Secret Wars 9 *Spoilers*

[DrTraveler]

So Secret Wars 9 is officially out. Spoilers and thoughts ahead:

spoilers:

Seriously, Spoilers. I warned you. The book basically breaks into three pieces. There's the Doom/T'Challa battle that serves as the finale of Battleworld. Doom wins but realizes that this was all a distraction and leaves without killing T'Challa. He wisely flees to find Owen where he's confronted (verbally) by Susan, who has learned he killed Strange. Doom finds that even though he wants to stay and fix this, he has to move on towards Owen and regretfully leaves Susan and Val. In the Molecule-cave(tm) The Maker has predictably turned on Reed but managed to forget about Molecule Man in his arrogance. Molecule Man saves Reed and does away with The Maker. Doom arrives to confront Reed but finds that Owen has reduced them to the same powerlevel. Owen wants to hear Reed's side too. There's fistcuffs galore as Reed and Doom work through years of mutual history culminating in Doom admitting that Reed would have done a better job of it. Owen agrees, Battleworld appears to end (more on that later) and T'Challa uses the Time Gem to save his life. We move to Act III Here we find that T'Challa has time travelled back to the events of New Avengers Vol 2 Issue 1. Things play out right up to the point where the incursion is discovered only this time there is no incursion, just the birth of the Wakandan space program. Continuity fixed! (More later). We find Reed rebuilding the multiverse with Owen and Franklin's help. Sue, Reed, and the Future Foundation are planning to go on the greatest adventure of all and we learn that Reed is the one to fix Doom's face. It's a silent scene at the end with Doom, but immensely powerful as we see Doom ultimately learned a powerful lesson (think the quiet epilogue to Infinity Gauntlet with Thanos and Warlock). The END!

end of spoilers

[KOSLOX]

So Secret Wars 9 is officially out. Spoilers and thoughts ahead:

spoilers:

Seriously, Spoilers. I warned you. The book basically breaks into three pieces. There's the Doom/T'Challa battle that serves as the finale of Battleworld. Doom wins but realizes that this was all a distraction before killing T'Challa. He wisely flees to find Owen where he's confronted (verbally) by Susan, who has learned he killed Strange. Doom finds that even though he wants to stay and fix this, he has to move on towards Owen and regretfully leaves Susan and Val. In the Molecule-cave(tm) The Maker has predictably turned on Reed but managed to forget about Molecule Man in his arrogance. Molecule Man saves Reed and does away with The Maker. Doom arrives to confront Reed but finds that Owen has reduced them to the same powerlevel. Owen wants to hear Reed's side too. There's fistcuffs galore as Reed and Doom work through years of mutual history culminating in Doom admitting that Reed would have done a better job of it. Owen agrees, Battleworld appears to end (more on that later) and T'Challa uses the Time Gem to save his life. We move to Act III Here we find that T'Challa has time travelled back to the events of New Avengers Vol 2 Issue 1. Things play out right up to the point where the incursion is discovered only this time there is no incursion, just the birth of the Wakandan space program. Continuity fixed! (More later). We find Reed rebuilding the multiverse with Owen and Franklin's help. Sue, Reed, and the Future Foundation are planning to go on the greatest adventure of all and we learn that Reed is the one to fix Doom's face. It's a silent scene at the end with Doom, but immensely powerful as we see Doom ultimately learned a powerful lesson (think the quiet epilogue to Infinity Gauntlet with Thanos and Warlock). The END!

end of spoilers

Doom didn't spoilers:

kill T'challa. T'challa used the time gem and went back to the beginning of an altered NA #1

end of spoilers

Maybe I'm misreading your post but the way it's written suggests that.

[MindofShadow]

Before killing T'challa?


wut?? How did you misread it that bad?

[DrTraveler]

Before killing T'challa?


wut?? How did you misread it that bad?

Mistype on my part. I meant to say before he was going to kill T'Challa he realized it was a distraction and left. Fixed up above.

