Controversial Opinions (For Everything Other Than DC Comics)

[The Question]

If Afro-Americans weren't so concerned with rubbing elbows in white society and spent their time and energy developing and investing in and their own communities, we could have achieved more unanimity. A solid fist has more power than five individual fingers. But it doesn't make much difference now, considering the current social and political landscape.

You're talking about Nationalism.

[Old Man Ollie 1962]

You're talking about Nationalism.

Minus the xenophobia and isolationism. But that was then. It's the filthy rich vs the vastly increasing dirt poor now.

[Kirby101]

Different question.

If someone should be able to get service anywhere, is not the same question as "Once I know where they stand, should I give them money knowing where they stand?"

How do you find out which businesses hate you. Do you ask first or just leave when you find out they don't like the minority group you belong to?

[numberthirty]

How do you find out which businesses hate you. Do you ask first or just leave when you find out they don't like the minority group you belong to?

In the instance we're discussing, someone has walked right up to you and let you know.

[Kirby101]

In the instance we're discussing, someone has walked right up to you and let you know.

Yes, they went to a Baker and he said we don't serve your kind here.

Just like they told black people. Just like they told Jewish people.

The shame is you see a difference.

[numberthirty]

Yes, they went to a Baker and he said we don't serve your kind here.

Just like they told black people. Just like they told Jewish people.

The shame is you see a difference.

Look, I see what you are saying.

That said, I don't see a way to force service without your money winding up in the pocket of someone who still won't believe they should have to serve you.

That is what I believe Question was talking about.

[ed2962]

If Afro-Americans weren't so concerned with rubbing elbows in white society and spent their time and energy developing and investing in and their own communities, we could have achieved more unanimity. A solid fist has more power than five individual fingers. But it doesn't make much difference now, considering the current social and political landscape.

It was less about rubbing elbows with white society and more about fighting against being denied resources and avenues for achievement.

[Kirby101]

Look, I see what you are saying.

That said, I don't see a way to force service without your money winding up in the pocket of someone who still won't believe they should have to serve you.

That is what I believe Question was talking about.

That is how minds change. By letting them see that everyone is human. By not letting them discriminate and isolate themselves.

[numberthirty]

That is how minds change. By letting them see that everyone is human.

Man...

One guy's take?

The guy in questions' religion has had a really long time to change their minds. You seem to believe in their ability to change far more than I can.

[Old Man Ollie 1962]

It was less about rubbing elbows with white society and more about fighting against being denied resources and avenues for achievement.

We could have relied more on international resources and avenues for achievement, which is what Garvey, Du Bois, and Malcolm X advocated.

[ed2962]

We could have relied more on international resources and avenues for achievement, which is what Garvey, Du Bois, and Malcolm X advocated.

Nothing wrong with that, but why shouldn't we be able to demand it from the country we already live in and in fact was built on our free labor?

[Old Man Ollie 1962]

Nothing wrong with that, but why shouldn't we be able to demand it from the country we already live in and in fact was built on our free labor?

Why beg from the oppressor? And a benevolent master is still the master of your social and political destiny none the less. Reparations for slavery will never come to fruition any more than the original indigenous people of this country getting their lands back.

[Adam Allen]

Minus the xenophobia and isolationism. But that was then. It's the filthy rich vs the vastly increasing dirt poor now.

That's where it was always headed, anyhow. It was baked into the blueprint of Capitalism from the time it was allowed that some people could be so dirt poor as to literally be someone else's capital. Profit from the crushing, miserable poverty of those at the bottom has always been part of the plan ... we've just had increasingly more people and increasingly concentrated wealth, along with increases in technology, education, and communication that make the pattern more clear to more people.

Why beg from the oppressor? And a benevolent master is still the master of your social and political destiny none the less. Reparations for slavery will never come to fruition any more than the original indigenous people of this country getting their lands back.

It's true that direct reparations for African Americans is not going to happen, but it's also true that our nation-states and international borders will become more clearly irrelevant, because multi-national corporations only care about the profit margin -- not about flags or anything else.

[ed2962]

Why beg from the oppressor? And a benevolent master is still the master of your social and political destiny none the less. Reparations for slavery will never come to fruition any more than the original indigenous people of this country getting their lands back.

I don't think reparations will ever come about, but I don't think that demanding for equal rights and fighting systemic racism is the same as begging.

[Kirby101]

Man...

One guy's take?

The guy in questions' religion has had a really long time to change their minds. You seem to believe in their ability to change far more than I can.

I've seen it with evangelicals when they find that one of their children is gay.

Giving their discrimination a pass and letting them keep doing it without repercussions will NOT change anything.

Also, I don't read The Question as saying why give your money to these people;

Note to homosexuals. Would you really want to eat a wedding cake made by someone who thinks your lifestyle is an abomination? The Help chocolate pie scene. You can have your cake but would you really want to eat it?

I see it as don't anger them or they will do something to you. Again, not an acceptable response to discrimination.