All-purpose news and politics thread: Two Steps Beyond!

[JackDaw]

nothing but decency

im all for making sure Trump voters regret their choice for the rest of their days

too bad we cant pull a Roslyn and blow them out the airlock

Absolutely no reason to jettison millions of fellow Americans.

All Democrats need to do is to run on a more centralist program, and get it spearheaded by a youngish candidate with no skeletons in their background. Preferably some one with a military background...some one who can look Trump in the eye, and say “I served, when you didn’t”.

Trump would then lose heavily.

But...I suspect...that such a simple strategy will elude the Democrats, and Trump may win again in 2020.

[JCAll]

Is that a quote from the Blues Brothers?

Heh, I love that movie. It just seemed like a good way to cap off the string of lame excuses I usually hear surrounding North Korea.

[TheInvisibleMan]

Absolutely no reason to jettison millions of fellow Americans.

All Democrats need to do is to run on a more centralist program, and get it spearheaded by a youngish candidate with no skeletons in their background. Preferably some one with a military background...some one who can look Trump in the eye, and say “I served, when you didn’t”.

Trump would then lose heavily.

But...I suspect...that such a simple strategy will elude the Democrats, and Trump may win again in 2020.

they stopped being Americans to me when they sided with the forces of darkness

history will leave them on the ash heap

[WestPhillyPunisher]

Absolutely no reason to jettison millions of fellow Americans.

All Democrats need to do is to run on a more centralist program, and get it spearheaded by a youngish candidate with no skeletons in their background. Preferably some one with a military background...some one who can look Trump in the eye, and say “I served, when you didn’t”.

Trump would then lose heavily.

But...I suspect...that such a simple strategy will elude the Democrats, and Trump may win again in 2020.

The only Democrat candidate that fits your criteria is Tammy Duckworth. Problem is, I don’t think this country is fully ready to put a woman in the White House, even if it meant denying Trump a second term.

[TheInvisibleMan]

The only Democrat candidate that fits your criteria is Tammy Duckworth. Problem is, I don’t think this country is fully ready to put a woman in the White House, even if it meant denying Trump a second term.

especially a non white woman

[JackDaw]

The only Democrat candidate that fits your criteria is Tammy Duckworth. Problem is, I don’t think this country is fully ready to put a woman in the White House, even if it meant denying Trump a second term.

I obviously accept you know a zillion times more about US politics than I do.

But...blimey..that is pessimistic.

Put it this way, I don’t think it was an accident that Trump waited until O’Bama was out of the way before making his run. Trump really isn’t a top class campaigner.

To an “outsider” losing an election to the Donald looks like losing to the Venus de Milo at arm wrestling.

Does this Tammy Duckworth have a robust sense of humour? Could she stand up to him, and poke fun at his conceit?

If the answers to those questions are “yes” then the Democrats should pick her, with every expectation of winning.

[TheInvisibleMan]

no, she does her job and does it well

and a number of crappy "Americans" would consider her "shrill"

just like they did with Clinton because this country hates women

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

I obviously accept you know a zillion times more about US politics than I do.

But...blimey..that is pessimistic.

Put it this way, I don’t think it was an accident that Trump waited until O’Bama was out of the way before making his run. Trump really isn’t a top class campaigner.

To an “outsider” losing an election to the Donald looks like losing to the Venus de Milo at arm wrestling.

Does this Tammy Duckworth have a robust sense of humour? Could she stand up to him, and poke fun at his conceit?

If the answers to those questions are “yes” then the Democrats should pick her, with every expectation of winning.

Trump actually is a dangerous campaigner to run against. The media is obsessed with him so he gets coverage that would cost another candidate a majority of their war chests for virtually free. The media also holds him to a different set of rules as an outsider where he can get away with saying crazy **** and they’ll justify it all day, meanwhile his opponents have to walk on eggshells. He has a cult like 33% of the voting block that will stay no matter what so no misstep is going to outright knock him out of the race. He’ll just fall to his safety for awhile until the situation gets better and he can make another push. Also as much as Trump is hated, Congress ha been hated as much, if not more, for longer. So any serious candidate is going to come with the baggage of being part of a hated institution while Trump still gets to play the outsider card because he will be allowed to.

