What DID Cyclops do? Theories and Spculation

[Knives]

Well, I just read the 11 pages of this thread. And there are a lot of good hipotesis in here. But sadly i think those ideas are actually better than what is actually going to happen with scott. Bottom line to me is just that the Marvel Universe become on behalf of marketing movies against the X-men, and pro Inhumans. And once they decided to do that, the rest are excuses built around that already taken idea.

The actual Mutant context seems harsh, nor real (within its own fantasy), rigid... not well knitted together. Like it was forced upon writers. Worst of it its not interesting at all. Old ideas, but worst handled than before.



I agree cyclops has been very bad written lately. Have you read him on SW? WTF? Stupid line after stupid line of dialogue (mutant supremacy... i had a revolution going...). That particular line left me in awe. In Uncanny X-Men scott talks about that revolution and how it was a desperate attempt, that it was a hollow threat. Si he was not only bad written, he was also inconsistent with the last UXM books. Awful.

Even Worse, the last UXM books before SW were about Cyclops redeeming himself, hating himself and trying expiate about Xavier´s death. And now again, he becomes an even worst villain. So in summary: I feel bad about myself and I´ll make it up, I know im a good guy (and Marvel make us read about his Catharsis almost over an year or more > then > Wait, I think I need to be bad again! Sorry I made you believe over 12 issues or more how bad I felt about being a bad guy, I need to kill some Inhumans now and be hated again. Really? WTF? Is this a consistent story?

They needed a sacrifice to show how God Doom was powerful which is a shame. Although I still hope Phoenix has a role to play in SW after all it is a symbol of rebirth.

Please do not remind me Bendis because prefer forget the mess with time travel and the revolution that never happened that would change the status quo of x-mens in the last 10 years but believe marvel think is more fun decimate mutants again .

Have nothing against Cyclops disappeared for a while love the character but he became a figure so powerful that almost everything that was happening had something to do with him. In a way the world of the X-men's currently still revolves around him and supposedly did. Their disappearance is good for balance and make room for other characters.

Because the Cold War between Marvel and Fox as well the rise of the Inhumans we can not discard the hypothesis it is another attempt to discredit the character before fans and make him a villain again. I would like to believe Marvel has good plans for him and his return will be triumphant to save the X-mens and mutant race again but everything indicates the opposite direction so far .

[MarvelMaster616]

At this point I don't think Marvel even knows what Cyclops did.

Thing is, there are plenty of ways to put him on the sidelines than crap on his character.

I think Marvel does now. Jeff Lemire has said on Twitter that these details will be revealed. So I do think there is a larger plan in place. I just think it's a plan that's being poorly executed right now. The stories being told now are really suffering because so much happened off-panel. There's a fine line between mystery and plot hole and I don't think Marvel has done a good job of walking that line in this issue. Cyclops, like it or not, is a major character. And at a time when Wolverine, Charles Xavier, and (adult) Jean Grey are dead, he's more major than most. Killing him off and doing it off-panel, no less, undermines that character. When he goes from holding a peaceful protest in one issue to being a war criminal in the next with no explanation, that's not just jarring. That makes no sense. And the longer Marvel waits to reveal the truth, the more the stories will suffer.

Right now, I'm not confident in any of my theories. They all require way too many assumptions. But what we do know is that Marvel is belaboring the point that what Cyclops did was so terrible that he's now the most hated mutant in history. Given that the 4chan rumor was at least partially vindicated, I still favor the theory that someone like Kid Omega telepathically manipulated him in a blind attack against the Inhumans that ended badly. Cyclops is too good a tactician to lose that horribly, especially after he worked so hard to save mutants after M-Day. Since we haven't heard from Kid Omega, this outcome is still possible.

The problem is that it's just as possible that as soon as Cyclops heard about the Terrigen Mists, he hulked out. Having just overcome M-Day, he does what he never usually does in a battle and completely overreacts, attacking the Inhumans blindly and killing a lot of innocent people in the process. This would be completely and utterly OOC, but that's just it. This is just as possible as the scenario above. And given how all the characters in EXM and All-New X-men talk about how horrible Cyclops is, I think it's more possible than it should be.

[Ambaryerno]

There's a fine line between mystery and plot hole and I don't think Marvel has done a good job of walking that line in this issue.

