Waid's Kingdom Come and JSA II: Thy Kingdom Come

[Götterdämmerung]

Looking for opinions on these two, reputed masterpieces, plus I'm curious whether they are tied in? I'd be really grateful for any help!

[Bruce Wayne]

Just get the Mark Waid one.

The one by Johns is something of a mess imo.

[Götterdämmerung]

Just get the Mark Waid one.

The one by Johns is something of a mess imo.

The Waid seems to be practically universally praised. I took the leap on Johns' 1st JSA collection (bought the hardcover yesterday, I think it's 1-5), due to the reccomendations here. The only thing I don't like about DC in general is when there are way too many superheroes (pro wrestling anyone? ugh) with too little plot, and I also get frustrated at times with all the different universes. I'm hoping those two things don't show up too much in the Johns' JSA, but again a lot of people have praised that run to high heaven, and I'm a HUGE fan of Johns' Justice League and Green Lantern.

[Doctor Know]

Read Kingdom Come by Mark Waid and Alex Ross.

Don't read The Kingdom by Mark Waid. The Kingdom was a sequel to Kingdom Come.

Johns' Thy Kingdom Come stretched the premise too far and was too thin and took awhile to get up and go. It was hit and miss.

[Götterdämmerung]

Read Kingdom Come by Mark Waid and Alex Ross.

Don't read The Kingdom by Mark Waid. The Kingdom was a sequel to Kingdom Come.

Johns' Thy Kingdom Come stretched the premise too far and was too thin and took awhile to get up and go. It was hit and miss.

Ohhh, so it was like the theme wore out its welcome by the time Johns got ahold of it. Many thanks!

[Sirzechs]

Kingdom Come is epic definitely a must read.

The Kingdom i'd avoid honestly and the art is terrible.

Thy Kingdom Come was Alex Ross being pissed off about what Waid changed in the Kingdom essentially changing back most of it but still not as good as Kingdom Come but at least better than The Kingdom

[Bruce Wayne]

Ohhh, so it was like the theme wore out its welcome by the time Johns got ahold of it. Many thanks!

It's more like there was too many characters at that point and who couldn't get their chance to shine at that point. The first arc and the JLA/JSA crossover are probably the best as is the last issue with Stargirl.

[Götterdämmerung]

It's more like there was too many characters at that point and who couldn't get their chance to shine at that point.

You just voiced one of my few but major problems with DC comics. It happens too often in the live action films as well...witness the majority of 90s Batman films.

[BruceWayneJr.]

They're both worth a read, if you know what you're getting into.

Read The Kingdom if you enjoy the future versions of the 2nd-tier characters, like Offspring and Nightstar. It's also a fun Trinity story that taps into the multiverse, so it hits all the DC check marks. People didn't like it because it's more of a side story or off-shoot than a straight up sequel to Kingdom Come.

Thy Kingdom Come is basically just a JSA story. The best parts of it are dealing with what the book had already established prior to the "crossover." And the only Kingdom Come elements involved are Superman, Magog, and Gog, so it's not really a sequel at all. If you enjoy Geoff Johns JSA, then this story is just an entertaining continuation of that.

[Zero Hunter]

If you don't like multiple heroes than you will not like either Kingdom Come or Thy Kingdom Come since both books are packed full of characters. I think both are great reads and the ending of Thy Kingdom Come I think is the best ending for Superman I have ever seen, but from what you say I don't think you will like either. The Justice Society had 15 - 20 members on the team at that point I think.

[Götterdämmerung]

If you don't like multiple heroes than you will not like either Kingdom Come or Thy Kingdom Come since both books are packed full of characters. I think both are great reads and the ending of Thy Kingdom Come I think is the best ending for Superman I have ever seen, but from what you say I don't think you will like either. The Justice Society had 15 - 20 members on the team at that point I think.

I might have misrepresented myself, because I love the Justice League, and adore the Green Lantern Corps over any individual superhero. I just have a problem when the story lacks the interesting interaction between the heroes/villains and it just comes across as a bang em up that gets old quick (for me at least). I'm actually looking very much forward to the first JSA volume featuring Johns, which I've read is excellent. Plus Kingdom Come does seem like it contains the positive things I've mentioned above.

[Lightning Rider]

I liked it. Kingdom Come was an absolute classic so I never compared the two. I just considered it a cool story with a nice crossover. Especially because the principal theme at first is almost a deal-with-the-devil mixed with golden calf type of story. The lesson being just because someone can give you what you want the most, doesn't mean they're worth worshiping.

So yeah, read Kingdom Come, read the JSA run and you should enjoy the homage to Kingdom Come. I'd only get The Kingdom if you have nothing better to do and really loved that world. I can't say it's one of my favorites but I can't say I regret reading it just to see more of what could have been in that universe, even if I didn't like a lot of it. There's the story of Wally West's twin children, for example, in which he's depicted as basically his ordinary self, whereas in Kingdom Come it's implied the Flash is inhabiting the souls of all the Flashes and can barely interact with this plane of existence because he's so fast. (Hope I'm not giving too much away, just trying to give vague examples).

[Götterdämmerung]

I liked it. Kingdom Come was an absolute classic so I never compared the two. I just considered it a cool story with a nice crossover. Especially because the principal theme at first is almost a deal-with-the-devil mixed with golden calf type of story. The lesson being just because someone can give you what you want the most, doesn't mean they're worth worshiping.

So yeah, read Kingdom Come, read the JSA run and you should enjoy the homage to Kingdom Come. I'd only get The Kingdom if you have nothing better to do and really loved that world. I can't say it's one of my favorites but I can't say I regret reading it just to see more of what could have been in that universe, even if I didn't like a lot of it. There's the story of Wally West's twin children, for example, in which he's depicted as basically his ordinary self, whereas in Kingdom Come it's implied the Flash is inhabiting the souls of all the Flashes and can barely interact with this plane of existence because he's so fast. (Hope I'm not giving too much away, just trying to give vague examples).

This is super interesting, thank you!

[BatmanJones]

Read Kingdom Come by Mark Waid and Alex Ross.

Don't read The Kingdom by Mark Waid. The Kingdom was a sequel to Kingdom Come.

Johns' Thy Kingdom Come stretched the premise too far and was too thin and took awhile to get up and go. It was hit and miss.

I agree about Thy Kingdom Come but I just re-read The Kingdom and I really loved the Offspring story.

[Robotman]

I agree about Thy Kingdom Come but I just re-read The Kingdom and I really loved the Offspring story.

Yeah there are some bright spots in The Kingdom. The Offspring story with art by the always amazing Frank Quitely was very enjoyable. And it does bring up the concept of Hypertime. Which essentially says that every story throughout DC history happened in some way. A different take on the Multiverse. But overall not very good.

Thy Kingdom Come really isn't essential to KC. It basically just used a few of the characters and concepts from that world in the then regular continuity of DC Comics. It was an ok read. Could have been better. If you need another Kingdom Come fix after you read the initial story I'd check it out.