Are we now in the eighth iteration of the Multiverse?

[AnonymousODG]

Nods to this post:

I suspect the ‘8th iteration’ thing might be referencing other times the MU has been messed up and renewed in masisve ways, E.g. House of M and Age of Apocalypse. I dunno what the other times might be, but point is this is the same universe. Like I said its the same building made from the exact same materials arranged in basically the exact same ways...this is just the 8th time it’s been rebuilt...so basically it’s like the Xavier instittute.

So Blue Marvel makes note of how eight months ago, people are struggling to remember an event (i.e., Secret Wars), and theorizes that a multiversal renewal occurred that stabilized neutronium into Iso-8. Named for what he believes could be the eighth iteration of the multiverse.

So... do you believe the multiversal renewals were caused by events from Marvel publication history? House of M and Age of Apocalypse were mentioned as possibilities. If so, which stories do you think fit the criteria?

Thoughts?

[klefmung]

No. It is said that Galactus is from the 6th. So, Galactus' native multiverse is the 6th iteration, everything that happened from the beginning of time in the multiverse the 616 universe was in was the 7th, then the whole SW business took us to the 8th, which is more similar to the 7th than the 7th was to the 6th, because the architects are 616 natives. Though the way I figure it, the ANAD universe is the same universe as the 616, but transplanted to the 8th multiverse. It is just not 616 anymore because it was the first universe there.

[itspopularnowitsucks]

8th: Post Secret War | All-New All-Different Marvel.
7th: Pre Secret War | Everything prior,
6th: Kirby Science | except stories like origin of Galan/Galactus.
5th: Cthulhu Magic | Per Ewing nothing to do with Cancerverse creatively, though he welcome writers to tie-in the two in the future.
4th: ?? | Ewing said he has rough ideas for the first four iterations.
3th: ??
2nd: ??
1st: ??

[Radix]

The difference between secret wars and others has to do with the fact that the multiverse was destroyed and rebuilt from scratch. This is different from reality altering a la House of M. There you change reality but it is the same. Here, the universe was destroyed and rebuilt completely new. Everyone except the Future Foundation, and maybe a few others (Doom, Black Panther, etc.), is a completely new person. After all Strange, Cap, Tony, and many others died. I would assume Reed restarted the universe and some details from the incursion crisis was altered.

[JKtheMac]

Yes the challenge with Secret Wars was that the premise demanded that a reset couldn't be used. We still don't have an interview that fully explains what happened at the infamous retreat when Hickman reluctantly explained what he would do with the MU, but we know everyone creatively embraced it and commited Marvel to a renewal.

So it was baked in to have a fresh universe, and the way they achieved this without a total reboot was start the new universe in the middle. But that brings up some questions about what happened in the past. Is everything from before SW still exactly the same. Is the past ever 'real' anyway.

I can't help thinking Marvel may have done more than making a new 8 node building block for matter. I wonder if they have changed how time works. Ultimates is addressing the notion that time is still broken, I wonder if their investigations will reveal that time is now based on a new paradigm.

They certainly haven't been shy of using time travel to start new books.

[AnonymousODG]

No. It is said that Galactus is from the 6th. So, Galactus' native multiverse is the 6th iteration, everything that happened from the beginning of time in the multiverse the 616 universe was in was the 7th, then the whole SW business took us to the 8th, which is more similar to the 7th than the 7th was to the 6th, because the architects are 616 natives. Though the way I figure it, the ANAD universe is the same universe as the 616, but transplanted to the 8th multiverse. It is just not 616 anymore because it was the first universe there.

Oh, did I miss where it was said Galactus from the 6th iteration? Source?

[Ravin' Ray]

The way that the Earth of the 8th multiverse seems like a continuation of that of the 7th, aka 616, is analogous to what Hera planned when she foresaw the Chaos King erasing existence: creating a new reality, Continuum, outside of the multiverse, and have select creatures, objects and beings safely transported there.

[itspopularnowitsucks]

Oh, did I miss where it was said Galactus from the 6th iteration? Source?

Ultimates by Al Ewing, which ironically is the pic you posted.

[Jody Garland]

Not only that, but Galactus' origin going back to the late 60s' Lee/Kirby Thor run said Galen was from the previous Universe (As in, previous to the previous Universe). It was well utilized in Waid's FF, for instance.

[PyroTwilight]

Yeah. I believe in the 2nd Ultimates issue Galan of Taa and his team of ultimate (haha) explorers mention being explorers of the end of the end 6th iteration of the universe.

[Montressor]

Is the idea of Franklin sort of filling in history discussed in Ultimates? There's a fascinating blog out there that tosses around the idea that Franklin has been controlling the flow of time in 616 for 'years'. I look at things like the FF meeting The Beatles, or Cap experiencing the Bicentennial. These things occurred in 616--but a version that has since been updated, altered. Tony Stark didn't meet Rhodey during Vietnam in this current, refreshed iteration of the universe. One of my favorite Dr. Strange stories is the story of Sise-Neg, a man from the future who travels back through time and attains godhood. He ultimately ends up destroying the entire 616 completely, after which Eternity recreates everything. Its interesting that the story ends specifically on New Years Eve in 616, the year in story clearly shown (I want to say it was 1974 if my memory serves me correctly ). Cool stuff, I'd like to read more about Franklin's involvement in this.

[shooshoomanjoe]

So which stories was the universe destroyed and rebuilt? I can think of House of M, Age of Apocalypse, Infinity Gauntlet, the Kulan Gath story in Uncanny X-Men, Secret Wars, the Sphinx story in New Warriors and what else?

[Jody Garland]

So which stories was the universe destroyed and rebuilt? I can think of House of M, Age of Apocalypse, Infinity Gauntlet, the Kulan Gath story in Uncanny X-Men, Secret Wars, the Sphinx story in New Warriors and what else?

We've never seen the stories that depict the destruction of the previous Cosmoses barring Secret Wars. )I mean, technically, the end of the '90s cartoon adaptation comics tried to pass themselves off as the end of Galactus' original universe, but I think we all ignore that.) What you've mentioned are more like reality warpings or time being rewritten, not the universe being destroyed.

The First through the Sixth Cosmoses are alien and have little to do with the current Marvel Universe. You can check out the Ultimates and the Ultimates ^2 by Al Ewing if you want more info on them.

[U.N. Owen]

Per the Ultimates, we get these universes and their contributions:

[jackolover]

Per the Ultimates, we get these universes and their contributions:

These things seem obscure. A universe designated by a character? Whose character designates Universe-8 then?

To my mind Universe-8 hasn’t started yet. It can’t have, because the previous Universe-7 has finished yet. This is what Griever is here for, Entropy, because a true Universe-8 has been forestalled. I am waiting for the other shoe to drop, and Marvel admit they can’t trick the “updating” procedure they have attempted to dupe us with.