To reiterate: Marvel telling us Cyclops did something but not telling us what that something is is NOT a plot hole. Right now it's an Unreveal. It doesn't become a plot hole until Marvel actually TELLS us what happens, but there's absolutely no development in the plot to actually support it.

[VilotorioFabiano]

I think Marvel does now. Jeff Lemire has said on Twitter that these details will be revealed. So I do think there is a larger plan in place. I just think it's a plan that's being poorly executed right now. The stories being told now are really suffering because so much happened off-panel. There's a fine line between mystery and plot hole and I don't think Marvel has done a good job of walking that line in this issue. Cyclops, like it or not, is a major character. And at a time when Wolverine, Charles Xavier, and (adult) Jean Grey are dead, he's more major than most. Killing him off and doing it off-panel, no less, undermines that character. When he goes from holding a peaceful protest in one issue to being a war criminal in the next with no explanation, that's not just jarring. That makes no sense. And the longer Marvel waits to reveal the truth, the more the stories will suffer.

Think you're being too impatient? The stories just started, and with the Apocalypse Wars coming up in about 4-5 issues, I'd like to think this story will have answered the big questions by then. The fact everyone keeps talking about it kind of makes me think Marvel is in the right with all this misdirection.

[Nyadnar17]

I think Marvel does now. Jeff Lemire has said on Twitter that these details will be revealed. So I do think there is a larger plan in place. I just think it's a plan that's being poorly executed right now. The stories being told now are really suffering because so much happened off-panel. There's a fine line between mystery and plot hole and I don't think Marvel has done a good job of walking that line in this issue. Cyclops, like it or not, is a major character. And at a time when Wolverine, Charles Xavier, and (adult) Jean Grey are dead, he's more major than most. Killing him off and doing it off-panel, no less, undermines that character. When he goes from holding a peaceful protest in one issue to being a war criminal in the next with no explanation, that's not just jarring. That makes no sense. And the longer Marvel waits to reveal the truth, the more the stories will suffer..

I am with you 100%. My enjoyment of New X-men number 2 was drastically reduced because I felt like Tyke's response to the Ghost of Cyclops was actually a thinly veiled lecture from the writer about how stupid I am to still think Cyke is a good guy. Even though the Ghost of Cyclops are scumbags and even though based on what Tyke apparently knows or thinks he knows about what went down he is probably entirely justified in his anger I still felt attacked. That sucks. I knew the 8 month skip would be jarring, time skips always are, but finding my favorite hero in comics not only so far absent in the new Marvel but vilified is a tough pill to swallow for months on end.

[Thor-Ul]

They needed a sacrifice to show how God Doom was powerful which is a shame. Although I still hope Phoenix has a role to play in SW after all it is a symbol of rebirth.

Please do not remind me Bendis because prefer forget the mess with time travel and the revolution that never happened that would change the status quo of x-mens in the last 10 years but believe marvel think is more fun decimate mutants again .

Have nothing against Cyclops disappeared for a while love the character but he became a figure so powerful that almost everything that was happening had something to do with him. In a way the world of the X-men's currently still revolves around him and supposedly did. Their disappearance is good for balance and make room for other characters.

Because the Cold War between Marvel and Fox as well the rise of the Inhumans we can not discard the hypothesis it is another attempt to discredit the character before fans and make him a villain again. I would like to believe Marvel has good plans for him and his return will be triumphant to save the X-mens and mutant race again but everything indicates the opposite direction so far .

I really doubt than the Phoenix will play a role in the SW outcome. I would be surprised if something like that happens. From what I can see seems like the MU is stuck with the doppelgangers from a past time. And there is no consecuences. So why is any time traveler villain a problem?

[Super-Cyke]

Hoping in the end it turns out he's a good guy and not the heartless maniac the hearsay in the current Marvel universe is portraying him as.

I feel like Cyclops is one of Marvel's greatest characters. He's been through the ringer both in the books and in the outside world. Poor portrayals in media made most casual observers rarely interested in him. Segments of comic fandom despise him. He's experienced crazy things in the stories. Despite all this though, he survived. He grew. His popularity has really grown immensely in comic fandom over the past 10+ years. This guy stuck to his guns and finally became (adequately) appreciated. I think it'd be a waste for his character to be ruined. Especially now, after coming so far.

