Action Comics #46 discussion

[Myskin]

I can't say this with any certainty because I'm not in anyone's head, but it feels--just feels, again I don't know--like even the creators have lost the enthusiasm for this story.

Yeah, I've got the same impression. I don't know if that's the case, but this often happens when a reboot is on the horizon, or some kind of editorially mandated conclusion/relaunch. The writers already know about it and they don't "dare" anymore.

[manofsteel1979]

yeah...I'm over this story. I will follow it to it's end...but I really don't care anymore, because it's clear the creators don't care anymore. I think that some of the places the writers, especially Pak wanted to go was likely shut down by editorial so that now it's just your average overblown crossover.

I wonder if the combined backlash from fans reguarding the Lois situation and the faux outrage drummed up by Fox News over the police brutality controversy and Superman punching the cop scared editorial into demphasizing the more controversial aspects of the story in favor of a more bland and conventional direction. If so, it's a shame.


I'm ready for the status quo to return and, as Ascended said, for the books to go their own way and tell their own stories for a year or more. No more crossovers, dammit.

[adkal]

...and the faux outrage drummed up by Fox News over the police brutality controversy and Superman punching the cop...

I had no idea that that had happened...

Must have been a really slow news day.

[Tayswift]

yeah...I'm over this story. I will follow it to it's end...but I really don't care anymore, because it's clear the creators don't care anymore. I think that some of the places the writers, especially Pak wanted to go was likely shut down by editorial so that now it's just your average overblown crossover.

I wonder if the combined backlash from fans reguarding the Lois situation and the faux outrage drummed up by Fox News over the police brutality controversy and Superman punching the cop scared editorial into demphasizing the more controversial aspects of the story in favor of a more bland and conventional direction. If so, it's a shame.


I'm ready for the status quo to return and, as Ascended said, for the books to go their own way and tell their own stories for a year or more. No more crossovers, dammit.

so the blame go to lois fans? it's not like they ever hear us about this. even if it was the case, we had enough abuse from dc and from fans, writers should know better.
I don't know ,marvel on captain america had him fight racists and fox pick up that. it doesn't look like will affect nick spencer plans. azzarello and snyder approached police brutality on batman, and azzarello will do again on DK3

I just think it was badly planned, it will go until issue 50th that is th emonth batman vs superman will debut and seems to be a big month for the books. so things get dragged a lot

[manduck37]

I found this issue pretty boring as well. It really felt like filler. Wrath is a pretty lame villain and the story is really dragging. Plus that whole "Superman is the monster now!" play by Wrath was incredibly weak. The sudden attempt to add some depth or a unique perspective for Wrath really fell flat. I can't wait for this story to be over. I agree in that it really feels like the creative teams lost interest in this one. We could have had an interesting revival of Golden Age Superman for a brief time, battling corrupt cops and crooked politicians. Instead we get cheesy shadow monsters and one dimensional, mustache twisting villains.

[manofsteel1979]

so the blame go to lois fans? it's not like they ever hear us about this. even if it was the case, we had enough abuse from dc and from fans, writers should know better.
I don't know ,marvel on captain america had him fight racists and fox pick up that. it doesn't look like will affect nick spencer plans. azzarello and snyder approached police brutality on batman, and azzarello will do again on DK3

I just think it was badly planned, it will go until issue 50th that is th emonth batman vs superman will debut and seems to be a big month for the books. so things get dragged a lot

I'm not blaming Lois fans...I'm blaming editorial for getting cold feet from the combined over reaction of the most extreme Lois fans ( which initially even I was a part of) and Fox news making an issue of Superman punching the cop. Combined with the luke warm reaction sales wise and the rumors of DC distancing themselves from the unconventional takes brought on by DC YOU, it's very possible editorial steered the story away from what Pak and co originally intended.

It's also possible that what we are getting is what was always intended. if so, then it's clear no one knows what to do with the franchise.

I am more convinced we need to clean house editorially and perhaps creatively when it comes to superman. Not a continuity reboot, but a new direction and set of eyes. I like Pak and Kuder and think they can still contribute...but everyone else needs to be reevaluated. ..even Pak and Kuder possibly.

