Star Wars 7 - The Spoilers Awaken :)

[DrNewGod]

To me all the subtleties of the film indicate Luke is her father, not Han. If Han was ever intended to be her father at some point, I think it was changed. It just doesn't wash with the finished film. ... Of course I'm sure this is exactly the type of debate the crew wants coming out of the film. So anything's possible at this point. ...

It would serve us all right if Rey has no connection to anybody we've ever seen before.

[Sacred Knight]

Poe Dameron is that character. Probably Finn too, unless he ends up being a Calrissian or something.

[RobinFan4880]

It would serve us all right if Rey has no connection to anybody we've ever seen before.

These movies are all about the Skywalker family. We need someone with that name to carry on the legacy (Solo just doesn't have the same gravitas as Skywalker). Rey is the best fit.

To me all the subtleties of the film indicate Luke is her father, not Han. If Han was ever intended to be her father at some point, I think it was changed. It just doesn't wash with the finished film. I'd like to imagine there would have been more subtle indications in interaction via creative writing between Han, Leia, and Rey in this regards if it was a situation where she was their daughter but for some reason they couldn't tell her. But I'm not getting that feeling. Leia for example clearly cares for Rey, but her reaction to seeing her doesn't really align to the strength of her emotions when talking to Han about her son.

Of course I'm sure this is exactly the type of debate the crew wants coming out of the film. So anything's possible at this point. My opinion certainly is biased in the direction that I want her to be Luke's child, I'll admit. There would be something just a tad askew to me in the narrative to not have a Skywalker by name in this trilogy. I know, even if she were a Solo she'd still have Skywalker blood from Leia, but its just not the same to me. Plus to me they could play on a dynamic of Kylo's insecurities with this. He's obsessed with his grandfather, wants to emulate him, but he's the son of a smuggler and the daughter who didn't become a Jedi. Meanwhile Rey has the name, she has the grand master father, she has what he wants.

Perfect explanation.

Also, she has the lightsaber he wants.

[taylortexas]

These movies are all about the Skywalker family. We need someone with that name to carry on the legacy (Solo just doesn't have the same gravitas as Skywalker). Rey is the best fit.

Being Leia's son, Kylo Ren is technically a young Skywalker. That doesn't rule out Rey being Luke's daughter but one way or another the family legacy continues.

[C_Miller]

Being Leia's son, Kylo Ren is technically a young Skywalker. That doesn't rule out Rey being Luke's daughter but one way or another the family legacy continues.

But Kylo Ren is not the POV character.

I don't take an issue with Rey being a Skywalker. Star Wars takes it's cues not from the old serials. It's not Movie, Sequel, Sequel, Prequel, Prequel, Prequel, Sequel. It's rather chapters out of a giant tome. The mythological epic of the Skywalker Family. At it's heart, I feel like the core Star Wars movies should be one story and the intent of that story changes when you have two acts of the story feature the Skywalker Family as the POV and then shift it to something else entirely.

But where the prequels fail, this succeeds with giving us some ancillary characters that aren't related to the Skywalkers except through circumstance. Poe and Finn are going to make this section of the story great in the way that Han Solo made the original trilogy great.

[Sacred Knight]

If Rey had been older in the Force flashback I might have wanted to say that they'd throw a twist that she was turning to the dark side right alongside Ben, but lost her memory and got a do-over, ala Revan.

[PretenderNX01]

Poe Dameron is that character. Probably Finn too, unless he ends up being a Calrissian or something.

Yeah I feel like Poe and Finn are our new, unrelated characters and Rey and Kylo Ren are our sort of Luke/Leia but if they were cousins and Luke was evil

I left the theater not caring one way or the other. I knew what to expect. My nephew and his friend were disappointed with Finn's character. As I said, I knew what to expect.

I'm still hoping he does more in the sequels. I was really afraid they were going to kill him off at the end for Rey and I was "oh, dear" but then she picked him up and they had a heartbeat at the base so I figured a bacta tank for him (too bad we missed a bacta tank cameo and just got lying on a table)

Unrelated question: I'm in no hurry, but I'm curious how long before good manners and common sense agree that the spoiler limit has expired?

I think for safety's sake I'm only going to post them un-hidden in this thread at least through the weekend if not further but for sure this weekend as it is still "opening" so through then. I don't know if mods have a rule for that?

[Xenon]

he really didn't strike me as whiny,he was easily the most imposing villain we've seen Vader in Empire, VERY easily superior to any of the villains we saw in the prequels, everything from his movement, body language, his style of speech, the voice modulation(which i think aided a LOT), etc

I really loved all the new characters, Ren, Finn, Rey, BB8, and Poe. The next movie needs more Poe.