[MarvelMaster616]

Think you're being too impatient? The stories just started, and with the Apocalypse Wars coming up in about 4-5 issues, I'd like to think this story will have answered the big questions by then. The fact everyone keeps talking about it kind of makes me think Marvel is in the right with all this misdirection.

You might be right. I admit I am being impatient on some levels. However, I don't think that negates the points I've made about the nature of the story. A lot of characters have undergone major changes in the 8-month gap. Kamala is an Avenger. Jessica Drew is pregnant. Amadeus Cho is the Hulk. It's a matter of degree in terms of how much the story shifted after the gap.

Kamala was already a rising hero before. Cho has a history with being involved in the Hulk. And Jessica Drew has never said outright that she's against having kids. So these changes, while significant, aren't outright jarring. But the end of Uncanny X-men #700 compared to the beginning of Extraordinary X-men #1 is just so extreme that it disrupts the narrative. This isn't just Tony Stark showing up at Kamala's house and offering her an Avenger's logo. It's not just Jessica Drew hooking up with some guy for one night. It has been stated on-panel that a full blown war erupted between the Inhumans and mutants. There are some details that can be skipped. Details as big as a war isn't one of them. Avengers vs. X-men got 12 issues and multiple tie-ins to depict a major war in the Marvel universe. This all happened off-panel.

It's not just a matter of creating a mystery. This is taking any and all of the progress that had been made with Cyclops prior to the 8-month gap and utterly nullifying it. He went from holding a peaceful demonstration and fighting alongside other heroes against the final incursion to being a war criminal. It's one of those details that's weighing down the story in EXM and All-New X-men in my opinion. Again, I admit I might be impatient for answers, but I think the absence of those answers have made for weaker stories that lack any sense of dramatic weight. That could still change, but the longer this is dragged out, the worse it'll get.

[VilotorioFabiano]

That could still change, but the longer this is dragged out, the worse it'll get.

Def but we are not at that point yet. If this isn't resolved before Apocalypse Wars then I'll jump on board with you.

He went from holding a peaceful demonstration and fighting alongside other heroes against the final incursion to being a war criminal.

Show me the proof. If they really stick with him being all evil then yes you are right, but imo, this fits in with his ongoing redemption. The hate against him is so strong that by the time he makes his triumphant return, it will allow for a greater redemption moment. The hate will only make that twist much stronger. I just think what they're doing is obviously trying to trick us. If Marvel did hate him and want him ruined, I think they're just do it instead of focusing all these stories on him. If they said Cyclops disappeared under mysterious circumstances, I don't think fans would be talking about this story as much. Telling us he's all evil now without proof gets at our emotions more and therefore gets us to talk about it more.

Details as big as a war isn't one of them. Avengers vs. X-men got 12 issues and multiple tie-ins to depict a major war in the Marvel universe. This all happened off-panel.

Maybe for marketing purposes they are hyping it up more than it needs to be and in the end it turns out it's not as big as they make it sound now? But yeah even with flashbacks this is definitely messy territory.

[MarvelMaster616]

Def but we are not at that point yet. If this isn't resolved before Apocalypse Wars then I'll jump on board with you.

I'm certainly hoping these questions are answered by then. It would only detract from the Apocalypse Wars story if this plot got dragged to a point where it derailed this plot. Right now, if I had to bet money, I'd say the end of the first arc is when we'll find out. But I've been wrong about these things before and this could be no different.

Show me the proof. If they really stick with him being all evil then yes you are right, but imo, this fits in with his ongoing redemption. The hate against him is so strong that by the time he makes his triumphant return, it will allow for a greater redemption moment. The hate will only make that twist much stronger. I just think what they're doing is obviously trying to trick us. If Marvel did hate him and want him ruined, I think they're just do it instead of focusing all these stories on him. If they said Cyclops disappeared under mysterious circumstances, I don't think fans would be talking about this story as much. Telling us he's all evil now without proof gets at our emotions more and therefore gets us to talk about it more.

I hope you're right in this matter too. I think making Cyclops evil and doing it off-panel is a huge disservice to his character and the story that has been unfolding for the past three years now under Bendis. But if Lemire, Hopeless, and Bunn can somehow turn it around and make it part of his redemption story, then I'm all for it. At the moment, I think the extent to which they're belaboring how hated and despised Cyclops is tends to indicate that Marvel wants to make him a villain. Maybe that's how they set him apart from his O5 counterpart or something. I hope that's not the case, but if there is a twist of sorts waiting in the wings that will redeem Cyclops, I'm all for it.

