DC Hardcover Collected Editions Part 3

[pud333]

As much as I expand my collection each pay check I get, I feel depressed that a lot of the books I want will probably go OOP before I summon the money I need.

I feel your pain. There are so many books I want, but now with the Canadian dollar plunging against the US dollar, and my LCS raising prices by 15% on the US cover price, It's back to how it was a few years ago where my money doesn't carry me as far again. Not to mention books seem to go OOP faster and faster (Maybe that's not true, but it just feels like they are). I've resigned myself to the fact that there are just some books I won't ever own, or I'll have to pay after market prices for.

[andersonh1]

As much as I expand my collection each pay check I get, I feel depressed that a lot of the books I want will probably go OOP before I summon the money I need.

Same here. Either they'll go out of print, or some of the 1940s stuff I'd like to read will never get reprinted at all.

[Raffi Ol D'Arcy]

Does the text block feel loose at all? There are many complaints on Amazon that it completely detached from the boards after a few days.

This guy made a video about it:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BesZhPeOkR4

The guy in the video also suggested to wait for a Green Lantern Omnibus Vol. 3 as Brightest Day will probably be included. DC have never included an Omnibus in another Omnibus right? I know they've "Omnibused" Absolute material and "Deluxed" Absolute material but I kind of doubt they'll further Omnibus the Brightest Day stuff but I could be wrong.

I also read all those amazon complaints, maybe it was a bad batch that amazon.com received? I preordered mine from speedyhen.co.uk when they had that pretty low price of £23. My brother should be dropping my copy off with me at the end of this month when he visits as mine was delivered to my UK address.

[The_Dark_Knight]

The guy in the video also suggested to wait for a Green Lantern Omnibus Vol. 3 as Brightest Day will probably be included. DC have never included an Omnibus in another Omnibus right? I know they've "Omnibused" Absolute material and "Deluxed" Absolute material but I kind of doubt they'll further Omnibus the Brightest Day stuff but I could be wrong.

I seriously doubt they'd collect BD in a future GL omni. Set aside the fact that it would require devoting a HUGE portion of the hypothetical GL omni to a series that has already been omni'd, BD really is only tangentially related to GL (despite the title being a nod to the GL oath). It's not at all required reading for Johns' GL run like Blackest Night is.

[TehJofus]

I seriously doubt they'd collect BD in a future GL omni. Set aside the fact that it would require devoting a HUGE portion of the hypothetical GL omni to a series that has already been omni'd, BD really is only tangentially related to GL (despite the title being a nod to the GL oath). It's not at all required reading for Johns' GL run like Blackest Night is.

This.

The Green Lantern issues that had the 'Brightest Day' banner may as well have been called 'Prelude to War of the Green Lanterns'.

[TomSlick]

The guy in the video also suggested to wait for a Green Lantern Omnibus Vol. 3 as Brightest Day will probably be included. DC have never included an Omnibus in another Omnibus right? I know they've "Omnibused" Absolute material and "Deluxed" Absolute material but I kind of doubt they'll further Omnibus the Brightest Day stuff but I could be wrong.

I also read all those amazon complaints, maybe it was a bad batch that amazon.com received? I preordered mine from speedyhen.co.uk when they had that pretty low price of £23. My brother should be dropping my copy off with me at the end of this month when he visits as mine was delivered to my UK address.

He doesn't know what he's talking about.

[alb2009]

Let's play a game. We read Snyder's Batman and whenever he takes himself too serious, writes mega dramatic dialogues or puts three (or more) speech bubbles in a row to the same character... we take a shot of alcohol!

It can be so much fun, you don't know what you're missing.

You know whose work in the Snyder Batman run doesn't get enough credit? The letterer. It takes immense patience and talent to fit such superfluous infodump essays into Capullo's beautiful panels without ruining the visual flow.

I have to say its refreshing that some people are pointing out how bad his writing is. Almost every website sings his praises ever since court of owls. Snyder can do no wrong. Black Mirror was amazing and so was the first 5-7 issues of the nu52 batman, but then I felt like his writing was a over-complicated, pseudo intellectual mess I had to slog through. Its all become so routine now. The interviews where he says hypes his storylines "this'll change everything forever/this is his ultimate, most interesting take on the character that might never be done again/this is what the character is actually "saying" to batman"! Then the historical connections, horror overtones and overused visual metaphors (with the subtlety of a giant mallet). Then the horribly constructed resolution that ultimately changes nothing. And then the reviews pour in and its almost unanimously positive. God, I hope he leaves but I know that's not happening anytime soon.

