What is ANAD? I'm Confused.

[jackolover]

In Old Man Logan (ANAD) #1, Logan writes the names of 4 people that have to be killed

Butcher
Banner
Mysterio
Red Skull

3 of them are now dead that I know of, all except Mysterio. Does anybody know if Mysterio is dead as well?

[jackolover]

So are we supposed to understand ANAD (after Secret Wars) is supposed to show how dysfunctional the super heroes are? I know that Maria Hill and Carol Danvers made some questionable decisions with Kobik and the Inhuman Ulysses, but the super heroes are being thought of conceited and egotistical in forming complex systems to proliferate their process of law enforcement. Are we to understand also, that this has been a failure in regard to protecting Earth, and that super heroes have to be controlled so they never form groups again, especially ones with club houses?

I have long been trying to put a theme to the rebirth of the Marvel Universe after its collapse, and have been unable to catch sight of what is going on here, but to see so many super heroes tap out recently, (in Secret Empire #6), and admit all the bad, happening in the MU is their fault, is like all the criticisms in CWI against the super heroes were always true. It goes against my sensibilities to think super heroes are due this kind of treatment.

[JKtheMac]

So are we supposed to understand ANAD (after Secret Wars) is supposed to show how dysfunctional the super heroes are? I know that Maria Hill and Carol Danvers made some questionable decisions with Kobik and the Inhuman Ulysses, but the super heroes are being thought of conceited and egotistical in forming complex systems to proliferate their process of law enforcement. Are we to understand also, that this has been a failure in regard to protecting Earth, and that super heroes have to be controlled so they never form groups again, especially ones with club houses?

I have long been trying to put a theme to the rebirth of the Marvel Universe after its collapse, and have been unable to catch sight of what is going on here, but to see so many super heroes tap out recently, (in Secret Empire #6), and admit all the bad, happening in the MU is their fault, is like all the criticisms in CWI against the super heroes were always true. It goes against my sensibilities to think super heroes are due this kind of treatment.

No I don't think so. In reality it was just a creative burst, once the writers were set free by Secret Wars and before that the success of Now. It is natural for very creative periods to be divergent and sometimes confusing. An awful lot of 'All-Newness' hit the racks, all at once. I don't think that is a bad thing, and I certainly don't believe the recieved wisdom that it was a misstep. Any business making plans after a creative burst is going to look closely at where the successes were, and what didn't work in the marketplace. Then they will naturally make plans to move ahead with the more successful directions. We will see what happens with Legacy, but from its very name, it is not going to be a return to anything.

In universe, many of the story cycles that were designed to be short term, are comming to fruition. We have already had the big IvX fight that was on the cards from the start, Spider-Man is heading for a reset to a less successful status-quo, Thor is literally heading towards her death, and probably into Valhalla and beyond. The Iron Man mantle was always set to be temporary. Doom can't always be Iron Man, and Iron Heart is naturally being set up as a seperate hero. The same can probably be said of lots of the other stories I am not reading.

I doubt Marvel plan things out in phases, but they occur anyway, because culturally they emerge, and we define them as we start to recognise patterns.

I have long suggested that Marvel would slowly work towards a situation where their heroes are more aspirational and less burdened. The younger heroes and books like Champions, have made interesting moves in that direction, and I hope that book will remain successful. For the long term Marvel can't rely on forty something readers sticking around for another twenty years, and even those that do probably don't agree with all the negative rhetoric that is constantly thrown around. This reader approaching 50 certainly doesn't.

[Digifiend]

In Old Man Logan (ANAD) #1, Logan writes the names of 4 people that have to be killed

Butcher
Banner
Mysterio
Red Skull

3 of them are now dead that I know of, all except Mysterio. Does anybody know if Mysterio is dead as well?

Hopefully Spider-Men II will answer this. You see, Mysterio was last seen trapped in the Ultimate Universe, due to events in the first Spider-Men.

[DJ1107]

It's a brand name for a post-SW relaunch line. Same Universe but jumped 8 months ahead to avoid that icky character development readers really hate to understand what what's going on.

People say it's a reboot but it's not Certain AU characters just happen to end up on the mainstream Universe because Miles gave Molecule Man a soggy burger.

[JKtheMac]

It's a brand name for a post-SW relaunch line. Same Universe but jumped 8 months ahead to avoid that icky character development readers really hate to understand what what's going on.

People say it's a reboot but it's not Certain AU characters just happen to end up on the mainstream Universe because Miles gave Molecule Man a soggy burger.

People say it was a reboot because the world ended and was rebooted. That's pretty conclusive.

[DJ1107]

People say it was a reboot because the world ended and was rebooted. That's pretty conclusive.

I guess when I think reboot I usually think what DC does.

[JKtheMac]

I guess when I think reboot I usually think what DC does.

