TV Supergirl [Spoilers]

[Captain Smith]

What powers does he have now? Flies with the ring. Strong, tough and fast but nowhere near comic Daxamites. Power him up already.

[Frontier]

What powers does he have now? Flies with the ring. Strong, tough and fast but nowhere near comic Daxamites. Power him up already.

He's always had super strength, if not on the level of Kara, and I think he has super speed, but they've never really been clear which of the Kryptonian powerset he does or doesn't have other then not being able to fly without the Legion ring.

I think they've indicated he has super-hearing, but it was only subtly.

[AnakinFlair]

Wasn't clear on what the apprentice used to trap Kara in that action figure box. That was a really cool trap btw but what material can hold Supergirl like that?

It's the same material that Superman's cellophane S was made out of in Superman 2

[Vworp Vworp]

I was actually impressed Mon-El got to take down an enemy since I feel like he's always been the weakest, most ineffectual one.

Nah. Proportionately, over the course of the last three years, that's definitely been Supergirl. Honestly, at this point I'm pretty much convinced that she's been saved by someone more often that she's actually scored a genuine victory on her own during the show's entire run. Seriously, even James looked stronger and more competent than Kara was allowed to look this week, just so the writers could big up Mon-El - presumably purely for their standard CW demographic that would rather see the pretty boy as the hero/lead.

Here's the thing. I only watched Arrow for it's first few years and eventually gave up cos of the shoddy way it treated it's own female characters (man, it's like there's a pattern or something!). But I don't have many memories of Ollie needing to be saved on such a regular basis during the first three seasons of Arrow. Helped out sometimes sure, but never saved. Quite the opposite, given how monumentally they nerfed the original Black Canary and then continued to do so with other versions of the character in subsequent seasons.

And I'm quiet confident in saying that Ollie has never been carried like some unconscious damsel in distress in some blokes arms - as has happened to Kara on no less than three occasions now. This year, we've seen Kara struggle with aliens, nanite doohickeys and even bog standard humans with some snazzy guns. And the more it happens (and the less balance there is with Supergirl actually getting to do anything... super!), the more it notices and the more it grates. Hence, my frustration with this week's episode.

And yes, there's the argument that it's hard to write for Supertypes cos essentially you're trying to create danger and peril for a character who is basically unstoppable. But firstly, I don't remember Cain or Welling being quite this helpless, quite this often on their shows. And secondly, the writers don't even seem to be trying to create a threat that should be able to challenge Supergirl. Instead, they're taking her out with stuff she should be able to deal with using literally one finger.

At best, it's awful writing. At worst, it's patronising and insulting.

[Frontier]

Nah. Proportionately, over the course of the last three years, that's definitely been Supergirl. Honestly, at this point I'm pretty much convinced that she's been saved by someone more often that she's actually scored a genuine victory on her own during the show's entire run. Seriously, even James looked stronger and more competent than Kara was allowed to look this week, just so the writers could big up Mon-El - presumably purely for their standard CW demographic that would rather see the pretty boy as the hero/lead.

Proportionately, compared to Mon-El's general showings, I would say it's definitely Mon-El who has more often then not been useless and needed saving. Especially in season 2.

I mean, right in his first episode back this season he ends up getting socked unconscious by Kara and then when he and the Legion take on Reign, he's the first one who's immediately taken out, and they all end up needing Kara to come back to beat Reign.

And Jimmy being more useful and actually seeming competent is quite a change of pace from how Guardian is generally used (when the writers remember to use him at all).

Here's the thing. I only watched Arrow for it's first few years and eventually gave up cos of the shoddy way it treated it's own female characters (man, it's like there's a pattern or something!). But I don't have many memories of Ollie needing to be saved on such a regular basis during the first three seasons of Arrow. Helped out sometimes sure, but never saved. Quite the opposite, given how monumentally they nerfed the original Black Canary and then continued to do so with other versions of the character in subsequent seasons.

Having continued to watch Arrow, I can say there have been complaints of Oliver needing help or failing against threats that he would have normally had no problem defeating before.

And I'm quiet confident in saying that Ollie has never been carried like some unconscious damsel in distress in some blokes arms - as has happened to Kara on no less than three occasions now. This year, we've seen Kara struggle with aliens, nanite doohickeys and even bog standard humans with some snazzy guns. And the more it happens (and the less balance there is with Supergirl actually getting to do anything... super!), the more it notices and the more it grates. Hence, my frustration with this week's episode.

That seems about on par with how Barry struggles against every single Metahuman he fights each week, even though he could theoretically defeat all of them in five seconds.

And I think Kara usually comes off better then Barry when it comes to competence.

And yes, there's the argument that it's hard to write for Supertypes cos essentially you're trying to create danger and peril for a character who is basically unstoppable. But firstly, I don't remember Cain or Welling being quite this helpless, quite this often on their shows. And secondly, the writers don't even seem to be trying to create a threat that should be able to challenge Supergirl. Instead, they're taking her out with stuff she should be able to deal with using literally one finger.

I'm not sure if it's fair to compare Cain and Welling since the former didn't have to deal with Supervillains on as regular a basis as Kara does and Welling's fights usually had to accommodate the fact that he wasn't a full-blown Superman yet.

[Vworp Vworp]

Proportionately, compared to Mon-El's general showings, I would say it's definitely Mon-El who has more often then not been useless and needed saving. Especially in season 2.

By proportionately, I mean in terms of both a) her being the lead on the show and b) she's supposed to be significantly stronger than him.

Having continued to watch Arrow, I can say there have been complaints of Oliver needing help or failing against threats that he would have normally had no problem defeating before.

Are they comparable situations though? Again, I'm not talking about him simply need some tech support or the team to deal with a few additional bad guys. But actual instances where he is legitimately helpless and only survives because someone is there to directly save him. As happens on Supergirl almost every week.

