Pre-Crisis Karate Kid vs Bills

[Pendaran]

basically the virus was actually sentient and due to val's superior 31st century immune system, it was way too strong for modern DC medical tech to even come close to curing.

It was also of itself infectious to the point of fucking over Superman and the like.

[master of read]

It was also of itself infectious to the point of fucking over Superman and the like.

and hal spread it to the rest of the universe but the ring didnt seem to tell him he was infected with this evil super virus.




god, countdown sucked.

[Surtur]

I'm moderately certain his actual name was Sensei and that he was varying degrees of unfortunate stereotype

This man is the most dangerous person in the DCU.

[Tramp Stampede]

So does Bills even have an AoE to speak of, or are we just spotting it to him because he's a DBZ character? Because that seems a little shaky.

I know he blew up planets by flying through them, but those planets in particular also came off as much smaller than Earth. I'm really just questioning whether Bills really can just set the planet off at the bell, or if a standard sized planet is going to take him a bit longer than that.

[Cody]

It's not Sensei. Sensei was second-in-command of Ra's al Ghul's League of Assassins. And even though he was a better fighter than Batman, he was still beaten due to not being capable of lasting as long as Batman in their fight. So in other words; nowhere near suitable enough to be Val's teacher. Plus he was from Hong Kong. Val's teacher was from Japan.

Val's teacher was "Toshiaki White Crane" who was also Val's adoptive father(and killed Val's biological crime lord father) and taught Val "Super" Karate.

[Guy1]

So does Bills even have an AoE to speak of, or are we just spotting it to him because he's a DBZ character? Because that seems a little shaky.

I know he blew up planets by flying through them, but those planets in particular also came off as much smaller than Earth. I'm really just questioning whether Bills really can just set the planet off at the bell, or if a standard sized planet is going to take him a bit longer than that.

At the very least, he has Ki blasts and a planet busting attack.

[Cody]

So does Bills even have an AoE to speak of, or are we just spotting it to him because he's a DBZ character? Because that seems a little shaky.

I know he blew up planets by flying through them, but those planets in particular also came off as much smaller than Earth. I'm really just questioning whether Bills really can just set the planet off at the bell, or if a standard sized planet is going to take him a bit longer than that.

Well the DB universe does follow a simple A>B>C Format by the time Z rolls in. So generally that is how things worked. Not so much in Dragonball, but and Z and above? That was how it worked out. That, and combined with Whiss's statement that Bills could wipe out the Z fighters Solar System at any time he wanted(considering Whiss is not the arrogant type, being honest to a fault even, and is Bill's teacher, he would know him best) would mean he has some devestating AOE's.

Otherwise you'd be saying Nappa could create bigger AOE's than Bills due to him showcasing a blast seen from orbit while Bills didn't.

As for the planets? Hard to really say how big they were. Bigger than King Kai's planet to be certain, but at least near or on par with the size of Earth I would say.

Edit: One thing I never liked about that fight was the amount of ass kissing that Goku was doing with Bills. Seriously, the fucking cat was threatening to kill everyone he loves literally over spilled pudding, and despite that, he was acting so respectful towards the fucking guy. Something Goku never did to any of his other enemies.

[Guy1]

Edit: One thing I never liked about that fight was the amount of ass kissing that Goku was doing with Bills. Seriously, the fucking cat was threatening to kill everyone he loves literally over spilled pudding, and despite that, he was acting so respectful towards the fucking guy. Something Goku never did to any of his other enemies.

This is the same guy that gave Cell a senzu bean before sending his, what, 11 year old son out to fight him. The same guy that chose to play around with Majin Vegeta instead of whipping out SSJ3 and swatting him aside.
Goku...isn't that bright.

[Tramp Stampede]

At the very least, he has Ki blasts and a planet busting attack.

Allegedly planet busting. It doesn't actually bust any planets "on-panel" so to speak, which I've seen hang many an argument on these boards before. It was obviously powerful, yes, but we can't take the characters words for it that it would have outright blown up the Earth.

It also moved very slowly. Assuming that like Freeza's planet buster it maybe had to reach the core (again, we don't know because we don't actually see it happen, I'm just working off the benefit of the doubt here) KK has time to get a head start off the planet, assuming he doesn't just use that time to kill Bills instead.

Well the DB universe does follow a simple A>B>C Format by the time Z rolls in. So generally that is how things worked. Not so much in Dragonball, but and Z and above? That was how it worked out. That, and combined with Whiss's statement that Bills could wipe out the Z fighters Solar System at any time he wanted(considering Whiss is not the arrogant type, being honest to a fault even, and is Bill's teacher, he would know him best) would mean he has some devestating AOE's.

Otherwise you'd be saying Nappa could create bigger AOE's than Bills due to him showcasing a blast seen from orbit while Bills didn't.

As for the planets? Hard to really say how big they were. Bigger than King Kai's planet to be certain, but at least near or on par with the size of Earth I would say.

