Avengers Controversial Opinions II

[Geralt of Rivia]

Quoting a few points that I really agree with...

- Avengers should be an elite, not a synonym for Super-hero in the Marvel Universe.

- A byrule should be made excluding anyone from Dark, Secret, Young and New as Avengers, unless the have served in the main team, under one of the founders (that, at least, should serve to shrink a bit the membership, and I'm sure some explanation could be made for guys like Cage and Iron Fist to reamain Avengers).

Yes yes yes and a thousand time yes! I really dislike how Marvel allowed Bendis to dilute what being an Avenger used to mean. Only the heroes who have both what it takes and the motivation become Avengers; it seems like anyone who puts on a mask gets instant membership lately.

- Chuck Austen is the worst Avengers writer ever.

Thankfully I never read those stories, but I did read a bit of his X-Men and I can see what you mean.

-Anti heroes belong in street level teams or none than straight up super hero teams in general

This too, for instance Moon Knight is a fine character but he never belonged with any Avengers team IMO.

-Black Widow is more believable at being a spy than a super hero

I agree that spy stuff is what she does best, I dont mind her doing super-heroics though

-Bendis and Ellis are better off writing political, indie and street level teams.

Yes. Bendis for street, Ellis for political and scifi.

-Wolverine and Cap were better off hating each other

I wouldnt go as far as hate, but I do agree that they would work better keeping each other at arm's lenght.

[Iron Maiden]

I think the writers should experiment more with Loki in his weirder quirks in mythology like how he would transform into a woman and give birth to children with mortal men.

Doom did have that fantasy of Fem-Loki and Emma being chained up to his throne in that Cabal one shot story written by Hickman. Maybe that's why kid Loki is afraid of the "Doomy One"

[Hariel0079]

Uncanny Avengers should have stayed Uncanny X-Force and Remender should've been able to tell his stories how he intended them to be, they changed everything and after a year they have an Avengers title that sells only marginally better than an X-Force book, not a win in my book.

This!!

I should've definitely stayed in UXF and tie into his SA run.

[stingnewell]

I wouldnt go as far as hate, but I do agree that they would work better keeping each other at arm's lenght.

I only said that because of scans like Secret Wars


and this annual

[Geralt of Rivia]

I only said that because of scans like Secret Wars


and this annual

Hmm interesting, I never read those issues; I was mostly remembering their team up during WW2 as told in Uncanny X-Men #268, in which they first met. http://www.comicvine.com/the-uncanny...ts/4000-33256/

Scan is kinda huge, so Im just linking it -

https://dcomixologyssl.sslcs.cdngc.n...24e317d86b8b0c

Its a great issue, a couple things were later retconned somewhat in an issue of Wolverine Origins, around the time Cap came down with a spell of "Marvel-death". But still the main events still hold and I personally see that as the gist of their relationship.

[Sutekh]

and this annual

Oh, but that can't have ever happened, because everybody knows that Captain America's shield was never-never-ever made of Adamantium! It's Vibranium / Iron, and always has been, since, like, forever! Wiki says so!

[stingnewell]

Hmm interesting, I never read those issues; I was mostly remembering their team up during WW2 as told in Uncanny X-Men #268, in which they first met. http://www.comicvine.com/the-uncanny...ts/4000-33256/

Scan is kinda huge, so Im just linking it -

https://dcomixologyssl.sslcs.cdngc.n...24e317d86b8b0c

I have that issue, good comic and great art. For me I see their distrust of each other mainly for personal belief Wolverine the anti hero who believes every problem can be solved with murder while Cap has killed before prefers to find alternatives. Giving the two reasons to distance each other.

[Witchfan]

-Avengers # 200 was the worst issue that rivals Disassembled in horrid quality.

Yes. Carol was thrown under the bus. Other anniversary issues were used to throw female characters under the bus. Wanda in Avengers #500. Mockingbird in AWC #100.

[jazzflower92]

I think Amora the Enchantress should have had a more Norse or Scandinavian name. I also think she should have been a Vanir and disciple or daughter of Freya.

[Nomads1]

Oh, but that can't have ever happened, because everybody knows that Captain America's shield was never-never-ever made of Adamantium! It's Vibranium / Iron, and always has been, since, like, forever! Wiki says so!

I remember it once being described as the fisrt attempt at creating Adamantium, and as such it could be seen as an adamantium/vibranium alloy (which could be why the caption refers to it as adamantium-plus). Anyway, I don't think there was ever aa unified theory for what compromises the Alloy of Cap's shield, each writer has his own idea, the general consensus is just that it's tougher than Wolverine's claws.

