What's going on with Marvel's writing?

[thecrimson]

The first image is from Angela, where the story is told by Sera, who is the kind of smartass who would censor Bor's language in an absurdist way for comedy.

The second image is Axis Iceman, who is an over the top emo worst version of Batman in a short story with a comedic bent.

The third is a one-off Amazing Friends tribute issue of Amazing X-Men that went for screwball comedy and banter and, unfortunately, wasn't that great of an issue. Alas.

So what's going on with Marvel's writing? Jokes! Jokes are going on. If they didn't land for you, they failed, and that's a shame. (Personally, I think the first two are pretty great, ESPECIALLY Iceheart, the Axis Iceman). But they're certainly not going to land pulled completely out of context and grouped together despite appearing many, many months apart to make an implicit point that... sometimes people joke about misogyny? I'm not quite sure why they're grouped together in such a way aside from that.

Iceheart was pretty funny. He seemed very emo, I think would be the term? Talking about darkness and such.

[Galerion]

I think someone like Angela actually does work better when she's being played off someone with a sense of humour. She's too flat on her own. I think Sera is an absolutely perfect contrast with her.


How is it "straight comedy"? Typically, there's some comedy early in each issue, and then it switches focus to be a lot more dramatic. And, of course, there's usually some drama early on, as well. In this issue, the sixth story page had comedy. And then that was pretty much it for the comedy. A couple other jokes here and there. And then a great comedic moment on the second-last page. But the bulk of the issue was either action or drama. The fight against Balder, Tyr and Skurge? Not comedy. The rallying of Angela's troops? Not comedy. The section drawn by Stephanie Hans? Sure as shit not comedy.

How about #3? The first five pages were comedic, though also with some drama beneath some of the jokes. And a couple other jokes here and there. But, again, after those first five pages, it was pretty much all action and drama. #2 had very little humour. Same with #1.

That's the thing: These jokes? They're not actually a big part of any given issue. Most of the time, there's a few jokes spread throughout an issue, but most of what we see is action and drama. If the jokes that are there pull you out of the story too much? Well, that sucks, and maybe the comic isn't for you. But don't try to act like those jokes make up the bulk of each issue. The most joke-heavy issue was #3, and that was mostly because there is just no way to explain Leah and keep a straight face, because she has such a ridiculous backstory, which is part of what makes her so great.

I simply don't like the amount and kind of humor that has been put into this. You know Im reading Spider-Woman and that book is probably even more wacky but I actually enjoy it. The thing is the book makes it clear right away that it's kinda wacky. I have no problem with comedy itself but in Angelas case it simply doesn't work. As Raye has been said this book was advertised as Angela conquering Hel to free her lover. A serious thing. I didn't know that being half-comedy comes with that package.
Again this is like having a Punisher book with fourth-wall breaking Deadpool as sidekick.

[Tiamatty]

I still respectfully disagree about the need for someone for her to bounce off of. There are plenty of characters who are serious and don't need that. And even so, it could be done with a character that is less smarmy and annoying. I find Sera since the relaunch to just be grating, she's like nails on a chalk board to me.

And even if it doesn't make up the bulk of the comic in terms of panel time, the jokes and fourth wall breaking are so over the top and in your face that it still ends up dominating, and feels out of place. If this was a Deadpool comic and it was like ALL that, I would actually be ok with it for the most part. But it's not, it's an Angela comic dealing with taking over Hel to rescue her lover. The two sides are at odds with one another.

And that's a fair opinion. I enjoy it, I think Bennett pulls it off, but I also recognize it's not for everyone, and that it won't work for everyone. It's a shame that Marvel's only current LGBT solo title (Hercules doesn't count until it's said on-panel that he sleeps with guys) is also one that has elements that turn off quite a few potential readers. I just object to classing it as a "straight comedy title." That's inaccurate. And I think some of the other criticisms have also been inaccurate or unfair, so I defend the books from those. But there are fair criticisms to be had, as well.

I'm not one for the discussion of ideologies being brought up in comic books, but joke or not, this issue of Angela pushed the "men are evil" line a touch too far. It's amazing how everyone is focused on Bor, but completely ignores the accusations Angela herself (So it's not Sera "being funny") make in the very same 2 page spread.

First off, Angels are a predominantly female society, so it makes sense that they would demonize men. Think of how male-dominated cultures have succubi and witches and other evil women. Second, it's not a "men are evil" message. We see three other men - Tyr, Balder and Skurge - and none of them are actually portrayed as evil. They're portrayed as loyal to their queen, with Balder even being portrayed as sympathetic to Angela. What's happening with that dialogue is Angela talking about what Angels say about those men. That is very, very different from commenting on what those men are actually like. She's not making accusations, she's saying what she was taught by her female-dominated, Asgard-hating people.

[Seren]

Honestly I think this review does a good job explaining what Angela is about. I love the Hel out of Angela.

http://themarvelreport.com/2016/01/a...and-bloodshed/

[ed2962]

I had little interest in Angela until I read that panel.

[Dolores - The Worst Poster Ever]

Nah, it's amazing.

I can't believe I haven't been the series till now.

Marvel, if you're angering people that complain about "political correctness" and "SJWs", you're doing something right. Keep up the good work.

[MasterOfMagnetism]

Oh god, that twitter account is just downright awful.

Marvel, if you're angering people that complain about "political correctness" and "SJWs", you're doing something right. Keep up the good work.

Amen to that.

