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  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nomads1 View Post
    Finished reading the massive Force Works TPB, yesterday. Very enjoyable. Not quite as good as WCA was for me, especially during Thomas and Ross's final run on the book, but still quite exciting. It is packed with story. IMHO, this book sure had potential. As I've said previously, the lack of artistic consistency hurts the book a bit. Rey Garcia, the inker, was the most steady member of the art team. I wish Paul Ryan or Dave Ross (both former WCA artists) could have taken over the art chores on the book in a more permenent way. As I've also mentioned earlier, I think killing off the arguably second most popular character in the book (and MY favorite Marvel character) almost right off the bat was a HUGE mistake. But it was the story they wanted to tell. Century, the character brought in the replace him, was quite interesting, but I really think they failed to show him as a powerhouse replacement for Wonder Man. Despite it constantly being said that Century had the combined skill and atributes of a hundred beings (which SHOULD have made him impressively strong), he always came across as a teleporter skilled in hand to hand combat, rather than as a powerhouse. Also, he was always too easily taken out of the board, something harder to happen with Wondy. Charactarization wise, it was refreshing to see a tough as nails, hard-ass Iron Man again, and not the usual RDJ Tony Snark of nowadays. Spi was another character that got to shine on the book. US Agent proved to be a much less disruptive presence in this book than he was in WCA, which was kind of fun, but the change feels logical, as he had finally found a place where he belonged, out from under the shadow of Captain America. The Century special at the end of the book, introduced a lot of plot threads that were sure to be followed in the main Force Works book, had it not been derailed and eventually canceled by the Crossing. Wanda's migraine's if I'm not mistaken, are explained in the Crossing issues. Storywise, I always thought that Marvel could have shipped Wand and Iron Man back to the Avengers at the end of the Crossing, and give it a go with the team continuing with War Machine, US Agent, Spider Woman, Century and maybe a couple of new members, but I guess the book wasn't selling well enough to do so. A shame, for, as I said, the book had a lot of potential, and there were plot threads left hanging that never were touched upon again.

    Peace
    The art of the first four issues was horrible. The death of Wonder Man, the failure to include Hawkeye and War Machine, and the inclusion of US Agent are what killed this book coming out of the gate. US Agent should have been the one who died.

  2. #77
    Invincible Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    The art of the first four issues was horrible. The death of Wonder Man, the failure to include Hawkeye and War Machine, and the inclusion of US Agent are what killed this book coming out of the gate. US Agent should have been the one who died.
    It might have been okay to kill Simon if they made it part of the story to bring him back. Simon is an easy character to bring back on theory. But they really killed him and he stayed dead in the book.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    The art of the first four issues [of Force Works] was horrible.
    It really was. It's unbearable. After that they brought in the old WCA artists like Paul Ryan and Dave Ross to get it on track again, but that EDGY EXTREME art was a crippling blow to the book.

    One thing I do like about Force Works is the characterization of my favorite character, the Scarlet Witch. She had always been kind of an old-fashioned character - she was wearing her old costume right up until the last issue of West Coast Avengers. The new costume was not very good (the Crossing version, on the other hand, is good). But Abnett and Lanning found a way to toughen her up without making her feel like a totally different character. It seemed very realistic that after all her many years of Avengers experience, she would like the challenge of leading a new team and resent the fact that Iron Man doesn't respect her authority.

    When she went back to the Avengers, writers brought her back to her old characterization (to the point that Busiek had her make a big deal out of whether to become deputy leader of the Avengers, even while acknowledging that she led Force Works already). But I wish Abnett and Lanning had gotten to write her for longer than they did. It was a respectful and interesting new direction for her.

    I don't recall that the migranes were explained in The Crossing, but then I don't recall much about the Crossing. I thought it might have something to do with Lore, the alternate-reality Wanda they introduced in that Scarlet Witch limited series.

  4. #79
    Astonishing Member Nomads1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    The art of the first four issues was horrible. The death of Wonder Man, the failure to include Hawkeye and War Machine, and the inclusion of US Agent are what killed this book coming out of the gate. US Agent should have been the one who died.
    It was very stylish. Not much to my liking, especially the figure-work, but I liked the designs for the technology and the interiors of the Force Works HQ and the Hex Ships. US Agent's redesigns was, IMHO, awsome also (I wonder how much of that was the artist and how much instructions by DnA). The worse offender, IMHO, was the basic design for Century. It was not interesting enough, and, IMHO, the artists that came afterwrads got stuch with that stylish extreme version as the template to follow. I always prefer when meat and potatoes kind of artists set the basic design of a character.

    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    It might have been okay to kill Simon if they made it part of the story to bring him back. Simon is an easy character to bring back on theory. But they really killed him and he stayed dead in the book.
    I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by gurkle View Post
    It really was. It's unbearable. After that they brought in the old WCA artists like Paul Ryan and Dave Ross to get it on track again, but that EDGY EXTREME art was a crippling blow to the book.

    One thing I do like about Force Works is the characterization of my favorite character, the Scarlet Witch. She had always been kind of an old-fashioned character - she was wearing her old costume right up until the last issue of West Coast Avengers. The new costume was not very good (the Crossing version, on the other hand, is good). But Abnett and Lanning found a way to toughen her up without making her feel like a totally different character. It seemed very realistic that after all her many years of Avengers experience, she would like the challenge of leading a new team and resent the fact that Iron Man doesn't respect her authority.