[Ascended]

I look forward to SM/Action/BM&SM as these are the books I collect just for Kal.

I didn't mind the issue but it didn't blow me away either. I like Wrath, I think she is pretty cool for a Villain. I was like WTH when I saw Frankie though...I didn't even know he existed in the DC world...I must of missed some important issues or something... I was waiting for Kal to say; "What? Frankenstein? There is no such thing!" LOL

I didn't hate the issue but I don't see myself re-reading it for many many years...

This version of Frankenstein was introduced in Grant Morrison's Seven Soldiers. He had a four issue miniseries and also showed up for the 7S one-shots that bookended the story. It is so very much worth looking into. For my money its one of the best things Morrison ever did with the DCU.

Frankie also had a short lived series when the New52 began, where he's an agent of SHADE. I heard good things but the first issue didnt impress me enough for me to stick with it. Competition at the time was too stiff.

I'm not blaming Lois fans...I'm blaming editorial for getting cold feet from the combined over reaction of the most extreme Lois fans ( which initially even I was a part of) and Fox news making an issue of Superman punching the cop. Combined with the luke warm reaction sales wise and the rumors of DC distancing themselves from the unconventional takes brought on by DC YOU, it's very possible editorial steered the story away from what Pak and co originally intended.

It's also possible that what we are getting is what was always intended. if so, then it's clear no one knows what to do with the franchise.

I am more convinced we need to clean house editorially and perhaps creatively when it comes to superman. Not a continuity reboot, but a new direction and set of eyes. I like Pak and Kuder and think they can still contribute...but everyone else needs to be reevaluated. ..even Pak and Kuder possibly.

I dont see much of an issue with Pak and Kulder. I think Kulder doesnt get enough credit for Action, but both of them seem to have a great grasp on the character and his nuance. They've put out some great stuff but dont seem to do as well with the big crossovers. Honestly, the only times they've dropped the ball at all has been the Tower mini-arc, which was overshadowed by DOOMED, DOOMED itself, and the back-half of TRUTH. But the Zero Year issue, Subterra, Bizarro-World....even Horrorville ended up being pretty decent after a slow start and the first few issues of TRUTH were solid as hell.

Editorial certainly needs a top-down overhaul, and the entire line needs....something. Maybe it just needs room and time to breathe and develop. I think at this point its clear there is no quick fix (which is what Ive been saying since long before the reboot). New editors, a mandate that Didio, Johns, Lee, and Harras stay away from the titles (none of them seem to get him and Didio has admitted as much) and quite possibly a new creative roster other than Pak and Kulder.

I also think its past time for the line to stop being afraid. I very much get the feeling that there is real reluctance to allow Superman to step into the 21st century. Just the fact that Clark is back at the Planet is sad. Sure, the blog thing might not have been the answer, but nothing about the Planet or Clark's job there feels contemporary. And I have seen some amazing ideas posted in places like this that keep the basic principals and purpose of the mild mannered reporter without feeling out of step with time.

Superman's the Man of Tomorrow. I wonder when DC is going to remember that and let him out of 1980?

[Myskin]

And I have seen some amazing ideas posted in places like this

Ha, the memory lane! ;-)

Superman's the Man of Tomorrow. I wonder when DC is going to remember that and let him out of 1980?

Well, I think that at this point it is pretty clear that Superman is not a priority as a solo character anymore at DC. He has still a high value as a supporting character - as in Batman v Superman or in the JL titles, where he always seems to get the short end of the stick (I mean, he had the worst character development of them all in Darkseid war where he became Negative Bully, pie-eating Superman for no reason at all). But as a solo character we can only hope that some enlightened editor reads American Alien and succeeds in putting it into continuity.
Anyway, from a purely creative point of view, I think that DC is in the worst situation since pre-Flashpoint, and not only because of Superman.

[kingaliencracker]

The truly disappointing thing about all of this is I finally felt that the Superman titles (and Superman as a character) were/was getting really good right before TRUTH and after a sluggish start to the reboot. Nothing was world-breaking but it seemed like Pak, Kuder, Johns, and JRJR were gaining steam and the character felt like Superman again.