[Cloudman]

Glad I chose not to pull this book, those panels are asinine. I can't imagine why any editor would greenlight this nonsense.

[Tiamatty]

Let's be honest, no one who would feel insulted by this was actually reading Angela. It's a book starring a female character in a lesbian relationship with a trans woman of colour. Do you honestly think there's a single MRA type reading this book? The people who bitch and moan about "SJWs" were never going to be reading this anyway, so who gives a damn about them?

Actually, my general rule is to not give a damn about anyone who bitches about "SJWs" in general. I hate the attitude behind that term. When I see that term used, I immediately conclude the person's opinions are wrong. Because they're approaching the issue from a wrong-headed position that I find loathesome.


As far as the scan goes, I enjoyed it. I thought it was really funny. I understand the people who object to it from a storytelling perspective; the people who think the meta-humour in the book is distracting and doesn't fit the general tone. Those criticisms are entirely valid. I think the meta-humour works, but humour is incredibly subjective, so I won't tell someone they're wrong for not enjoying a joke. So the people who dislike the moment from that standpoint? Sure, totally fair.

The people who are bitching about it from the "damn SJWs!!!1!one" standpoint? Nope. Those people, I will call wrong.

[MasterOfMagnetism]

Let's be honest, no one who would feel insulted by this was actually reading Angela. It's a book starring a female character in a lesbian relationship with a trans woman of colour. Do you honestly think there's a single MRA type reading this book? The people who bitch and moan about "SJWs" were never going to be reading this anyway, so who gives a damn about them?

Actually, my general rule is to not give a damn about anyone who bitches about "SJWs" in general. I hate the attitude behind that term. When I see that term used, I immediately conclude the person's opinions are wrong. Because they're approaching the issue from a wrong-headed position that I find loathesome.


As far as the scan goes, I enjoyed it. I thought it was really funny. I understand the people who object to it from a storytelling perspective; the people who think the meta-humour in the book is distracting and doesn't fit the general tone. Those criticisms are entirely valid. I think the meta-humour works, but humour is incredibly subjective, so I won't tell someone they're wrong for not enjoying a joke. So the people who dislike the moment from that standpoint? Sure, totally fair.

The people who are bitching about it from the "damn SJWs!!!1!one" standpoint? Nope. Those people, I will call wrong.

Amen to this too!

[dragonmp93]

Let's be honest, no one who would feel insulted by this was actually reading Angela. It's a book starring a female character in a lesbian relationship with a trans woman of colour. Do you honestly think there's a single MRA type reading this book? The people who bitch and moan about "SJWs" were never going to be reading this anyway, so who gives a damn about them?

Actually, my general rule is to not give a damn about anyone who bitches about "SJWs" in general. I hate the attitude behind that term. When I see that term used, I immediately conclude the person's opinions are wrong. Because they're approaching the issue from a wrong-headed position that I find loathesome.


As far as the scan goes, I enjoyed it. I thought it was really funny. I understand the people who object to it from a storytelling perspective; the people who think the meta-humour in the book is distracting and doesn't fit the general tone. Those criticisms are entirely valid. I think the meta-humour works, but humour is incredibly subjective, so I won't tell someone they're wrong for not enjoying a joke. So the people who dislike the moment from that standpoint? Sure, totally fair.

The people who are bitching about it from the "damn SJWs!!!1!one" standpoint? Nope. Those people, I will call wrong.

Like everything else on the internet, normally half of the complains comes from people that have never read/play/watch/listen it anyways. Like im pretty sure that if some post were to be taken at face value, several of the posters that are complaining about the way that Extraordinary X-men is being written havent purchase it.

[GrandEleven]

Don't even know where people got that ridiculous notion from. So being a mostly straightforward and serious person means you suddenly need Harley Quinn as your sidekick or what? Tell that to Batman, Captain America, Punisher, Moon Knight, Cable, Wolverine, X-23, Black Widow, Elektra, Daredevil, Black Panther, Blade, Vision, Black Bolt and the hundreds of other characters who don't need potentially lame jokes to tell a story. It's actually the reason why some people prefer to read about those heroes and not about Spider-Man or Howard the Duck.

To be clear, I didn't say it needed to be a "wacky sidekick". Just that she needs a sidekick. Angela's story, day one, is her unwavering adherence to the laws of an Angel. Nothing for nothing. It shackles her as a character considerably more so than any of those characters you listed (except maybe blackbolt ... but his need for another to at as his voice is a bit more literal). Without a regular character to added to the mix her storyline becomes 100% predictable and robotic. THATS why i say she needs a sidekick.

I completely get that "whacky" isn't your thing, even though I rather think its a great contrast to the over-seriousness that is Angela herself. I'm merely saying that Angela without _someone_ constantly at her side won't work. Oh and while I get the parallel of Angela to Punisher, Sera isn't even close to DeadPool's league or over the top. I'd say it's more akin to Xena and Gabrielle.

[ExodusCloak]

Bor is actually a very vile character. See the New Mutants crossover annual by Gillen.

[Drakeon]

Angela is currently my fave book. Its more interesting than a Red Sonja knockoff would be.

Which is ironic given Bemnet is now writing Red Sonja.

Sera makes the book. Shes a fourth wall breaking wordplay vixen and I love it.

I also follow Bennett on twitter and shes a delight.

Yes theres comedy but the story of Angela and Sera is dark and serious, filled with gravitas.

[Pako]

Call me when Angela starts reciting from the scum manifesto.