    When she went back to the Avengers, writers brought her back to her old characterization (to the point that Busiek had her make a big deal out of whether to become deputy leader of the Avengers, even while acknowledging that she led Force Works already). But I wish Abnett and Lanning had gotten to write her for longer than they did. It was a respectful and interesting new direction for her.

    I don't recall that the migranes were explained in The Crossing, but then I don't recall much about the Crossing. I thought it might have something to do with Lore, the alternate-reality Wanda they introduced in that Scarlet Witch limited series.
    I might have been wrong.

    Peace

  5. #80
    The One Above All 616MarvelYear is LeapYear's Avatar
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    Happy Birthday John Byrne!!!



    Thanks for Avengers West Coast # 42-57. http://www.comicsreporter.com/index....ay_john_byrne/
    Last edited by 616MarvelYear is LeapYear; 09-23-2016 at 03:17 PM.
    Imperius Rex!
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    It's clobberin' time! Hulk is strongest one there is! Have at thee!
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    I'm the best there is at what I do, but what I do best isn't very nice.
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  6. #81
    The One Above All 616MarvelYear is LeapYear's Avatar
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    Happy Birthday to the late GREAT Paul Ryan!!!



    Inks and painting by Tom Palmer. Pencils by Paul Ryan.
    https://cultfaction.com/2016/03/07/p...-away-aged-66/
    Imperius Rex!
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/.../74396-9Bk.jpg
    It's clobberin' time! Hulk is strongest one there is! Have at thee!
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/...74396-51Bk.jpg
    I'm the best there is at what I do, but what I do best isn't very nice.
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  7. #82
    synthezoid Viz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 616MarvelYear is LeapYear View Post


    Inks and painting by Tom Palmer. Pencils by Paul Ryan.
    https://cultfaction.com/2016/03/07/p...-away-aged-66/
    That painting seems to be around the time that they got rid of the WCA sadly.

  8. #83
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    To me, Force Works is a good name for an all new superhero team to make their debut in Phase 4 of the Marvel Cinematic Universe!
    Imperius Rex!
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/.../74396-9Bk.jpg
    It's clobberin' time! Hulk is strongest one there is! Have at thee!
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    I'm the best there is at what I do, but what I do best isn't very nice.
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  9. #84
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    WCA was a favorite title at the time. Englehart a day then Byrne did fantastic character based storylines in this series. Each character seemed to, as I recall, have at least one strong character arc.

    FORCE WORKS. Not only a good team name but works as a complete sentence!!

  10. #85
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    Happy Birthday Bob Hall!!!


    Marvel Promo Poster for the West Coast Avengers Limited Series (1984) - Bob Hall

    West Coast Avengers commission by Bob Hall
    http://www.comicsreporter.com/index....hday_bob_hall/
    Imperius Rex!
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    It's clobberin' time! Hulk is strongest one there is! Have at thee!
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    I'm the best there is at what I do, but what I do best isn't very nice.
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  11. #86
    Astonishing Member Nomads1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 616MarvelYear is LeapYear View Post

    Marvel Promo Poster for the West Coast Avengers Limited Series (1984) - Bob Hall

    West Coast Avengers commission by Bob Hall
    http://www.comicsreporter.com/index....hday_bob_hall/
    A very underappreciated artist. I wished he'd had stayed on as the artist on the ongoing series instead of Milgrom.

    Paece

  12. #87
    Ultimate Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witchfan View Post
    The art of the first four issues was horrible. The death of Wonder Man, the failure to include Hawkeye and War Machine, and the inclusion of US Agent are what killed this book coming out of the gate. US Agent should have been the one who died.
    So basically, you think it should've been like the Iron Man cartoon, but with Wonder Man added? That had War Machine (included because he was Iron Man's sidekick) and Hawkeye, and no USAgent (Hawkeye replaced him, as they didn't have the rights to Captain America for some reason). They never should have called that cartoon Iron Man anyway - season one was an adaptation of the then-recent Force Works (and thus should've been called either that or Avengers), and season 2 wound up using Spider-Woman as an expy of Pepper Potts (they wrote out Century and Wanda, and Hawkeye only appeared in a couple of episodes).

  13. #88
    Extraordinary Member Zero Hunter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nomads1 View Post
    A very underappreciated artist. I wished he'd had stayed on as the artist on the ongoing series instead of Milgrom.

    Paece
    I am with you on this one. Bob Hall's art in the initial mini series just looked so good I was excited when the series proper started thinking he would be the artist again. I have nothing against Al Milgrom usually but the art he was putting out for WCA was just not that good. Maybe it was over inked or maybe he was trying something new with his style, but it just looked for lack of a better word too "60's" for my tastes with thick lines and over coloraction.

  14. #89
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    It sure made me sad that Bob Hall did not stay on as the artist on the ongoing series
    Imperius Rex!
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/.../74396-9Bk.jpg
    It's clobberin' time! Hulk is strongest one there is! Have at thee!
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/...74396-51Bk.jpg
    I'm the best there is at what I do, but what I do best isn't very nice.
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/...74396-43Bk.jpg

  15. #90
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    The Iron Man cartoon should indeed have been called Force Works since since there was no mistaking it to be an adaptation of the then-recent Force Works.
    Imperius Rex!
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/.../74396-9Bk.jpg
    It's clobberin' time! Hulk is strongest one there is! Have at thee!
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/...74396-51Bk.jpg
    I'm the best there is at what I do, but what I do best isn't very nice.
    http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/...74396-43Bk.jpg

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