The prequels have their issues, but villains aren't one of them. Darth Maul fights two Jedi to a standstill before killing one of them. Darth Tyrannus beats TWO Jedi before fighting to a standstill with a third (and keep in mind that Anakin, Obi, and Yoda are among the most powerful Jedi around to boot). Kryo Ren throws hissy fits, gets shot (which is a bad mark against a force-senstive saber-wielder), and then gets taken down by a rebellious storm trooper and a scavenger with no experience fighting.

You can't take the guy seriously. He's already been undermined by getting beat in every fight he's been in. Vader went two movies undefeated. Maul killed Qui-gon, Dooku beat Anakin, Obi, and tied with Yoda.

Anyone know where they filmed that? That looked amazing. Was it all location, or did they build a set?

EDIT: I mean build props/set on location.

I believe the Island scene at the end was filmed at Skellig Michael, an Island off the coast of Ireland.

More than any of the generals of the Empire could with Vader, it seems that Hux can verbally go toe-to-toe with Kylo.

The black-and-red flags, the formation of the assembled crowd of Stormtroopers, the trenchcoats at that Death Star scene, all invoked a very Third Reich feel, very powerful

Tarkin bosses Vader around in A New Hope, don't forget. Also it's not really that impressive to go toe-to-toe with Kylo Ren.

*pours a 40oz* for



Best scene in the movie were to Storm troopers on patrol when Ben was going nuts and were like "nope"

Yeah that was pretty good.

I actually liked the little bait-and-switch they did there. It opens with Poe and the village being attacked by the First Order, then FN-etc bails Poe out and for a while it looks like we'll be focusing on both of them... only for Poe to get swallowed up and Finn really asserting himself throughout the rest of the movie after he meets Rey.

I wasn't as much of a fan of that, only because it really felt like Finn's role int he movie was to be a decoy. To distract people into thinking he was the lead instead of Rey.

Rey was the best part of the movie for me, partly because of the brilliant bait and switch. They never showed her as the one with the light sabre in the lead up, but it turns out Rey is the one with the Force. Brilliant!

And she is a very strong character. Unlike Luke, she acts a lot on her own accord! She needs no saving - SHE does the saving. She gets herself out of prison and faces down Ren, if not single handed, as the major protagonist. Loved the symbolism of her and Ren facing each other on either side of the widening crevasse. Nobody actually won and he was badly injured to begin with, but you get the sense that she is the one with the real sense of agency about her. Very very good!

Ugh can't agree with this either. I like Rey's personality, but in a lot of ways she very much came off as a Mary Sue.

I thought he over did it a bit with the screaming at the end of his speech, also would of liked to have seen him display more military leadership or whatever generals are supposed to do. The First Order were a bit of a letdown in that respect, they didn't seem that much more capable then the Empire despite all their serious looking characters.


Yeah she didn't do much in the end and when Han says let's chuck her in the garbage compactor I guess her fate is left open for a return... But I don't know why they didn't make her the one to fight Finn with the electric rod instead of some random Stormtrooper.

Few thoughts:
-Really hope Rey is NOT Luke's daughter, that would just be too predictable and too safe. The Skywalkers are integral to the franchise but we have enough of them now. There are other strong force users out in the galaxy, would prefer they do something new with her parents.

-One question that is really bugging me is Snoke Darth Plagueis? Have done a bit of googling and it's not a stretch to imagine... But Munn have slightly more elongated heads from the looks of it, but then again most Sith are pretty messed up looking.

-The Mandalorian banner hanging above Maz's place was a nice little touch.

[Hiromi]

The prequels have their issues, but villains aren't one of them. Darth Maul fights two Jedi to a standstill before killing one of them. Darth Tyrannus beats TWO Jedi before fighting to a standstill with a third (and keep in mind that Anakin, Obi, and Yoda are among the most powerful Jedi around to boot). Kryo Ren throws hissy fits, gets shot (which is a bad mark against a force-senstive saber-wielder), and then gets taken down by a rebellious storm trooper and a scavenger with no experience fighting.

You can't take the guy seriously. He's already been undermined by getting beat in every fight he's been in. Vader went two movies undefeated. Maul killed Qui-gon, Dooku beat Anakin, Obi, and tied with Yoda.

Soooo how a villain does in a fight scene is the be all end all of how good a villain is to you then? Never mind Maul's two words or dialogue, zero personality, zero character growth(you'd need character to begin with to have growth), he existed as a plot point, not a character. Likewise Dooku existed solely to serve as Anakin's dark side crossing moment at the beginning of episode 3 and the plot designated villain in episode 2, again minimal dialogue, no character growth, not a character but a plot point. I'm sorry but your litmus test for how good a villain is is shallow and boring as Hell, a good villain is a character, not a plot point.

