a continual agenda. A few issues early on in the previous volume set up some of the sub-text, that's about it.

[kilderkin]

Just pointing out that a feminine perspective is not political correctness, can hardly be seem as a minority issue, and you don't need to be a political campaigner to espouse or write about a female taking on a traditionally masculine role. Exactly how having an overt feminist element to the story (Freyja) and having two prominent female characters (Jane and Roz) is forcing an agenda is beyond me. Stories inevitably deal with the day to day issues of our world and over half of the people in that world are women.

If the current Thor had been chosen as a male character very little of this story would have played out differently, so I don't see any evidence that this story is pushing a continual agenda. A few issues early on in the previous volume set up some of the sub-text, that's about it.

I do believe that the creative have placed an agenda into their work (I would argue what the agenda may actually be) in this book at present in so much as to change the status quo of its original flavour

I do think some characters, Odin especially have been written to highlight certain negative behaviours in society

I think this has been done with some skill and also some disservice to prior characterisations of some characters

whether any of this is wrong, right, good, bad whatever I suppose is up to the individual reader

it's certainly brave imo

I like Jane, especially away from mighty thor where I find her much more fun

But having strong characters of any sex or gender should never been seen as a negative, it's a big world both real and fictional with space for everyone to be happy and respected

At least it should be

[JKtheMac]

I do believe that the creative have placed an agenda into their work (I would argue what the agenda may actually be) in this book at present in so much as to change the status quo of its original flavour

I do think some characters, Odin especially have been written to highlight certain negative behaviours in society

I think this has been done with some skill and also some disservice to prior characterisations of some characters

whether any of this is wrong, right, good, bad whatever I suppose is up to the individual reader

it's certainly brave imo

I like Jane, especially away from mighty thor where I find her much more fun

But having strong characters of any sex or gender should never been seen as a negative, it's a big world both real and fictional with space for everyone to be happy and respected

At least it should be

What you are describing is a writer trying to tell a story with predefined characters that have to be slightly changed to fit that story. Fans complain about this all the time because it happens all the time. It is inevitable when writers are not using their own characters. The best they can do is try and stay within the overall range of character over the decdes, and where actual change is needed to reflect modern tastes, try and make characters equivalent and analogous to how they have been portrayed in the past.

None of that amounts to an agenda other than an agenda to entertain.

[kilderkin]

What you are describing is a writer trying to tell a story with predefined characters that have to be slightly changed to fit that story. Fans complain about this all the time because it happens all the time. It is inevitable when writers are not using their own characters. The best they can do is try and stay within the overall range of character over the decdes, and where actual change is needed to reflect modern tastes, try and make characters equivalent and analogous to how they have been portrayed in the past.

None of this is untrue and I am perfectly okay with it

In this books case I'm not happy with all those adjustments but there not bad just not all to my taste

None of that amounts to an agenda other than an agenda to entertain.

I do believe a creative may have an agenda with their work, I didn't define it because I don't know what it is, but I'm okay with there being one

I disagree that it is always just to entertain, but I'm okay with the idea of agendas because they add flavour

None of what I said was in any way a negative

if anyone saw it that way they are wrong

P's with apologies I added a line in the blue box by mistake

[JKtheMac]

I do believe a creative may have an agenda with their work, I didn't define it because I don't know what it is, but I'm okay with there being one

I disagree that it is always just to entertain, but I'm okay with the idea of agendas because they add flavour

None of what I said was in any way a negative

if anyone saw it that way they are wrong

P's with apologies I added a line in the blue box by mistake

I just don't think agenda is a good word to describe what Aaron is doing. He did have Freyja voicing a feminist concern, he is using environmental themes, he does touch on the idea of gender in mythology, he even mocked those that mocked him at one point, but nothing about this story is seeking to change societal attitudes. I have nothing against books that do that, but this just isn't one of them.

Take the argument between Freyja and Odin. That wasn't a one sided argument by any stretch. Both characters were clearly reflecting an understandable perspective, and inevitably both characters will end up reaching a compromise. Is that agenda driven?

Take Roz. She is just a woman acting as a SHIELD agent. That may be a traditionally male role, but we had a female director of SHIELD right up until recently, so it isn't pushing any boundaries.

Then we have Jane. She is being portrayed as peace loving and diplomatic but as Thor a fighter. I have no idea what agenda that would meet. Aaron's pragmatic foreign policy agenda?

