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  1. #901
    Astonishing Member TheRay's Avatar
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    Gatekeeping in anyway. Comics should be open to all.
    The more the merrier.

  2. #902
    Ultimate Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRay View Post
    Gatekeeping in anyway. Comics should be open to all.
    The more the merrier.
    How do you mean? Are there people who say certain people shouldn't read comics? I guess I stay away from that part of fandom.
    There came a time when the Old Gods died! The Brave died with the Cunning! The Noble perished locked in battle with unleashed Evil! It was the last day for them! An ancient era was passing in fiery holocaust!

  3. #903
    Astonishing Member TheRay's Avatar
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    People who respond dismissively to someone's "wish list".

  4. #904
    Ultimate Member Gray Lensman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    How do you mean? Are there people who say certain people shouldn't read comics? I guess I stay away from that part of fandom.
    More along the lines of dismissing other people's fandom - "A REAL fan would know..."
    Dark does not mean deep.

  5. #905
    Astonishing Member LordMikel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirby101 View Post
    How do you mean? Are there people who say certain people shouldn't read comics? I guess I stay away from that part of fandom.
    On another forum we were discussing this.

    I basically said, "Yes, everyone should be welcomed n for reading comics."

    The one guy's response. "No, we should keep the industry as niche and only allow people who agree with us in."
    I think restorative nostalgia is the number one issue with comic book fans.
    A fine distinction between two types of Nostalgia:

    Reflective Nostalgia allows us to savor our memories but accepts that they are in the past
    Restorative Nostalgia pushes back against the here and now, keeping us stuck trying to relive our glory days.

  6. #906
    Astonishing Member TheRay's Avatar
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    I don't understand that. So long as you respond appropriately, people who disagree with you can only benefit your fandom.

  7. #907
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    Their hypocrisy, valorization of any thing from before the modern age which borders on obsessive.

  8. #908
    Spectacular Member Obeythemoderators's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    Their hypocrisy, valorization of any thing from before the modern age which borders on obsessive.
    Kinda depends on what side of the fandom tho. I mean Batman fans almost seems to want to pretend that Batman did not exist until the 70's since in the silver age he and his stories could get really goofy and there was Batmite. They also dislike the golden age because Bob Kane traced allot of his artwork and Batman kills on occasion. When it comes to Superman tho I wonder if most of his fans are even fan of the comic book character or just the 70's film starring Christopher Reeves the way they act.

    Then you got the Spider-Man fans who's love for the classic ideration of the character has ruined him if you ask me.

  9. #909
    Incredible Member Xheight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRay View Post
    Gatekeeping in anyway. Comics should be open to all.
    The more the merrier.
    Not sure that is possible as fandom isn't just a blind devotion to the medium but comes from those parochial interests of representation. It is what makes a fan a fan of something. Take that away or change it too drastically and you get into genre busting. I am reminded of the two Lego movies and how it starts out being this one kid's riff on Dad's universe but it totally comes apart when the rest of the family brings its ideas of fun and cool into the mix. The movies wrap it up as one big happy mess of creativity but that is an external value not one that makes sense to the players internally. Why should the kids care about creativity or their siblings ideas because it is only fun over the things you share in common. I am going to hate on Squirrel girl because she just messes with my idea of Dr. Doom and there is nothing that is going to convince me that is fun or cool.
    And if the whole wide world stops singing
    And all the stars go dark
    I'll turn a light on in my soul
    And keep the bluebird in my heart

  10. #910
    Extraordinary Member babyblob's Avatar
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    You know I was one of the older comics are better then anything today and I would get annoyed if any one said other wise. And while the 60s Marvel are still my most often reads I have expanded to reading some more modern stuff and found a lot I loved. Such as Brand New Day and the issues after for Spiderman, and the 2014 Superior Spiderman, Ms Marvel Khamla Khan who has become one of my favorite heroes (Her and Spidey swap spots depending on who I am reading) Savage Avengers is a great read and it opened a love of Brother Voodoo for me.

