VILLAINS! Your Thoughts On: First Born

[7-Love]

What are everybody's thoughts on First Born?

[Vanguard-01]

I think he's been a good and potent villain in Azz's run.

Now, that said? I really don't see him making it as a long-term Wonder Woman villain. Azz has written him in this big, three-year epic, and I really don't see how this story can end any other way than 1) Diana kills him, or 2) Diana somehow redeems him. Either way, he won't be a problem for her anymore.

Now, sure, gods don't have to remain dead, and stuff. It's not like it's impossible for him to come back. But at the end of the day, why bother? Azz wrote him with this singular, all-consuming goal in life, and he's all but achieved it already.

The First Born is in much the same boat as Doomsday and Bane. They are characters who were created with a singular goal in mind. And once they accomplish that goal, what's left for them to do? Doomsday killed Superman in his debut story. Bane crippled Batman in his debut story. The First Born conquered Olympus and has decimated the Olympians. Great, guys! Now, what the heck do you do for an encore?

If First Born DOES continue to exist after Azz's run, he needs an entirely new motivation if he's going to be anything other than just a convenient villain to pull out every time a writer wants to put Diana up against an opponent who can hurt/kill her and is too lazy to come up with a new character. That's what has happened with Doomsday: he gets used every time a writer wants an "Oh, $*^#!" moment from the fans......but we don't generally go "Oh, $*^#!" because we know good well Doomsday isn't going to kill Superman AGAIN.

[numberthirty]

While he is very interesting, I agree that I don't see him being a long term villain. It seems very "I get to where I want to be, or I die trying."

[borntohula]

I love him. His sad, scary and even ridiculous at times. Another good thing is that his power basically is to weaken others, something that makes things a bit more interesting than just muscles.

And yup, with the recent goings it'd perhaps be best if he was put to rest after Azzarello is done with him. But that depends on how things end.

[mathew101281]

He kind of lacks depth to be a long term villain.

[7-Love]

He kind of lacks depth to be a long term villain.

That's my issue with him too as well. He feels...generic (for lack of better words).

[OBrianTallent]

Really can't add anything that hasn't already been said. The only other option is to have him chained up in hades or some place...but that doesn't seem like much of an option...

[Dr. Hurt]

I think he's been a good and potent villain in Azz's run.

Now, that said? I really don't see him making it as a long-term Wonder Woman villain. Azz has written him in this big, three-year epic, and I really don't see how this story can end any other way than 1) Diana kills him, or 2) Diana somehow redeems him. Either way, he won't be a problem for her anymore.

Now, sure, gods don't have to remain dead, and stuff. It's not like it's impossible for him to come back. But at the end of the day, why bother? Azz wrote him with this singular, all-consuming goal in life, and he's all but achieved it already.

The First Born is in much the same boat as Doomsday and Bane. They are characters who were created with a singular goal in mind. And once they accomplish that goal, what's left for them to do? Doomsday killed Superman in his debut story. Bane crippled Batman in his debut story. The First Born conquered Olympus and has decimated the Olympians. Great, guys! Now, what the heck do you do for an encore?

If First Born DOES continue to exist after Azz's run, he needs an entirely new motivation if he's going to be anything other than just a convenient villain to pull out every time a writer wants to put Diana up against an opponent who can hurt/kill her and is too lazy to come up with a new character. That's what has happened with Doomsday: he gets used every time a writer wants an "Oh, $*^#!" moment from the fans......but we don't generally go "Oh, $*^#!" because we know good well Doomsday isn't going to kill Superman AGAIN.

I agree with this post, word for word, especially the point about Bane and Doomsday.

So i'm going to add that i like his burned up look, his version of the Olympian cape which is made out of blood vessels for him, and how powerful he is. That said, he isnt such an interesting character, he's just a monster bent on destruction. His backstory didnt do anything for me. I guess there's always room for such a villain and any lack of depth he might have is made up by all the great characters in the pantheon and Diana's team.

[SofNascimento]

Best Wonder Woman villain ever.

[Dr. Poison]

That's my issue with him too as well. He feels...generic (for lack of better words).

While not the worst villain, he's very generic with his Doomsday/Vandal Savage mash-up appearance and daddy issues. Perhaps with a different creative team, he could be modified a bit into someone who could challenge Diana for the long-term but as of now, he's just blah.

[magisensei]

Dull and rather boring. There is nothing original or interesting about this character - a character that barely has a personality and almost zero motivation. A killing/death machine that the DC universe will forget about just as quickly as Azz finishes his run on this series.

The only thing that Azz could do to make these final chapters less predictable would be to have Zeus suddenly appear (which Azz might do anyways if Zeke is any indication) and restore everything (after the usual mandatory battle that will be pointless) and give FB a good spanking for being a naughty little godling then either consume him (as previous god father have done to their children) or imprison him in some way or even better remove his divinity and let him feel what it means to be mortal and die and see if he can learn anything from this.

Why Apollo didn't remove FB's divinity when he had him imprisoned is a mystery but then again if he had the whole point of his story would end...

[SiegePerilous02]

I'm really sick of him. He's a hulking brute with a "I hate everything" attitude because daddy doesn't love him. Sure, he's causing a lot of destruction and is really powerful, but that doesn't make him a compelling character, and he's practically dominated this book for 2 years. I also hate that he took the place of two potentially more interesting antagonists (Apollo and Cassandra) as the Big Bad of the run. Unless Azz throws us a curveball by having Strife or Zeus take his place, but the solicits don't indicate that that will happen.

[Vanguard-01]

I'm really sick of him. He's a hulking brute with a "I hate everything" attitude because daddy doesn't love him.

I just feel the need to come in to First Born's defense right here.

Saying that he hates everything because "daddy didn't love him," is grossly oversimplifying his backstory. He isn't the way he is because Zeus never hugged him. He is the way he was brought up in a brutal, savage fashion that nurtured his hateful and destructive nature.

I agree with pretty much everything else you said, but I've just seen several people try to boil First Born's motivations down to "daddy issues." Like First Born just didn't get hugged enough. This just isn't the case. He didn't get hugged AT ALL. He has literally never known a moment's kindness in his entire life. He was raised by beasts. Of course he isn't going to develop any sense of compassion or mercy. All he knows is the rage in his heart and his desire to inflict his pain on the entire world.

That's a little more complex than "Waaah! Daddy didn't spend time with me!"

[Step]

Dull and rather boring. There is nothing original or interesting about this character - a character that barely has a personality and almost zero motivation. A killing/death machine that the DC universe will forget about just as quickly as Azz finishes his run on this series.

The only thing that Azz could do to make these final chapters less predictable would be to have Zeus suddenly appear (which Azz might do anyways if Zeke is any indication) and restore everything (after the usual mandatory battle that will be pointless) and give FB a good spanking for being a naughty little godling then either consume him (as previous god father have done to their children) or imprison him in some way or even better remove his divinity and let him feel what it means to be mortal and die and see if he can learn anything from this.

Why Apollo didn't remove FB's divinity when he had him imprisoned is a mystery but then again if he had the whole point of his story would end...

This, he's boring, like Genocide or Doomsday for me, I've never been a fan of those bland killing machines.

I agree with Seige, I'd have rather Apollo or Cassandra become the big bad.

[SmokeMonster]

Serves his purpose well in Azzarello's run, which is fine by me.