[DeathFalcon182]

I re read it, got clarity on lot of things and I like it mote now that I know what I'm talking about for the most part. 1 bit I didn't like was the huge info dump at the end of the series. When fans draw comparisons between Hickman and Morrison for their high concept storytelling, I see their point. I think where Morrison prevails is his dialogues tend to be less exposition heavy than Hickman's. Also he pretty much establishes all the concepts before hand so that his final act of the sory or epilogue is genuine character moments instead of exposition dump. I wish Hickman could've achieved that, it would've made the finale a solid 9/10. Regardless this was a fun ride through and through. I'm looking forward to Hickman's next Superhero project even more.

[DrTraveler]

Doom didn't spoilers:

kill T'challa. T'challa used the time gem and went back to the beginning of an altered NA #1

end of spoilers

Maybe I'm misreading you're post but the way it's written suggests that.

Fixed. I did not mean to imply that but you're right, it does read that way.

[InformationGeek]

As an ending for his Fantastic Four work, I'm sure it was fine (though Ben and Johnny got the shaft at the end). As an ending for his Avengers run, it was a letdown, but yet fairly accurate representation of it. Lots of buildup, men making hard decisions, and big threats... but ended in a fairly anti-climactic way. Flip the reset switch, erase pretty much his entire Avengers run from existence (thanks for three years of nothingness I suppose), and it's all good. MAKES IT EASY!!

Also, thank you Ribic for detailing Valeria's butt in the final pages. That was soooooooo needed. *Gag noise*

[DrTraveler]

As an ending for his Fantastic Four work, I'm sure it was fine (though Ben and Johnny got the shaft at the end). As an ending for his Avengers run, it was a letdown, but yet fairly accurate representation of it. Lots of buildup, men making hard decisions, and big threats... but ended in a fairly anti-climactic way. Flip the reset switch, erase pretty much his entire Avengers run from existence (thanks for three years of nothingness I suppose), and it's all good. MAKES IT EASY!!

As I said above, while Avengers is clearly the lead in to Secret Wars, Secret Wars is also NOT the end of his Avengers. That book ends the way it ends: Cap and Tony trying to kill each other as the last incursion happens. It's a real downer ending. The greatest superhero team of all not just fails, but completely implodes at the end. It's going to take a long while to digest that ending.

[InformationGeek]

As I said above, while Avengers is clearly the lead in to Secret Wars, Secret Wars is also NOT the end of his Avengers. That book ends the way it ends: Cap and Tony trying to kill each other as the last incursion happens. It's a real downer ending. The greatest superhero team of all not just fails, but completely implodes at the end. It's going to take a long while to digest that ending.

I already digested the ending and found it unsatisfying. Not because they failed (though that point didn't affect me on any level since I knew everything was just going to be perfectly fine in the end due to the fact that everything would go back to the normal status quo at some point), but because Hickman's Avengers run wasn't very good and the ending felt very boring.

[1drman]

Also, thank you Ribic for detailing Valeria's butt in the final pages. That was soooooooo needed. *Gag noise*

I have to step in here. Normally i agree on things like this. I skipped a whole run of a book i liked because the first issue had a closeup of a 16 year old character's butt in the first issue.

But when Ribic does it, I don't criticize him because he's consistent across age and gender. Valeria was wearing the same material as Susan, so it makes sense. And if you havent noticed, take a look at the dudes. Sometimes when I read his stuff I have to double take. I wish god had drawn me the way he draws male super heroes. Captain Britain in the second issue is a good example. I'm surprised more girls don't read his stuff.

[DrTraveler]

So on to some points, non spoilery:

Battleworld: As we know, Battleworld exists in the ANAD Marvel and we see how important it is. Battleworld serves as the initial seed and starting point of everything. This isn't a huge surprise as the nature of Battleworld clearly implied this fate.

Continuity Snarl: A lot has been made of how the Time Runs Out arc that follows the Infinite Avengers and Great Society arc caused a lot of continuity snarl with other things going on. Secret Wars resolves this in the predictable "Infinity Gauntlet" way. I'm guessing if someone gets to sit down with Hickman and Tom B. the explanation is that the main Avengers run happens as printed right up to Infinity. About Infinity things get tougher. I'd imagine that story still happens with some minor modifications. After that Avengers World happens more or less as printed through the first 14 issues while the rest of the Avengers title likely does not. New Avengers simply doesn't happen at all. No spoiler tags here as this is pretty much how the books have to happen for Axis and a lot of the current run to make any sense.