Peace

[HUTHAIFA]

Simon Williams should be the Vision. He should be a ghost inside a machine. His ionic form should be so unstable that it must me housed in Vision's body. This is how it should have been from the beginning. Hell, you could do it now. Simon loves Wanda so much that he subconsciuously inhabits Vision's body to be the "man" that Wanda wants.

[Tiamatty]

Only insofar as they then show said character getting his clock cleaned to show how innane such a position is in that context.

Or, you know, to show that sometimes, talking a villain down can be far more effective than punching him. Pacifism actually works reasonably well with a character like Wonder Man, because he's powerful enough to take a villain's attacks while he tries talking. There was an A+X story where he stopped an Absorbing Man rampage by inviting him out for drinks and asking to hear his problems.

Christos Gage is a writer who's actually got a history of showing problems being solved non-violently, especially in Avengers Academy. I'd like to see that done more.

Uncanny Avengers is nothing but a "bone" tossed to X-fans who rightfully complain that Marvel has all-but ignored and badly mishandled the mutant corner of the MU for over a decade now. The book itself is nothing but an effort at "tokenism". Marvel is cynically trying to say: "See! We DO appreciate the mutants! We DO! Look at all the mutants we're promoting in this book!!!"

The reason they have done this is because Fox holds the X-rights, and therefore Marvel doesn't want to significantly promote it. They admitted as much to Liefeld years ago.

Truthfully, I'd be suspect of anything Liefeld says, if I'm remember what I've read about him correctly. Beyond that, I simply disagree with your assessment of UA. That's not the impression I got from the book. I've been hugely critical of it, but I don't think Marvel's intentions were facetious. I think they simply thought it would be a good book and would get plenty of readers.

The real "bone" thrown to disgruntled X-fans was removing Lowe as X-office editor and bringing in Marts. Lowe was the one in charge for the past few years of Scott and Wolverine being the only ones who matter. Now Marts has come in, and Storm's already gotten a huge push, while Wolverine's actually about to die temporarily.

[Nomads1]

The reason they have done this is because Fox holds the X-rights, and therefore Marvel doesn't want to significantly promote it. They admitted as much to Liefeld years ago.

As much sense as that may make, I wouldn't count on Liefield as any kind of reliable source.

I suggest he start with Busiek's run...

An excelent place to start.

I have that issue, good comic and great art. For me I see their distrust of each other mainly for personal belief Wolverine the anti hero who believes every problem can be solved with murder while Cap has killed before prefers to find alternatives. Giving the two reasons to distance each other.

Pretty much. As loyal and dependable as he may be, Wolverine suddenly becomming everybody's best bud really is one of the most ridiculous moves by Joey Q. Bendis and Co. It makes absolutely NO sense, and makes a joke out of all the syories in which this happens. Cap. Hawkeye, Spidey, The Thing (he mauled his face once, for Christ's sake. Bury the hatchet is one thing, become buddies...), etc... None of theses guys would be in the same team as Logan.

I think Amora the Enchantress should have had a more Norse or Scandinavian name. I also think she should have been a Vanir and disciple or daughter of Freya.

I find Amora one of the most interesting characters in the Thor mythos. More really should be done with her.

Peace

[Iron Maiden]

Truthfully, I'd be suspect of anything Liefeld says, if I'm remember what I've read about him correctly. Beyond that, I simply disagree with your assessment of UA. That's not the impression I got from the book. I've been hugely critical of it, but I don't think Marvel's intentions were facetious. I think they simply thought it would be a good book and would get plenty of readers.

The real "bone" thrown to disgruntled X-fans was removing Lowe as X-office editor and bringing in Marts. Lowe was the one in charge for the past few years of Scott and Wolverine being the only ones who matter. Now Marts has come in, and Storm's already gotten a huge push, while Wolverine's actually about to die temporarily.

And consider how long ago it was that Marvel had to shop around those titles like X-Men, Spider-Man, Fantastic Four, etc in order to get out of a financial crisis. The first X-Men movie came out 14 years ago so the rights were sold in the late 1990s. Why would anyone at Marvel make such a statement to Liefield when it wasn't until 2004 when they could self finance by making a deal with Merrill Lynch for $525 million. Marvel would not have been able to produce a movie on its own until then, which is why they partnered with other studios in the beginning. Avi Arad was a part of those deals and he quit in 2006. Lifield would not be made privy to anything going on at Marvel since he was long gone.

[Fokken]

I could not take Carol seriously AT ALL until she got her Mckelvie make-over.

And I'm DOUBLY glad they sponged her brain.