[kilderkin]

I just don't think agenda is a good word to describe what Aaron is doing. He did have Freyja voicing a feminist concern, he is using environmental themes, he does touch on the idea of gender in mythology, he even mocked those that mocked him at one point, but nothing about this story is seeking to change societal attitudes. I have nothing against books that do that, but this just isn't one of them.

Take the argument between Freyja and Odin. That wasn't a one sided argument by any stretch. Both characters were clearly reflecting an understandable perspective, and inevitably both characters will end up reaching a compromise. Is that agenda driven?

Take Roz. She is just a woman acting as a SHIELD agent. That may be a traditionally male role, but we had a female director of SHIELD right up until recently, so it isn't pushing any boundaries.

Then we have Jane. She is being portrayed as peace loving and diplomatic but as Thor a fighter. I have no idea what agenda that would meet. Aaron's pragmatic foreign policy agenda?

Well u make some sound points

but I do think the creative has an agenda, I've not said what I think it is (its nothing to do with what you said but it was a sound summary I agree with)

I'm not against there being one

I'm okay to admit I could be wrong but I don't feel I am

[JKtheMac]

Well u make some sound points

but I do think the creative has an agenda, I've not said what I think it is (its nothing to do with what you said but it was a sound summary I agree with)

I'm not against there being one

I'm okay to admit I could be wrong but I don't feel I am

What I would concede is he is bringing his perspective to the book. For example he is an atheist, and so he brings a perspective of the Norse religion being a human construct. I don't really think that is controversial. There may be people claiming to worship that pantheon in the real world, but they demonstrably are not, because nobody actually knows how the Norse religion was observed, or even if their notions of deity matches our modern notions shaped by Greek thought. So saying Thor isn't actually a god wouldn't be very agenda driven. But Aaron isn't saying that, he is exploring religion and the relationship of gods and mortals, and he made the guy that wanted to kill all gods both an antagonist and demonstrably flawed in his thinking.

So yes, we might be able to demonstrate a bias against religion in this book, but that bias is deliberately reflected as an overt and nuanced exploration, with a certain amount of respect for notions of deity. I couldn't even tell Aaron was an atheist from reading the book, but I am an agnostic and broadly humanist with a small h, so I am not likely to be challenged by a bad guy that doesn't believe in prayer.

This amounts to a premise, not an agenda. An underlying meaning to the story. This story is about the relationship between deity and mortals, manifested in Jane, and asks the question 'In a world with manifest gods, how does faith work'. I suppose a sensitive religious person might feel this is asking a question that seeks to undermine faith, and so has an Atheist agenda, but I think they would be hard pressed considering it is a story about gods.

[Alpha to Omega]

I suppose a sensitive religious person might feel this is asking a question that seeks to undermine faith, and so has an Atheist agenda, but I think they would be hard pressed considering it is a story about gods.

Or they could just read the Asgard-Shi'ar War and see how utterly blatant is is with Aaron's heavy-handed, unsubtle writing. That arc is just Aaron preaching from his soapbox.

[kilderkin]

What I would concede is he is bringing his perspective to the book. For example he is an atheist, and so he brings a perspective of the Norse religion being a human construct. I don't really think that is controversial. There may be people claiming to worship that pantheon in the real world, but they demonstrably are not, because nobody actually knows how the Norse religion was observed, or even if their notions of deity matches our modern notions shaped by Greek thought. So saying Thor isn't actually a god wouldn't be very agenda driven. But Aaron isn't saying that, he is exploring religion and the relationship of gods and mortals, and he made the guy that wanted to kill all gods both an antagonist and demonstrably flawed in his thinking.

So yes, we might be able to demonstrate a bias against religion in this book, but that bias is deliberately reflected as an overt and nuanced exploration, with a certain amount of respect for notions of deity. I couldn't even tell Aaron was an atheist from reading the book, but I am an agnostic and broadly humanist with a small h, so I am not likely to be challenged by a bad guy that doesn't believe in prayer.

This amounts to a premise, not an agenda. An underlying meaning to the story. This story is about the relationship between deity and mortals, manifested in Jane, and asks the question 'In a world with manifest gods, how does faith work'. I suppose a sensitive religious person might feel this is asking a question that seeks to undermine faith, and so has an Atheist agenda, but I think they would be hard pressed considering it is a story about gods.

I'll accept your point in so far as you defining it not as an agenda

I think it is in so far as it's a constructed perspective for the story influenced by external views with an intent to demonstrate a certain perspective, and that's not necessarily a bad or good thing

premise or agenda I don't need to argue the difference coz the results the same imo

but like I said I'm ok if people disagree with me

This is only my perspective and opinions and i've been wrong before