    So once I quit my old man grump and got into the newer stuff I have been reading more and more comics and not just stuck on the issues of the 60's.

    On the DC side I still love the 50s and 60s and havnt read a whole heck of a lot past that but I did love Flashpoint and am working through The New 52.
    Favorite teams. Alpha Flight, Avengers, Fantastic Four, West Coast Avengers, Justice Society of America, Legion of Superheroes.

  11. #911
    Astonishing Member Zelena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xheight View Post
    I am going to hate on Squirrel girl because she just messes with my idea of Dr. Doom and there is nothing that is going to convince me that is fun or cool.
    There’s a difference between hate and not like… Squirrel Girl is not responsible for creative choices made by writers. What I don’t like in comic fandom is this personification of emotions: behind the characters, it’s the authors that tell stories. Actually, there are no such as “characters”, it’s a fictional construction.

    For me, characters are “real” because I like them. I don’t like them: they are just drawings.

  12. #912
    Incredible Member Xheight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zelena View Post
    There’s a difference between hate and not like… Squirrel Girl is not responsible for creative choices made by writers. What I don’t like in comic fandom is this personification of emotions: behind the characters, it’s the authors that tell stories. Actually, there are no such as “characters”, it’s a fictional construction.

    For me, characters are “real” because I like them. I don’t like them: they are just drawings.
    Comics and fandom though aren't like regular texts though but more like 'play' where you are on the inside. Yes, ontologically they aren't real but every fiction asks of its participant let's pretend this is real. Comics is one of the mediums that extends this 'pretend' over real time with serial participation. It would be nice if people could shut off their emotions like the TV and tune in for the next episode but that is not how we work.
    And if the whole wide world stops singing
    And all the stars go dark
    I'll turn a light on in my soul
    And keep the bluebird in my heart

  13. #913
    Extraordinary Member babyblob's Avatar
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    The writers and creators want a fan to care about these characters as if they are real. But they seem to only want that feeling if the character is loved and enjoyed. When a fan points out the flaws that keep them from liking a character then another fan or creators just brushes it off as "Relax they are not real any way."
    Favorite teams. Alpha Flight, Avengers, Fantastic Four, West Coast Avengers, Justice Society of America, Legion of Superheroes.

  14. #914
    Incredible Member Xheight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordMikel View Post
    On another forum we were discussing this.

    I basically said, "Yes, everyone should be welcomed n for reading comics."

    The one guy's response. "No, we should keep the industry as niche and only allow people who agree with us in."
    While in the extreme one has to see the point here. It is not for the fans to grow an industry for one thing and two the what they "agree" upon is being the audience they are and gave the genre much of its codes by being that audience. By that I mean a young male audience that reflected the majority of Americans who were engaged by literate things. Jocks and girls needed not apply. Unless one confused comics with comical strips that is the mostly white nerd audience that they were created for and by. By your sig I would say that Restorative Nostalgia drives a lot of this POV but I think you would have to agree that some of the best superhero comics have been more Restorative than than Reflective. I came to this recently in a FF thread that was talking about John Byrne and his New as Old variations on the genre and I think a ton of fans would say that is classic writing over genre busting work that might pose questions but is not nearly as enjoyable in the long term. That is itself the crux of nostalgia is it not - long term rereads?
    And if the whole wide world stops singing
    And all the stars go dark
    I'll turn a light on in my soul
    And keep the bluebird in my heart

  15. #915
    Astonishing Member Zelena's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by babyblob View Post
    The writers and creators want a fan to care about these characters as if they are real. But they seem to only want that feeling if the character is loved and enjoyed. When a fan points out the flaws that keep them from liking a character then another fan or creators just brushes it off as "Relax they are not real any way."
    Usually, feelings are strong when a character that is usually liked has changed… It is just not anymore recognizable: you felt for it and the link has been broken. It’s obvious then that a character is a construction and not a real person. You have to acknowledge that the pleasure you had when you read the character’s adventures is a thing of past. The illusion has popped, the reality is plain to see: the eternal return is a sham. Like everything in life, there’s no going back in time.

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