Count Nefaria vs X-Men

[The Dork Knight]

Feats for Nefaria being pure energy ?

Cause otherwise Bobby can just impale him and be done with it

[HulkSmash666]

Feats for Nefaria being pure energy ?

Cause otherwise Bobby can just impale him and be done with it

It's been mentioned a couple of times that his body is pure ionic energy, like Wonderman is. I don't have the issue numbers or scan at hand right now but I'll find them soon.

Also, for arguments sake, let's say Nefaria ISN'T pure energy, how is Iceman impaling someone with an icicle who has bounced Mjolnir off his chest? Or hurt someone who has had Vision "impaled" inside him?

[The Dork Knight]

Because he didn't do that in the actual comic, only the cover and a recollection. In the comic he used his fist to stop it . Because Vision doing so hurt him badly . Because Bobby has an eternity to keep doing so and Nefaria has a pretty specific limit of ionic powers upto a few weeks IIRC

[HulkSmash666]

So you're argument is that Bobby wins by using an attack that won't work, over and over again until eventually after WEEKS of ionic energy usage (leaving out the fact Nefaria has the ability to fly at superspeed off somewhere to recharge, seeing as how he's also an energy-vampire who can drain and absorb energy, and it takes Thor-level attacks to even damage him) until he's weak enough that Bobby can then....what? Freeze a smaller amount of energy that he couldn't freeze in the first place?

Doesn't make sense to me, dude.

[The Dork Knight]

Why will it NOT work ? Given he's yknow dropped Thor with it ?

Fly off where ? Going out means a ring out win for Bobby . The arena IS already Bobby .

When's Nefaria drained or absorbed energy ? For that matter still waiting on why freezing him wouldn't work . Still waiting for him to be proved as some kind of energy being

[HulkSmash666]

How is ICE hurting a Superman-level being? What good does impaling Nefaria with ICE (how is even piercing his skin for starters? ) when he's made of energy? And how would he do that against someone who can blitz the bejeezus out of them? Plus Nefaria has his eye beams, which basically keep Bobby in a vapourized state. Sure, only slows Bobby down but it keeps him busy while Nefaria stomps the rest of the team. In the second or two it'd take his body to reform from a steam cloud, Nefaria has dismantled his team mates, leaving Bobby with Nefaria's undivided attention. It's basically a stalemate cause neither can hurt the other enough (if at all) permanently.

But if the fight was left up to the judges (a UFC reference here lol) then they'd score the bout in Nefaria's favour, because while Nefaria can't actually kill Bobby, vaporising him over and over again keeps him out of the fight, and the fact Bobby can't hurt Nefaria at all means Nefaria would score points on the offensive. Nefaria isn't technically defeating Bobby permanently, but he can at least damage/disrupt his physical body enough to count as doing SOMETHING, when Bobby in return can basically do NOTHING to hurt Nefaria.

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

Why will it NOT work ? Given he's yknow dropped Thor with it ?

Fly off where ? Going out means a ring out win for Bobby . The arena IS already Bobby .

When's Nefaria drained or absorbed energy ? For that matter still waiting on why freezing him wouldn't work . Still waiting for him to be proved as some kind of energy being

Was very specifically amped for the Thor thing. Even still, this is also ignoring the fact that Thor's pretty much ignored the Casket of Ancient Winters being opened up in his craw, prior to this.

[The Dork Knight]

How is ICE hurting a Superman-level being? What good does impaling Nefaria with ICE (how is even piercing his skin for starters? ) when he's made of energy? And how would he do that against someone who can blitz the bejeezus out of them? Plus Nefaria has his eye beams, which basically keep Bobby in a vapourized state. Sure, only slows Bobby down but it keeps him busy while Nefaria stomps the rest of the team. In the second or two it'd take his body to reform from a steam cloud, Nefaria has dismantled his team mates, leaving Bobby with Nefaria's undivided attention. It's basically a stalemate cause neither can hurt the other enough (if at all) permanently.

But if the fight was left up to the judges (a UFC reference here lol) then they'd score the bout in Nefaria's favour, because while Nefaria can't actually kill Bobby, vaporising him over and over again keeps him out of the fight, and the fact Bobby can't hurt Nefaria at all means Nefaria would score points on the offensive. Nefaria isn't technically defeating Bobby permanently, but he can at least damage/disrupt his physical body enough to count as doing SOMETHING, when Bobby in return can basically do NOTHING to hurt Nefaria.

You keep talking about physical attacks not affecting energy beings yet fail to show proof of Nefaria being some sort of energy being

Ice pierces Thor because it's being hurled into him by an omega level mutant . It's comics . It happens because it happens .

I'm not convinced Nefaria can actually burn something that is rolling around at absolute zero unless he has feats for his (heat?) vision for the same , not that it matters anyway for someone who can reform out of moisture , and certainly not before he covers Nefaria in ice himself

[The Dork Knight]

Was very specifically amped for the Thor thing. Even still, this is also ignoring the fact that Thor's pretty much ignored the Casket of Ancient Winters being opened up in his craw, prior to this.

He didn't have the Death Seed when he swallowed up Thor and had him half frozen in a graveyard in Astonishing X men 65 iirc . In any case they make it a point to note that the Death seed never amped him but unleashed his hidden potential or whatever


Casket of Ancient Winters? Didn't that freeze Odin ?

[Anarchist]

The point is, even if we would not grant Iceman the ability to freeze Nefaria's blood, impale him or whatever, without BFR Nefaria has literally nothing to keep Bobby down.

Just for the coolness of the feat, Iceman recently literally froze HELL

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

He didn't have the Death Seed when he swallowed up Thor and had him half frozen in a graveyard in Astonishing X men 65 iirc . In any case they make it a point to note that the Death seed never amped him but unleashed his hidden potential or whatever


Casket of Ancient Winters? Didn't that freeze Odin ?

Which isn't where he's at, normally.

Odin was in the Odinsleep, IIRC all it did was cover his body in ice.

[StupidMoniker]

And unless Iceman has feats where he's freezing energy (and I'm referring to 616 Bobby, not AoA Iceman or even Emma Frost-possessed Bobby) then I'm skeptical whether Bobby can effect Nefaria's ionic energy.

Didn't Bobby freeze a nuclear reactor explosion or some such fairly recently?

[The Dork Knight]

Which isn't where he's at, normally.

Weelll... He's been in an elemental form for a while now and him not operating at those levels seems to be more PIS than vice versa . Dude can't get killed or anything , he's pure ice ...him not being an omega level threat seems to be more stupid than him finally cutting loose

Odin was in the Odinsleep, IIRC all it did was cover his body in ice.

Odin was fighting him at full power till Surtur summoned the casket and froze him. Thor no selling that shit in light of that makes the feat an outlier

[Anarchist]

Didn't Bobby freeze a nuclear reactor explosion or some such fairly recently?

That's one weak feat in comparison, really.

Like I showed above, he froze HELL.

[The Dork Knight]

He's also frozen Hulk (on multiple occasions ) and Ben off the top of my head so it's not like it's a huge outlier or something

Also for the Odin thing ....the only limitation he had was that he couldn't grow to giant form because of the Twilight sword , which given he could only stalemate Surtur in that form later in the story anyway,doesn't seem to matter too much . He couldn't move or do anything after being frozen till Willis put the casket back together and withrew all its power back to it