I don't know who developed TRUTH but this is a story that I wholeheartedly disagreed with from the get-go, because there are only two ways it could possibly end; a) we have a radically knew status quo that strips away elements that make Superman great (i.e. Clark Kent and his supporting cast), or; b) they hit a giant reset button and none of it actually happened (i.e. Spider-Man and "One More Day"). It also feeds into the notion that Superman is too powerful and too "good" to be written consistently. But if they were going to do it, REALLY do it. Go for broke. But that hasn't really been the case. Instead, a 6-month story has felt like 2 years and nothing has really happened, even though on the surface Superman getting his ID exposed should be one of the biggest things to happen in the DCU. It's boring, which is pretty much the worst thing you can possibly say about anything in entertainment.

For me, it just needs to end and they need to pretend like it never happened. It's disappointing because I like Pak, but if he has to go in order to get things back to normal then whatever. But whatever the payoff ultimately is the story so far has not been worth it.

[Tayswift]

The truly disappointing thing about all of this is I finally felt that the Superman titles (and Superman as a character) were/was getting really good right before TRUTH and after a sluggish start to the reboot. Nothing was world-breaking but it seemed like Pak, Kuder, Johns, and JRJR were gaining steam and the character felt like Superman again.

I don't know who developed TRUTH but this is a story that I wholeheartedly disagreed with from the get-go, because there are only two ways it could possibly end; a) we have a radically knew status quo that strips away elements that make Superman great (i.e. Clark Kent and his supporting cast), or; b) they hit a giant reset button and none of it actually happened (i.e. Spider-Man and "One More Day"). It also feeds into the notion that Superman is too powerful and too "good" to be written consistently. But if they were going to do it, REALLY do it. Go for broke. But that hasn't really been the case. Instead, a 6-month story has felt like 2 years and nothing has really happened, even though on the surface Superman getting his ID exposed should be one of the biggest things to happen in the DCU. It's boring, which is pretty much the worst thing you can possibly say about anything in entertainment.

For me, it just needs to end and they need to pretend like it never happened. It's disappointing because I like Pak, but if he has to go in order to get things back to normal then whatever. But whatever the payoff ultimately is the story so far has not been worth it.

truth was planned by all 4 writers and pencillers of superman books because the editors wanted a change of status quo. It was editorially mandate.
some time ago i read on outshousers what snyder/capullo batman success is that less editorial interferences is one of the factors it is so successful. gordon batman was snyder idea.

there is some delays, for me they are dragging the story to march. probably a order from high ups to keep the storyline going until march and then we have superman fully powered. some changes on dcyou already undone like aquaman and ww costumes.

like you said the changes were too drastic, so I own't be surprise if very little changes on superman books

[lorddominicus85]

I read action and Superman, jumped on both titles when Truth started and while I agree Superman has been somewhat lackluster, I think Action Comics has been very good. This issue is clearly setting up the next issue, getting all the pieces where they need to be for the big fight. So I can see why some would feel like the issue fell flat but for me it just makes me more excited for the next issue. I don't think Pak is writing lazy, I think he's doing the best he can with the story he and the other writers came up with, whether it was mandated or not, whether he and the other writers though it up or not, I think he's doing his best with it and I very much like it.

It would be nice to see the Superman books have less crossover after Truth wraps and give Pak a chance to really run free with this idea and not have to worry about tying into Vandal Savage but it is what it is and we will have to wait and see on that front.

Somebody mentioned the whole back at the planet thing and how DC is afraid to take Superman into the 21st century and I have to agree. I feel like Superman as a character out grew the Daily Planet, while it was necessary to put him there at the start of the New 52 I thought they were really on to something when he quit and started his blog. I'd of loved to see that carry on with Clark uncovering stories as Superman and then writing about them as Clark. Think of the huge controversy in the media once it was uncovered they were the same person, all the people who Clark brought down as an online blogger are suddenly brought into question because he gained the evidence and the story as Superman so it was under false pretenses. And then to carry forward with that after Truth where Clark continues to make posts and write stories from his seclusion trying to expose the bigger threats out there besides him hiding his identity. I mean if you look at how most people digest news these days it's from the internet and different blogs and political web sites so Clark running with that idea, creating his own website or blog calling it TRUTH.com or something where he uses what he knows as Superman to expose people like Lex or Hordr etc.