[TomSlick]

You know whose work in the Snyder Batman run doesn't get enough credit? The letterer. It takes immense patience and talent to fit such superfluous infodump essays into Capullo's beautiful panels without ruining the visual flow.

I have to say its refreshing that some people are pointing out how bad his writing is. Almost every website sings his praises ever since court of owls. Snyder can do no wrong. Black Mirror was amazing and so was the first 5-7 issues of the nu52 batman, but then I felt like his writing was a over-complicated, pseudo intellectual mess I had to slog through. Its all become so routine now. The interviews where he says hypes his storylines "this'll change everything forever/this is his ultimate, most interesting take on the character that might never be done again/this is what the character is actually "saying" to batman"! Then the historical connections, horror overtones and overused visual metaphors (with the subtlety of a giant mallet). Then the horribly constructed resolution that ultimately changes nothing. And then the reviews pour in and its almost unanimously positive. God, I hope he leaves but I know that's not happening anytime soon.

This! This right here!
The art looks good, though.

[DT Winslow]

This! This right here!
The art looks good, though.

Thanks for restoring my faith in the comic reading populace, you guys. I just don't get what people see in it. And when I read the 5 star reviews, I think, "its not possible for him to write a 5 star comic." I wonder if some people have read anything other than comics before if they find Snyder's Batman worthy of such lofty praise. Especially when they tell me how intellectually challenging they find the book. Yeah, like a fifth grade text book to an astrophysicist.

[krylox]

I feel your pain. There are so many books I want, but now with the Canadian dollar plunging against the US dollar, and my LCS raising prices by 15% on the US cover price, It's back to how it was a few years ago where my money doesn't carry me as far again. Not to mention books seem to go OOP faster and faster (Maybe that's not true, but it just feels like they are). I've resigned myself to the fact that there are just some books I won't ever own, or I'll have to pay after market prices for.

let's not talk about the euro then...

[The_Dark_Knight]

Thanks for restoring my faith in the comic reading populace, you guys. I just don't get what people see in it. And when I read the 5 star reviews, I think, "its not possible for him to write a 5 star comic." I wonder if some people have read anything other than comics before if they find Snyder's Batman worthy of such lofty praise. Especially when they tell me how intellectually challenging they find the book. Yeah, like a fifth grade text book to an astrophysicist.

Please don't take any of the following as an attempt to invalidate your opinion and the opinion of those who agree, but I felt compelled to present a response / rebuttal to the Snyder criticism that has popped up with a vengeance recently. (And DonWinslow, this isn't a direct response to you specifically [for the most part], but to all who have contributed to this discussion recently. Yours is just the most recent entry which is why I quoted you.)

First, it seems to me that a negative backlash is almost inevitable when dealing with a run as hugely popular as Snyder's Bat-run has proved to be. Throughout the history of entertainment media it seems a universal truth that when the popularity of something reaches a critical mass, a wave of negative backlash is soon to follow. Again, not saying that negative opinions of Snyder are invalidated by this phenomenon, but I did think it was worth noting.

Second, I have to say I bristle at your suggestion that only those readers who exclusively read comics could find Snyder's writing intellectually stimulating. It implies that somehow the medium of comics is incapable of presenting thoughts and ideas as intellectually stimulating as the thoughts and ideas presented in any other media. It's the artist, not the medium, which contributes to the positive or negative attributes of any work of art. Now, you can certainly argue that there are those who work in comics who fail to convey intellectual ideas, but the same could of course be said for the artists in any media. The super-hero comic is just as capable of being smart, incisive, and challenging as any other type of fiction found in any other media.

Third, I think we're unfairly criticizing Snyder by comparing his work to his statements given in interviews. Sure, he often says that whatever story he's writing is his "ultimate" vision of this character or something that will change the mythos, but I can think of no writer who doesn't heavily imply these lofty ambitions when talking about an upcoming project. Surely we shouldn't be surprised or disappointed that Snyder's stories haven't dramatically changed the Bat-mythos because we know that change in mainstream super-hero comics is necessarily illusory.