Edit: One thing I never liked about that fight was the amount of ass kissing that Goku was doing with Bills. Seriously, the fucking cat was threatening to kill everyone he loves literally over spilled pudding, and despite that, he was acting so respectful towards the fucking guy. Something Goku never did to any of his other enemies.

The DBZ universe might follow A>B>C format, but Rumbles doesn't. Whiss's statement about anything doesn't matter, statements don't count here. It's feats or nothing.

Yeah, I have no problem suggesting that Nappa could out AoE Bills. If Bills doesn't know how, he doesn't know how. Goten could go SSJ before he could fly. Guldo could stop time, and nobody more powerful than him could do it. Having a high power level doesn't automatically grant you all the abilities of the people below you in rank. Hell, Freeza couldn't even detect power levels without a scouter.

[Cody]

This is the same guy that gave Cell a senzu bean before sending his, what, 11 year old son out to fight him. The same guy that chose to play around with Majin Vegeta instead of whipping out SSJ3 and swatting him aside.
Goku...isn't that bright.

Yet he still talked trash to the both of them. Never showing them any ounce of respect, nor should he have.

This guy he was worshiping the ground he walked on.

Allegedly planet busting. It doesn't actually bust any planets "on-panel" so to speak, which I've seen hang many an argument on these boards before. It was obviously powerful, yes, but we can't take the characters words for it that it would have outright blown up the Earth.

It also moved very slowly. Assuming that like Freeza's planet buster it maybe had to reach the core (again, we don't know because we don't actually see it happen, I'm just working off the benefit of the doubt here) KK has time to get a head start off the planet, assuming he doesn't just use that time to kill Bills instead.



The DBZ universe might follow A>B>C format, but Rumbles doesn't. Whiss's statement about anything doesn't matter, statements don't count here. It's feats or nothing.

Yeah, I have no problem suggesting that Nappa could out AoE Bills. If Bills doesn't know how, he doesn't know how. Goten could go SSJ before he could fly. Guldo could stop time, and nobody more powerful than him could do it. Having a high power level doesn't automatically grant you all the abilities of the people below you in rank. Hell, Freeza couldn't even detect power levels without a scouter.

Yea, you don't get to spout the rules to a guy who has been here longer than you. This is how it has been done on here for Dragonball for years, prior to the wipe. You just use common sense. To say Nappa can do anything that Bills can't merely to help your argument isn't going to do much for you.

And character statements can be useable at times as long as they come from trustworthy sources or do not contradict what a character has shown capable of. ****, the entire movie is about Bills, who is a god of destruction. His job involves busting planets. You would have to dismiss the entire premise of the movie just because he didn't bust a planet with an aoe.

And using Guldo's time manipulation and Frieza's lack of energy sensing ability is a piss poor comparison as both of those are techniques and have nothing to do with power output. Same goes for Goten's lack of flying ability.

Dishing out more powerful explosions have nothing to do with knowing techniques, but how much energy you can push out. In Dragonball you might of had a point. But by the time DBZ trucks in? Almost everyone can dish out as much energy that they have in reserve.

[master of read]

This is the same guy that gave Cell a senzu bean before sending his, what, 11 year old son out to fight him. The same guy that chose to play around with Majin Vegeta instead of whipping out SSJ3 and swatting him aside.
Goku...isn't that bright.

well, bills wasn't being overtly evil or malicious. for him, blowing up planets is just part of his job.

[Bluekey]

Allegedly planet busting. It doesn't actually bust any planets "on-panel" so to speak, which I've seen hang many an argument on these boards before. It was obviously powerful, yes, but we can't take the characters words for it that it would have outright blown up the Earth.

Yeah no, that argument is not gonna fly. Bills operates on WAAYYYY to high a level to suggest he can't bust a planet.

[Cody]

well, bills wasn't being overtly evil or malicious. for him, blowing up planets is just part of his job.

Yea but for such a shitty reason? I mean, I would have thought there is some sort of system he had to work with when it comes to destroying planets.

[master of read]

Yeah no, that argument is not gonna fly. Bills operates on WAAYYYY to high a level to suggest he can't bust a planet.

considering that he bitched out SSJ3 goku in two hits without being in anyway serious, i can believe he can bust planets.

[Pendaran]

It's not Sensei. Sensei was second-in-command of Ra's al Ghul's League of Assassins. And even though he was a better fighter than Batman, he was still beaten due to not being capable of lasting as long as Batman in their fight. So in other words; nowhere near suitable enough to be Val's teacher. Plus he was from Hong Kong. Val's teacher was from Japan.

Val's teacher was "Toshiaki White Crane" who was also Val's adoptive father(and killed Val's biological crime lord father) and taught Val "Super" Karate.

That's a different Sensei, Toshiaki White Crane is also called Sensei, in the future.

We are all Sensei.

edit: the rest is all accurate, as far as it goes.