People have to realize that as much as us on the left laughed at the Republican primary, that field was an all star team for that party. That was a moderate Republican who has strong roots in a swing state that decides elections that was part of a dynasty in Bush, another up and coming future face of the party in Rubio who is also deeply tied to that swing state and likely would drive out a big portion of Hispanics to abandon Democrats (incidentally it was widely reported that Hillary’s team was afraid of Rubio the most), Cruz who was the de facto face of the Tea aparty movement that would lockdown the base for them if they won, a likable governor in Kasich who also would have taken a swing state with him, and Christie who their base loves and is great at debating. It’s harder to look at as Democrats who fundamentally look at them as ridiculous, but that’s a brutally strong field for half of the country. And Trump just rolled through it. Part of it was Trump’s popularity, part of it was they didn’t and don’t know how to handle him, and part of it was he basically plays with cheat codes.

My point is, dont underestimate him in that way. He gets to **** up as much as he wants and stay in it. Any Democrat that has one of his screw ups will lose right there. Also for some reason with him traditional polling models aren’t accurate. His team actually had some of the more accurate polling models and it gave them more vidavility on the race.

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

no, she does her job and does it well

and a number of crappy "Americans" would consider her "shrill"

just like they did with Clinton because this country hates women

Nah. Clinton is just a terrible campaigner. She doesn’t know how to connect with people, she comes off as inauthentic and trying to say something popular that the “cool kids” will get, top that with she was kind of a place holder politician in the sense that she just kinda went along with whatever was popular at the time through her career so she would up being complicit in a lot of missteps, while not really being a figurehead for taking any bold stances on good policy. Add baggage with emails that she couldn’t shake, add Russia and a massive misinformation campaign, add it was a climate that heavily favored outsiders and she could never be one. In many ways she was one of the worst people to run against Trump in 2016.

I think she easily would have beat McCain in 2008 if she got by Obama. It was a more favorable race, people weren’t sick of her, there was nostagia to get back to the 90’s and the Clinton era after Bush. In truth following up on Obama probably hurt her a lot. His base really resented her for 2008 and it shifted the general direction of Democratic politics to the point where the Clinton brand was a lot more sterile than the direction most of the party was looking towards.

Duckworth wouldn’t have that, Warren wouldn’t have that, Harris wouldn’t have that. Gillibrand is the most in danger of that tbh.

[JackDaw]

My point is, dont underestimate him in that way. He gets to **** up as much as he wants and stay in it. Any Democrat that has one of his screw ups will lose right there. Also for some reason with him traditional polling models aren’t accurate. His team actually had some of the more accurate polling models and it gave them more vidavility on the race.

Thanks, that's an enlightening post. (I've not quoted it all, but do appreciate the detail.)

And I suppose, the Donald is starting to look as a guy who tends to keep his promises. He said he'd put America first, and he has imposed tariffs on steel. He said he would withdraw from the Trans-Pacific partnership on trade, and he has. He has cut top rate of personal tax, and cut corporation tax. He has made immigration from some countries more difficult, as he said he would. He said he would repel ISIS...and they are weakened. He said he would move American embassy to Israel, and he has.

Unemployment is low, and the Stock Exchange is low. And wages for Joe Average are growing, the economy looks strong.

I can see that you're right, and he may have a decent shot at winning next election.

On other hand, Democrats won popular vote last time. And the overall demographic trends should help..Asians and Latinos numbers are rising.

Democrats need to get better at popular politics...show they have a plan to protect employment as robotics grow, for example. Run a candidate who makes Trump look old by being young, makes Trump look nasty by being pleasant, and make Trump look corrupt by being squeaky clean. In a such a large country..that "recipe" should not be an impossible one. If Democrats really can't find some one like that...then it's beyond sad.