Finally, I agree that Snyder over-relies on some narrative devices, but it seems to me to be quite a stretch to label his writing as "bad." We often confront this issue in any discussion about things we're passionate about where something is either "Amazing, the greatest thing ever," or it's "Bad, awful, terrible." Both extremes seem to be equally useless when attempting to engage in true critical analysis of a work. Yes, Snyder has certain pitfalls as a writer, but they're balanced by great strengths too. He has a wonderful gift for atmosphere and location. I've been reading Batman for 30 years and I can think of few writers who have mined more narrative minerals out of Gotham City as a location than Scott Snyder. It reminds me of Alan Moore's treatment of London in From Hell. It's unique and it's additive to the narrative. I also think the man has a gift for character. In many of his arcs the climax is something more character-related rather than plot-related (see the oft-maligned ending of Death of the Family). I also think he's given us the best new Bat-villain in years in his invention of James Gordon, Jr (though it was Simone who had the most fun with him in N52).

Again, all those who disagree with my opinion have perfectly valid points, but I wanted to weigh in in Snyder's defense as the conversation seems to have gotten a little one-sided against him.

[victorxd1999]

Not to going to engage in a big discussion here but I actually think a lot of other writers did better work with the City itself then Snyder. Milligan's work for example.

[billabonghotrod]

Court of Owls/ City of Owls and Death in the Family are in my top 10 batman stories. Zero Year was good but not great. I'm about to start catching up on Endgame today.

[drd]

Third, I think we're unfairly criticizing Snyder by comparing his work to his statements given in interviews. Sure, he often says that whatever story he's writing is his "ultimate" vision of this character or something that will change the mythos, but I can think of no writer who doesn't heavily imply these lofty ambitions when talking about an upcoming project. Surely we shouldn't be surprised or disappointed that Snyder's stories haven't dramatically changed the Bat-mythos because we know that change in mainstream super-hero comics is necessarily illusory.

Just providing a couple of Snyder quotes from interviews I remember here to kind of back this up.

In terms of identifying with Bruce and that stuff, it’s the only way to do it. The only way to write Batman, if you get the chance — and I hope everyone out there gets the chance — is to imagine you made him up. And that’s what Grant did, I promise you, by saying “I have a birth and a death for Batman.” Grant’s Batman is his creator-owned character. Frank Miller’s Batman is Frank Miller’s creator-owned Batman. It bears little relation to Grant’s Batman, which bears little relation to my Batman. They coexist, and it’s great that they can coexist, but until you write him like you made him up, and you have your own origin and your own death, even if you accept the origin from someone else’s book, with your version’s obsessions and vulnerabilities, you’re going to be intimidated. You’re always going to be writing him like it’s derivative from someone else.

http://comicsalliance.com/scott-snyd...city-part-two/

I feel like you have to approach characters like the Joker, the Riddler or Batman like, if I only got one chance to write this character, this is the story I would do.

It is meant to be my definitive Joker story, for me personally, but the irony is that while I was getting to #17, I had another idea for another Joker story. Hopefully I’ll get to use him again, and then I’ll be saying that again at that point, too.

http://comicsalliance.com/batman-sco...ckback=tsmclip


I've kept out of the Snyder hate thats gone on in the last few pages but as someone has spoken up in his defense I'll add my voice to the mix.

I suppose I'm a Snyder apologist for want of a better word, I tremendously enjoy his Batman work, I thought the Wake was bloody fantastic and Swamp Thing was excellent but mired by an atrocious fill in artist for the concluding issue of Rotworld (which itself probably went on a bit to long, but I'll throw a speculatory accusation of editorial mandated crossover as the reason for that) although its now been overshadowed by Soules marvelous work.

Yes his third acts tend to be on the weak side but the first two acts tend to be so strong that its almost inevitable that you'll be disappointment.

Different strokes for different folk, I will continue to buy and enjoy his work if others are no longer enjoying it then thats cool as well.

Anyway to get back on topic, I'd love an Absolute The Wake in a couple years, Sean Murphys art was just gorgeous and I want it bigger, BIGGER!.