I'm not sure if it's fair to compare Cain and Welling since the former didn't have to deal with Supervillains on as regular a basis as Kara does and Welling's fights usually had to accommodate the fact that he wasn't a full-blown Superman yet.

Neither of those seem like reasons why the current Supergirl has to consistently be portrayed as weaker than they were. The writers on both of those shows were able to create drama easily enough (for the most part) without it always being about Superman/Clark being the one in trouble. Course, because they were male leads, both shows often fell back on the default story-telling devices of having the female characters as the archetypal damsels.

And that's the real tragedy. Because twenty/ten years later, another Supershow is still falling back on those old tropes - except now it's putting its own female lead character in the most peril!

[Osiris-Rex]

Barry seems to have to be spoonfed how to deal with every situation from Iris or Cisco or Wells. I wonder if he is able to even wipe his butt without instructions? At least Kara can figure out things on her own.
Kara was the one that realized it was a submarine attacking the city and dove into the water all on her own initiative. If she would have relied on instruction she would have been told not to because she couldn't
breathe underwater. When it came time to dispose of the Kryptonian probe it was Kara who decided to drill a hole in the ground with her heat vision and then ordered Alex to push it in. Nobody had to tell her
she should drill a hole with her heat vision. It was Kara who figured out the swimming pool was contaminated.

[tabo61]

The alien prison break out was awesome.

[Kirby101]

The alien prison break out was awesome.

Yes it was, and the episode was also heartbreaking manly due to Lumbly and Harewood.
Lovedctthe use of the Brando Joe El quote.

[AnakinFlair]

Are they comparable situations though? Again, I'm not talking about him simply need some tech support or the team to deal with a few additional bad guys. But actual instances where he is legitimately helpless and only survives because someone is there to directly save him. As happens on Supergirl almost every week.

The only times i can think that Oliver legitimately needed help against hopeless odds would be in season 3, when Tatsu and Maseo saved him after his duel with Ra's, and maybe at the end of last season, when he needed Slade and Malcolm's help to get back his family and friends.

With Supergirl, I think the problem is two-fold. Firstly, it's having to write for a character that is basically a god.

Secondly, they are also having to write for the supporting cast and give them their own stories. That takes the focus off of Supergirl and sometimes makes her look weak and ineffective. They could stop those side stories and focus solely on Supergirl, but then the supporting cast would feel really underdeveloped and probably ask for their release (see Holland, Willa).

[AnakinFlair]

The alien prison break out was awesome.

Yes it was, but was anyone else thinking when Alex and Kara were doing the walk and talk earlier in the episode "Look! There's Checkov's detention block!"? I mean, have we even seen that before this episode?

Minor quibble, but the animation for the fight between J'onn and the White Martian looked pretty bad.

Loved Mon El's suit.

[Frontier]

The only times i can think that Oliver legitimately needed help against hopeless odds would be in season 3, when Tatsu and Maseo saved him after his duel with Ra's, and maybe at the end of last season, when he needed Slade and Malcolm's help to get back his family and friends.

There was also that time in season 4 where he needed Lance to bail him out from Lady Cop...or the Star City PD to save him and Team Arrow from the Star City Sirens.

[AnakinFlair]

I also really like how Kara's relationship with Mon El is progressing. I really didn't get their chemistry last season, but this season I'm really feeling it. Maybe it's because Kara hasn't had that many scenes with Lena.

[AnakinFlair]

There was also that time in season 4 where he needed Lance to bail him out from Lady Cop...or the Star City PD to save him and Team Arrow from the Star City Sirens.

Slapping my head- he needed to be saved by Roy when he turned himself in to Lance in Season 3. He was ready to go to jail and would have if Roy hadn't taken his place.

[QuinnFillory]

I liked J'onn's story with his father. However...

Lena is making a BIG mistake with Reign. This will only end in her either being in danger, or her pissing off Supergirl.

Speaking of, I didn't like the big confrontation with her and Mon-El. For starters, it came off as fanservicey to those who hate Mon-El and his relationship with her. This article in particular pissed me off:https://io9.gizmodo.com/supergirl-ma...for-1825486463.

Really? NO ONE ACTED LIKE MON-EL WAS ALWAYS RIGHT AND PERFECT. In fact, throughout season two, he would make dumb mistakes and get called out by everyone, especially Kara. He didn't want to be a superhero; he was called out on that. He never listened to Kara; he was called out on that. He wanted to kill Mxy instead of banishing him; he was called out. He lied to Kara about who he really was; he was not only called out for that, but he was dumped. There was only one time he was remotely in the right about something (the whole thing with trusting Kara and Alex's dad too easily), and he was still in the wrong for that in terms of his behavior. Jimmy and Alex took months to believe that he wasn't selfish, and Winn told him to his face that he was a terrible boyfriend. Meanwhile, Kara would be the first person to yell at him for how horrible he was being. The show took great pains to show that Mon-El was a screw-up that needed to learn, yet the fans all act like he was treated like a god to improve Kara, instead of the other way around.
Now, that obviously doesn't make for a good relationship, nor does it make for good tv-watching. But, my god, everyone is acting like he was somehow an abusive boyfriend that walked all over Kara. First of all, Kara would never allow that. Second, all of the stuff she mentioned that she was still pissed off at him for happened BEFORE he was even a romantic option that she considered. Third, if he was really that bad, then people on other CW shows (Oliver!) are to be avoided. Don't get me wrong; Kara should realize that their relationship wasn't perfect. But, to have come about because he was helping her like she asked him to do?

How about this: Kara gets resentful because she realizes that Imra is with the better version of Mon-El than she was. Now that could make for something compelling.