<Shudder>
What is important is what the writers percieve it to be. Look at Ultimates for example, with Ewing free to bring in NewUniversal characters that we would never have seen in the MU without the free hand that ANAD brought. Premising his story on the fact that this universe is brand-new, and vulnerable.

And somebody should start a count of how much many 1610 characters have been walking around, we must be over fifty by now. With whole teams turning up here and there, most recently in X-Men Blue.

[WhiteQueenEmmaFrost]

America's
Next
Animated
Diva

[Digifiend]

<Shudder>
What is important is what the writers percieve it to be. Look at Ultimates for example, with Ewing free to bring in NewUniversal characters that we would never have seen in the MU without the free hand that ANAD brought. Premising his story on the fact that this universe is brand-new, and vulnerable.

And somebody should start a count of how much many 1610 characters have been walking around, we must be over fifty by now. With whole teams turning up here and there, most recently in X-Men Blue.

Between Spider-Man, X-Men Blue, and Ultimates2, we have:

• Reed Richards/The Maker
• Miles Morales/Spider-Man
• Ganke Lee
• Lana Baumgartner/Bombshell
• Judge
• Rio Morales
• Jefferson Davis
• Jimmy Hudson
• Mach II
• Armor
• Pietro Lensherr/Quicksilver
• Guardian
• Steve Rogers/Captain America
• Bruce Banner/Hulk
• Janet van Dyne/Wasp
• Hank Pym/Giant-Man
• Antonio Stark/Iron Man

Anyone else in 616?

[jackolover]

Hopefully Spider-Men II will answer this. You see, Mysterio was last seen trapped in the Ultimate Universe, due to events in the first Spider-Men.

Here's hoping Digifiend.

[jackolover]

Let's take a look forward from the 616 to the ANAD. The ANAD is a shocking version on the 616.

Look at it : if you were coming across it from a lost space capsule, what do you see when you step out onto the land, and the people come to rescue you?

For starters, the people who rescue you, have to scurry away to face future predictions of events. The super criminals have all been rounded up and put in a dream world where they live like suburbians. And off in the distance? The Government of the day is run by a warped rendition of Captain America who is spreading the philosophy of Hydra, so you better get away fast before they pick everybody up and put them in internment camps for being opposite to Hydra teaching.

This is what looking at the ANAD looks like when coming from the 616.

[Raye]

Except it's not like all those things are happening simultaneously. Pleasant Hill happened, which led to Cap being Hydraized, but he kept it secret, no one knew outside of a select few, it also led to Pleasant Hill being shut down. Then Civil War II happened, and while Hydra Cap was involved, and the fact that he was a secret villain definitely played into it, again, no one at the time knew that. Then Civil War II ended, Ulysses ascended or whatever, so there are no more future predictions, (from him, anyway) and Secret Empire came along, and the cat was let out of the bag with Cap. So yeah, connected, but the hypothetical space capsule stumbling across it would only see one of these things happening.

Also, I mean, it's comics, crazy shit happens constantly

[jackolover]

Except it's not like all those things are happening simultaneously. Pleasant Hill happened, which led to Cap being Hydraized, but he kept it secret, no one knew outside of a select few, it also led to Pleasant Hill being shut down. Then Civil War II happened, and while Hydra Cap was involved, and the fact that he was a secret villain definitely played into it, again, no one at the time knew that. Then Civil War II ended, Ulysses ascended or whatever, so there are no more future predictions, (from him, anyway) and Secret Empire came along, and the cat was let out of the bag with Cap. So yeah, connected, but the hypothetical space capsule stumbling across it would only see one of these things happening.

Also, I mean, it's comics, crazy shit happens constantly

We've never seen anything like this tried before. Every time they tried some law enforcement it just got worse and worse. It's why Occupy Avengers was started, because the super hero genre lost its way. They killed the Hulk! I know the space capsule visitors wouldn't have seen the whole picture all at once, but if they stayed there long enough, as observers, first no super villains, then no occurrences of attacks, then the sweeping Hydra Government clamping down on anything resembling super human activity, or Aliens. The whole place shut down because of what is going on in ANAD.

[nnelg]

Between Spider-Man, X-Men Blue, and Ultimates2, we have:

• Reed Richards/The Maker
• Miles Morales/Spider-Man
• Ganke Lee
• Lana Baumgartner/Bombshell
• Judge
• Rio Morales
• Jefferson Davis
• Jimmy Hudson
• Mach II
• Armor
• Pietro Lensherr/Quicksilver
• Guardian
• Steve Rogers/Captain America
• Bruce Banner/Hulk
• Janet van Dyne/Wasp
• Hank Pym/Giant-Man
• Antonio Stark/Iron Man

Anyone else in 616?

When did Ultimate Banner show up?