[JohnHorus]

Please don't take any of the following as an attempt to invalidate your opinion and the opinion of those who agree, but I felt compelled to present a response / rebuttal to the Snyder criticism that has popped up with a vengeance recently. (And DonWinslow, this isn't a direct response to you specifically [for the most part], but to all who have contributed to this discussion recently. Yours is just the most recent entry which is why I quoted you.)

First, it seems to me that a negative backlash is almost inevitable when dealing with a run as hugely popular as Snyder's Bat-run has proved to be. Throughout the history of entertainment media it seems a universal truth that when the popularity of something reaches a critical mass, a wave of negative backlash is soon to follow. Again, not saying that negative opinions of Snyder are invalidated by this phenomenon, but I did think it was worth noting.

Second, I have to say I bristle at your suggestion that only those readers who exclusively read comics could find Snyder's writing intellectually stimulating. It implies that somehow the medium of comics is incapable of presenting thoughts and ideas as intellectually stimulating as the thoughts and ideas presented in any other media. It's the artist, not the medium, which contributes to the positive or negative attributes of any work of art. Now, you can certainly argue that there are those who work in comics who fail to convey intellectual ideas, but the same could of course be said for the artists in any media. The super-hero comic is just as capable of being smart, incisive, and challenging as any other type of fiction found in any other media.

Third, I think we're unfairly criticizing Snyder by comparing his work to his statements given in interviews. Sure, he often says that whatever story he's writing is his "ultimate" vision of this character or something that will change the mythos, but I can think of no writer who doesn't heavily imply these lofty ambitions when talking about an upcoming project. Surely we shouldn't be surprised or disappointed that Snyder's stories haven't dramatically changed the Bat-mythos because we know that change in mainstream super-hero comics is necessarily illusory.

Finally, I agree that Snyder over-relies on some narrative devices, but it seems to me to be quite a stretch to label his writing as "bad." We often confront this issue in any discussion about things we're passionate about where something is either "Amazing, the greatest thing ever," or it's "Bad, awful, terrible." Both extremes seem to be equally useless when attempting to engage in true critical analysis of a work. Yes, Snyder has certain pitfalls as a writer, but they're balanced by great strengths too. He has a wonderful gift for atmosphere and location. I've been reading Batman for 30 years and I can think of few writers who have mined more narrative minerals out of Gotham City as a location than Scott Snyder. It reminds me of Alan Moore's treatment of London in From Hell. It's unique and it's additive to the narrative. I also think the man has a gift for character. In many of his arcs the climax is something more character-related rather than plot-related (see the oft-maligned ending of Death of the Family). I also think he's given us the best new Bat-villain in years in his invention of James Gordon, Jr (though it was Simone who had the most fun with him in N52).

Again, all those who disagree with my opinion have perfectly valid points, but I wanted to weigh in in Snyder's defense as the conversation seems to have gotten a little one-sided against him.

Well, I've also been reading Batman for 30 years and I think that, in the end, it all boils down to a matter of personal taste. And being able to bear his infodumps.

Personally, I really enjoyed DotF and I'm having a lot of fun with Endgame (I'll wait until this one ends to see if the Joker revelation sticks or doesn't). But I totally hated the Court of Owls (just re read it and you'll realize it was the worst secret society ever, not controlling drug trafficking, nor prostitution, street crime, politicians or the police) and Pink Year because, and this is a very personal opinion, I don't think lions, robots, bone-monsters and giant games of Jeopardy belong to a Batman origin story. Nor does the color pink.

Story-wise, I think he mostly fails at introducing new characters. Instead of doing it little by little, he just dedicates an entire issue to a character we haven't seen in half a year. For example, Harper Row. After her appearance in #6, she disappeared until #12, which was solely dedicated to her... and then the same thing happened with #18. And now he's doing something similar with Duke... And dude, we haven't since Lincoln since #11... not even a glimpse...

Then again, some people won't probably be bothered by this. I don't think he's a bad writer, but he's definitely not the Batgod everyone is saying he is.

Besides, I believe Tomasi is kicking his ass. Even though his run obviously has had its ups and downs, Robin Rises was amazing. That's how you mix sci-fi and supernatural elements with Batman. And the silent issue was my story issue in a really long long time. I just find the idea of Batman being a dad and incredibly fresh one that hasn't worn off for me yet.