[Darkspellmaster]

Trump actually is a dangerous campaigner to run against. The media is obsessed with him so he gets coverage that would cost another candidate a majority of their war chests for virtually free. The media also holds him to a different set of rules as an outsider where he can get away with saying crazy **** and they’ll justify it all day, meanwhile his opponents have to walk on eggshells. He has a cult like 33% of the voting block that will stay no matter what so no misstep is going to outright knock him out of the race. He’ll just fall to his safety for awhile until the situation gets better and he can make another push. Also as much as Trump is hated, Congress ha been hated as much, if not more, for longer. So any serious candidate is going to come with the baggage of being part of a hated institution while Trump still gets to play the outsider card because he will be allowed to.

People have to realize that as much as us on the left laughed at the Republican primary, that field was an all star team for that party. That was a moderate Republican who has strong roots in a swing state that decides elections that was part of a dynasty in Bush, another up and coming future face of the party in Rubio who is also deeply tied to that swing state and likely would drive out a big portion of Hispanics to abandon Democrats (incidentally it was widely reported that Hillary’s team was afraid of Rubio the most), Cruz who was the de facto face of the Tea aparty movement that would lockdown the base for them if they won, a likable governor in Kasich who also would have taken a swing state with him, and Christie who their base loves and is great at debating. It’s harder to look at as Democrats who fundamentally look at them as ridiculous, but that’s a brutally strong field for half of the country. And Trump just rolled through it. Part of it was Trump’s popularity, part of it was they didn’t and don’t know how to handle him, and part of it was he basically plays with cheat codes.

My point is, dont underestimate him in that way. He gets to **** up as much as he wants and stay in it. Any Democrat that has one of his screw ups will lose right there. Also for some reason with him traditional polling models aren’t accurate. His team actually had some of the more accurate polling models and it gave them more vidavility on the race.

Exactly, and also they would pull on the brother group because she wasn't born inside the us physically. Also they could go after her time in the Illinois house. Not to mention her military career as they did with Kerry.

No, if your a woman and want a shot you would need to be:

Motherly but not too motherly

Sexy but not too sexy

Smart but not too smart

Know about sports, but not too much

Be a mom and a trophy wife and a l3ader but also defirer to the hubby.

Where hot clothing and look hot enough that people would want to hang you but also be able to act like June cleaner.

How the he'll does anyone like that exist?

[Malvolio]

I obviously accept you know a zillion times more about US politics than I do.

But...blimey..that is pessimistic.

Put it this way, I don’t think it was an accident that Trump waited until O’Bama was out of the way before making his run. Trump really isn’t a top class campaigner.

To an “outsider” losing an election to the Donald looks like losing to the Venus de Milo at arm wrestling.

Does this Tammy Duckworth have a robust sense of humour? Could she stand up to him, and poke fun at his conceit?

If the answers to those questions are “yes” then the Democrats should pick her, with every expectation of winning.

Of course Tammy Duckworth has a sense of humor. She's the one who started calling Trump "Cadet Bone-Spurs."

[Ragged Maw]

Exactly, and also they would pull on the brother group because she wasn't born inside the us physically. Also they could go after her time in the Illinois house. Not to mention her military career as they did with Kerry.

No, if your a woman and want a shot you would need to be:

Motherly but not too motherly

Sexy but not too sexy

Smart but not too smart

Know about sports, but not too much

Be a mom and a trophy wife and a l3ader but also defirer to the hubby.

Where hot clothing and look hot enough that people would want to hang you but also be able to act like June cleaner.

How the he'll does anyone like that exist?

Wont speak for everyone else, but all she needs besides a solid resume in government is to have policies Im (mostly) in line with and not have a frequent history of flip-flopping, and I’d be sold (or, at the very least, my choice wouldn’t be a difficult one)

[wjowski]

I'd vote for Duckworth of Warren before I'd vote for freakin' Oprah.

[Ragged Maw]

I'd vote for Duckworth of Warren before I'd vote for freakin' Oprah.

Also, while I’m not encouraging cynical power plays, she did lose both her legs in service of her country. PR-wise, that would only serve to her advantage.