And why do people act like a Sith pitching fits is something new? We have 5 movies of Vader doing the same thing, whether it's going on his "you're holding me back" rants as a teen, summarily executing any officer who makes a mistake in his presence, choking someone in a meeting just because, if anything Ren's more restrained than Vader by virtue of keeping his tantrums confined to inanimate objects. The whole thing about the Dark Side is you DON'T control your emotions, you let them run rampant and fuel the dark side.

[Buried Alien]

Soooo how a villain does in a fight scene is the be all end all of how good a villain is to you then? Never mind Maul's two words or dialogue, zero personality, zero character growth(you'd need character to begin with to have growth), he existed as a plot point, not a character. Likewise Dooku existed solely to serve as Anakin's dark side crossing moment at the beginning of episode 3 and the plot designated villain in episode 2, again minimal dialogue, no character growth, not a character but a plot point. I'm sorry but your litmus test for how good a villain is is shallow and boring as Hell, a good villain is a character, not a plot point.

Kylo Ren also did something that no other Dark Side practitioner has done to date...look like he was about to embrace the Light Side for a moment, before pulling a complete 180 and heading back to the Dark Side.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

[Hiromi]

Kylo Ren also did something that no other Dark Side practitioner has done to date...look like he was about to embrace the Light Side for a moment, before pulling a complete 180 and heading back to the Dark Side.

Buried Alien (The Fastest Post Alive!)

That scene makes me hope he's never really redeemed, that looking at the trilogy as a whole a few years from now that's his Moral Event Horizon as TV tropes calls it, we've done the redemption story already.

[brettc1]

To me all the subtleties of the film indicate Luke is her father, not Han. If Han was ever intended to be her father at some point, I think it was changed. It just doesn't wash with the finished film. I'd like to imagine there would have been more subtle indications in interaction via creative writing between Han, Leia, and Rey in this regards if it was a situation where she was their daughter but for some reason they couldn't tell her. But I'm not getting that feeling. Leia for example clearly cares for Rey, but her reaction to seeing her doesn't really align to the strength of her emotions when talking to Han about her son.

Of course I'm sure this is exactly the type of debate the crew wants coming out of the film. So anything's possible at this point. My opinion certainly is biased in the direction that I want her to be Luke's child, I'll admit. There would be something just a tad askew to me in the narrative to not have a Skywalker by name in this trilogy. I know, even if she were a Solo she'd still have Skywalker blood from Leia, but its just not the same to me. Plus to me they could play on a dynamic of Kylo's insecurities with this. He's obsessed with his grandfather, wants to emulate him, but he's the son of a smuggler and the daughter who didn't become a Jedi. Meanwhile Rey has the name, she has the grand master father, she has what he wants.

Luke being her father would make her and Ren cousins, so there is a familial connection.

But it just seems weird to me that Like would leave his child with the guy running that scavenger base. At least in his case he had Obi-Wan watching over him. Rey is just flat out abandoned as what looks like a six year old.

There are some clues that Han knows more than was revealed but we can't be sure what. The sabre seems to respond to her. But in a world where clones exist, there are many possibilities. Even being a clone of Anakins mother is not impossible.

Speaking of which, Finns parentage might also be a reveal. Finn Calrissian?

[brettc1]

Soooo how a villain does in a fight scene is the be all end all of how good a villain is to you then? Never mind Maul's two words or dialogue, zero personality, zero character growth(you'd need character to begin with to have growth), he existed as a plot point, not a character. Likewise Dooku existed solely to serve as Anakin's dark side crossing moment at the beginning of episode 3 and the plot designated villain in episode 2, again minimal dialogue, no character growth, not a character but a plot point. I'm sorry but your litmus test for how good a villain is is shallow and boring as Hell, a good villain is a character, not a plot point.

And why do people act like a Sith pitching fits is something new? We have 5 movies of Vader doing the same thing, whether it's going on his "you're holding me back" rants as a teen, summarily executing any officer who makes a mistake in his presence, choking someone in a meeting just because, if anything Ren's more restrained than Vader by virtue of keeping his tantrums confined to inanimate objects. The whole thing about the Dark Side is you DON'T control your emotions, you let them run rampant and fuel the dark side.

When Vader loses his temper he does it with class. Anakin is such a different character, whiny and petulant, that it's almost impossible to believe they are the same person. Which is a big problem for many people watching the prequels. how did this guy become one of the coolest villains in history?

And no, the Sith arent totally ruled by their emotion. They use them to channel the force, which is far easier than the dispassionate control of the Jedi (as Yoda points out) But they aren't psychotic.

[the nomad]

I saw it earlier today with a few friends and much like Kylo Ren I'm conflicted.

Pros (Light-side I guess): Superbly acted. I never had any doubt that the cast would fail to deliver on any of the scenes. IMO the torch has successfully been passed to the new generation so good job on the casting. I felt all the emotions especially during the confrontation with Han and Ren. I liked the chemistry between Boyega and Ridley (Finn and Rey) and I'm sure that the next two movies are going to build upon their obvious attraction unless they pull a 180 next movie and try to sell a Poe and Daisy thing even though they practically had no interaction in the movie.