Sorry I got off on a rant.

I liked the issue, wasn't great, it'll read better in trade which is a form of writing I'm not a huge fan of but it is what it is.

[Ascended]

Ha, the memory lane! ;-)

Well, I think that at this point it is pretty clear that Superman is not a priority as a solo character anymore at DC. He has still a high value as a supporting character - as in Batman v Superman or in the JL titles, where he always seems to get the short end of the stick (I mean, he had the worst character development of them all in Darkseid war where he became Negative Bully, pie-eating Superman for no reason at all). But as a solo character we can only hope that some enlightened editor reads American Alien and succeeds in putting it into continuity.
Anyway, from a purely creative point of view, I think that DC is in the worst situation since pre-Flashpoint, and not only because of Superman.

Oh, I think its quite true that DC/WB no longer see Superman as a viable property and most likely continue to push him as they are because of his merchandising clout. As of 2013 he was the fourth biggest grossing character in comics, which isnt bad at all for a guy who has only had one movie in (almost) a decade compared to Spider-Man, Batman, and the Avengers, who have been in the public eye a whole lot more lately. That alone says quite a bit about his merit; even though DC hasn't handled him well for decades, he's still a major force.

My only real hope is that DC/WB realize that the problem isnt with the character itself, but with their inability to use him right. So with any luck at all, someone with a brain in their head and some authority will step and say "Okay, we're not making it work. We need to put someone in charge who does get it, and then leave them alone".

How a guy who started out fighting against government corruption and social injustice can be seen as outdated today is beyond me. We're right back where we were seventy-seven years ago and Superman should be enjoying the biggest come back in comics history.

I hear that DC was letting the character flounder because of the lawsuit, so if things didnt go their way they wouldn't have to pay the heirs as much as they would have for a fully functioning and profitable franchise. But it seems like business acumen has come back to bite them in the ass.

Dammit DC, just give me the character and the phone numbers for the talent you haven't scared away yet and I will make Superman a Top Ten seller within three years. And he'll stay there as long as I'm editing. Hell, I'll do the job for minimum wage just to prove my point.

[Dispenser Of Truth]

An issue so 'eh' that even Superman fist-fighting Frankenstein couldn't get me going. Sloppy storytelling in places too. Pak is clearly burned out on this, and with the editorial situation for Superman over the last few years, I don't blame him. Hopefully it should pick back up once Truth gets closer to the finale.

[Sacred Knight]

The Kryptonite powers coming up sounds interesting. With that, and indeed the likelihood of it being the last part of the story, hopefully things pick up in all titles before end. That's my hope at least. Then like we're hoping maybe things can go their individual ways again for a decent amount of time afterward.

In any case I disagree that the only two ways this ends is losing his supporting cast or hitting the reset button. Those are options, but there's also a middle ground. A middle ground that sounds too intriguing for me to want to entertain DC is stupid enough to not go for. And that's having Superman regain his abilities, still have his identity public knowledge. How does this not ruin the Clark Kent side and supporting cast? By expanding on "Kentville". Clark's neighborhood has been established now as a place that, mostly, is welcoming and open to Clark still being there despite knowing he's Superman. There's some bad apples but for the vast majority the're totally pro-Superman. So use that, like his Fortress, let this neighborhood be his safe haven as Clark. A place he can walk down the street out of costume and just be treated as one of the guys. You not only have a place here where Superman can dial down despite his identity being known, but its also a place ripe with supporting cast opportunities.

[Ascended]

One can hope, Sacred, one can hope.

But I cannot for the life of me see DC having the balls to stick with any part of this current status quo when they've received so much backlash from it. Marvel might have the stones to say "No, we're gonna stick with it and you guys will see what a great idea it is once the dust settles" but DC caves too easily to the fans.