Maybe for marketing purposes they are hyping it up more than it needs to be and in the end it turns out it's not as big as they make it sound now? But yeah even with flashbacks this is definitely messy territory.

On this, we agree.

[donpricetag]

Making a mistake, being a bad leader or just impatient doesn't make him "evil". As for him ultimately turning out be a "bad guy", well that's just prospective. It depends on where you stand. Right now, Marvel is telling us the vast majority of the world sees him as one of the worst things to have ever walked the planet... For this to make any kind of sense, they are going to have to use a lot of exposition and flashbacks, perhaps enough to fill several issues. But that would give the X-Men editors and writers more credit than they may deserve. Only way to avoid a miniseries amount of explaining is to reveal that Cyclops isn't dead and everything that the world thought of him was incorrect or just 100% fictional.

[Omega Alpha]

Think you're being too impatient? .

No, he's not. Marvel's taking arguably the most important X-man of all time and probably the most popular now that Logan is dead and having his friends say he's an evil murderer and responsible for all of mutantkind's problems when he has been anything but for 50+ years and the previous run ended with him holding a peace rally. It's their JOB to give a reason, and give it right away.

Specially considering that the only logical conclusion we can reach from the information given so far is that Cyclops protested and/or reacted poorly to a poison gas sterilizing and murdering his people; and the implication of this is that Marvel thinks that if a minority has been forcibly sterilized and murdered so another group of people can grow and thrive, the minority should just stay quiet and don't do anything about it.

[FluffyCyclopsRLZ]

Specially considering that the only logical conclusion we can reach from the information given so far is that Cyclops protested and/or reacted poorly to a poison gas sterilizing and murdering his people; and the implication of this is that Marvel thinks that if a minority has been forcibly sterilized and murdered so another group of people can grow and thrive, the minority should just stay quiet and don't do anything about it.

You forgot, aforementioned minority should also LEAVE. Surreal, lol.

[somacula]

No, he's not. Marvel's taking arguably the most important X-man of all time and probably the most popular now that Logan is dead and having his friends say he's an evil murderer and responsible for all of mutantkind's problems when he has been anything but for 50+ years and the previous run ended with him holding a peace rally. It's their JOB to give a reason, and give it right away.

Specially considering that the only logical conclusion we can reach from the information given so far is that Cyclops protested and/or reacted poorly to a poison gas sterilizing and murdering his people; and the implication of this is that Marvel thinks that if a minority has been forcibly sterilized and murdered so another group of people can grow and thrive, the minority should just stay quiet and don't do anything about it.

QFT, it's way worse than Namor's death.
If Lemire or any editors were actually interested in writing a semi decent story they'd give some decent flashbacks and factual evidence to back up random claims of Scott being absolute evil. So far they've only made some characters say that Cyclops is the worst mutant yadah yadah yadah, and they expect us to somehow accept what they throw at us when it contradicts everything that has happened for the last 10 years (cept for the arrhate of certain characters), not a set up or explanation of any kind.
So cyclops fans just have to accept that a writer that doesn't want write that character drags his good name through the mud, and haters can hate him like good sheep because one or two characters told them too.
Honestly they've made identity crisis and zero hour parallax look good, and that's quite and achievement. If Lemire didn't wanted to write cyclops he'd just left him out of his book, how difficult was that, same to the rest of the writers. If their intent was to write a good story that's a pretty shitty start and no good story starts like that, so my bet is they're making it along the way. What I hope for is that Hickman writes that Cyclops didn't wanted to go to the new MU post SW and retcon in one sweep all the crap they're writing about him

[Jean Grey]

Namor's a different story tho. For some reason Marvel has him on the black list of 'do not use' as per comments from a Marvel game. There's others like the F4 that they can be persuaded to get out of said list, but it seems Namor is just a no-go. So I wasn't surprised to see them kill him off on the illusion of making a book matter.

Cyclops I feel is just a plot device at the moment, used to drive the story. Its comics, even if he is truly dead, which I really don't think he is. He will be back soon enough to launch another xmen related event that marvel can sell.