And Leia...General Leia excuse me. Fisher fell right back into place almost as if no time had passed at all, as did Ford as Solo. I'm looking forward to them fleshing out more her loss of not only Han but her Son to the Darkside. I mean Han did tell her that Ben was gone and she refused to believe it and that's how he ended up dead so if she wasn't sure before I'm sure she's sure now.

Also chewie's reaction to Han's death. Awesome Wookiee roar. It got real at that moment. and Wookiee fingers??? I've got to go back to the originals and see if I see any wookiee fingers. LOL!

The film is visually stunning, especially in IMAX, it is beautiful. The explosions pop out, the lasers and lightsabers. My eyes were mesmerized. The aliens were amazing and I laughed out loud at Simon Pegg's character.

Ariel dog fights, Awesome.

And finally I liked part of the plot. And that part is that it's central around finding Luke who has vanished. I like that Luke is a central character but not a central character at the same time. You don't see him until the end (Kinda disappointed about that but I'll touch on that in a minute.) and it's very satisfy once you do see and everyone in the theaters knew what he was feeling when Rey showed up with his and his father's Lightsaber.......it's time to stop hiding and it's time to fight. I liked that alot.


Cons (The Darkside LOL): Right off the bat my first conflict is with Finn. Finn is the whole reason why I was so invested in the Force awakens when the trailer dropped. I mean the story was there, an ex-stormtropper who abandon's the first order to fight against them. And I hated, hated that JJ and the crew pulled a friggin bait and switch. All the promos and trailers showed him with the lightsaber and he only used it twice and got beat both times, yet Rey who has no...not even stormtrooper training beats Kylo Ren. WTF JJ. I mean Luke lost to Vader the first round, which is the same parrallel between Kylo and Rey at this point.

Come on JJ or whoever wrote Episode 7, couldn't you have made both Finn and Rey force sensitive. Although I'm still holding out hope that Finn is force sensitve but maybe he's low key with it like Leia. I base this off of a few scenes in the movie. One when PHasma, Ren and Huxx were talking about the stormtrooper learning protocols ore whatever and that they were trained from birth to fight for the first order and yet Finn some unknown rebels against the mind training and that's when Ren starts talking about clones or something, I gotta see it again. But yeah that scene, the first scene in the movie when Finn was in the village at the beginning and Kylo Ren looked at him, there was a moment where seemed like he sensed something but he blew it off and then later when they said a Stormtrooper helped Poe escaped he immediately spouted Finn's trooper number.

So maybe Finn still might develop/ be called to the Force. Leia didn't know she was force sensitive until Empire Strikes back or was it Return of the Jedi. That's debatable.

Next Conflict......No Poe. I mean he was built up as this big deal and he got shafted with so few scenes. Yeah he blew up the sun weapon but there was a one off sentence on how he escaped from Jakku. I think he should've been with Rey and Finn. He was awesome in the scenes he got but he definitely needs more in the next movie.

SUpereme Leader snoke felt flat to me...maybe because we didn't see him in person or I was expecting something else...idk. Maybe the next movie will fix that.

Finally Rey. Daisy was great with what was given but she just seemed too good at everything she did. And I think JJ and the writers want us to believe that it's just the force awakening in her....NAH. I don't buy that because not even Luke was like that in the first movie, it wasn't until he met Yoda that he actually displayed any significant force powers....although he did escape from the Wampa.

Anyway again, she is untrained and she beats Kylo with no problem....although he was injured to begin with. Finn softened him up LOL! Not only that but she uses a Jedi Mind trick? I still don't buy that she's just sooo powerful with the force that she can do all of this stuff with no guidance. It doesn't add up to me. And the whole mystery surrounding her parents. If it turns out to be Luke, I'm going to groan, b/c that would be terrible. We already have a Skywalker (Ben Solo/Kylo Ren).

I think Rey has no ties to anyone and this is Disney perhaps branching away from the Skywalker family and to a new family that's powerful in the force. It is a Saga after all and saga's never truly end, only the characters change. SO I wouldn't be surprised if we don't find out anything about her family until maybe Episode 9 which will probably lead into episode 10, 11, 12.

[The Whovian]

Just got back from movie myself. I absolutely loved it. I've been reading a lot of the posts on here and you guys seem to think that Rey is not Luke's daughter, but in that scene where she touches Luke's saber, and then falls backwards out of the room, that bug eyed lady said to her----"You deny it, but you know who you are. Take the saber." Why would she say that to her if she wasn't Luke's daughter? And why would the force be so strong in her?

To me, the movie pretty much said she was Luke's daughter without actually stating it.