Secret Wars and Avengers: Hickman's Avengers run is clearly the prequel to Secret Wars, but Secret Wars is clearly NOT the ending for the Avengers run. I kept hoping that there'd be an epilogue for his Avengers run but that didn't happen. The finale of Avengers is clearly meant to be their failure and Tony and Steve fighting it out as the world ends. Again, this isn't a spoiler as if the Avengers were going to be a big part of Secret Wars it would have happened by now. It still makes that run annoying. No grand victory for the Avengers. Just failure.

All in all I'm happy with Secret Wars itself, it just further pushes down his Avengers run in my view.

[vitruvian]

So on to some points, non spoilery:

Battleworld: As we know, Battleworld exists in the ANAD Marvel and we see how important it is. Battleworld serves as the initial seed and starting point of everything. This isn't a huge surprise as the nature of Battleworld clearly implied this fate.

Continuity Snarl: A lot has been made of how the Time Runs Out arc that follows the Infinite Avengers and Great Society arc caused a lot of continuity snarl with other things going on. Secret Wars resolves this in the predictable "Infinity Gauntlet" way. I'm guessing if someone gets to sit down with Hickman and Tom B. the explanation is that the main Avengers run happens as printed right up to Infinity. About Infinity things get tougher. I'd imagine that story still happens with some minor modifications. After that Avengers World happens more or less as printed through the first 14 issues while the rest of the Avengers title likely does not. New Avengers simply doesn't happen at all. No spoiler tags here as this is pretty much how the books have to happen for Axis and a lot of the current run to make any sense.

Secret Wars and Avengers: Hickman's Avengers run is clearly the prequel to Secret Wars, but Secret Wars is clearly NOT the ending for the Avengers run. I kept hoping that there'd be an epilogue for his Avengers run but that didn't happen. The finale of Avengers is clearly meant to be their failure and Tony and Steve fighting it out as the world ends. Again, this isn't a spoiler as if the Avengers were going to be a big part of Secret Wars it would have happened by now. It still makes that run annoying. No grand victory for the Avengers. Just failure.

All in all I'm happy with Secret Wars itself, it just further pushes down his Avengers run in my view.

Except if New Avengers doesn't happen (as would be suggested by no Incursions happening from the point T'Challa first encountered them), then there's literally nothing for the Squadron Supreme to be mad at Namor about... at least not the Namor that exists on this new Prime Earth. It's also really unclear how they, and Blue Marvel, and others are even aware that the discontinuity between iterations of the universe/multiverse exists, or that the world was under threat or in a crisis if the Incursions were never seen. I had thought at least some of these issues would be addressed in the finale.

Still, I like the idea of Reed and co... basically the Future Foundation sans Ben and Johnny... being sort of multiversal demiurges as well as explorers.

[Haquim]

Everything lives.

Such constrast with Ultimate End.

[craybest]

sad truth, but if the FF are restoring the multiverse, doesn't that mean that they would also restore the Ultimate universe?

[Derek Metaltron]

What's still underwhelming about the ending to what has otherwise been a great event is how the destruction of Battleworld and all those numerous people and realities is just a side note, because ultimately only Reed, Doom, Black Panther and Miles matter. I also laugh at people who consider this a reboot because outside Miles and a tiny handful of characters like Old Man Logan and Maker, Doom's face, Wakanda in space and the FF becoming gods, the 616 Marvel Universe is still exactly the same, any other changes are in those eight months post Battleworld. Not that it not being a reboot is a bad thing, because nobody wants one.

Spare a thought for all those great alternative takes on characters we'll probably never see again though - Gladiator Steve Rogers, Chrissie Pryde, the Parkers of the Regency, Technopolis, the War Zone, the Avengers of the West save Red Wolf and the rest.