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  1. #16
    Protect the weak. Darth Phoenix's Avatar
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    If we do not include the XForce theme not if it can be avoided but when you have no choice they will.
    Like when Warlock ate Hodge and all those Smiley face goons or Indie killing thugs to get out the hostages seconds before a bomb went off. Inferno on they kill the Marauders with no issues since they just respawn

  2. #17
    That's what makes it fun! Ricochet Rita's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind Rider View Post
    Wasn't always the case but they do and have for years. I'm cool with it as long as it is justified.
    "Justified" is always a very dangerous word regarding murder. I'm OK with the end of hypocrisy (X-Men have killed a lot of aliens, monsters and animals, as Jumbo said, and that was rarely trouble for them), and I'm OK with dealing with the act of killing. BUT I want that when it may happen it's something important --I don't wanna this stuff to become something trivial.

  3. #18
    Astonishing Member Celestialbodies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediMindTrick View Post
    That wasn't Jean though.
    It was now and has been for some time, her being Dark Phoenix was the running but illogical theme of AvX and the equally frustrating Trial of Jean Grey.

  4. #19
    BANNED dragonmp93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediMindTrick View Post
    That wasn't Jean though.
    Well, that depends on the retcon and on who do you ask.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragonmp93 View Post
    Well, that depends on the retcon and on who do you ask.
    I don't care what the actual canon at the moment is. Having the Dark Phoenix Saga, basically the best story Jean Grey has ever been in, not actually have her in it, is just stupid.

  6. #21
    Perfectly Safe Penguin ariwl1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galerion View Post

    I feel that was actually a very well thought out conversation that was meant to show the flaw in "the X-Men don't kill"

    It was an effective conversation on a lot of levels.

    For one thing it showcases how the X-Men are not traditional superheros, much as I wish they'd do more superhero like things. "No killing" is a common comic hero creed. Whole characters have been developed entirely to be the antithesis of that and every regular hero is eventually tested against that creed at some point. But for the X-Men they may try and uphold that ideal but are given much less breathing room to do so, as where most superheros must pursue their enemies with the X-Men half the time the villains are coming after them.

    Also for Jean Grey in particular it showed what ideals can leave you with in such a world. With Jean's powers (Dark Phoenix not withstanding) she could seriously eradicate would-be assailants more severely and in a wider variety of ways than just about any X-Men ever if she wanted, but her more lawful alignment didn't encourage that and the results was obvious. She may have died with a clean conscience but she was still dead.

  7. #22
    The Queen of Maggots Izanami's Avatar
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    At least its nothing compared to the days when Illyana will send unfortunate souls into Limbo. That kiddie team is terrifying.
    I come when there's something to take but I never give anything back.
    I know what you want. But it is not here. It's gone and it will never ever come again...

  8. #23
    Extraordinary Member Bl00dwerK's Avatar
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    Maybe "The X-Men don't kill, unless it's in self-defense." would make more sense...

  9. #24
    Protect the weak. Darth Phoenix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Izanami View Post
    At least its nothing compared to the days when Illyana will send unfortunate souls into Limbo. That kiddie team is terrifying.
    She was being kind those souls were going to end up in Hel but instead ended up in limbo and got to keep thier bodies.
    At least till Sym drained them to feed his TO virus.

  10. #25
    Storm Goddess Wind Rider's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ricochet Rita View Post
    "Justified" is always a very dangerous word regarding murder. I'm OK with the end of hypocrisy (X-Men have killed a lot of aliens, monsters and animals, as Jumbo said, and that was rarely trouble for them), and I'm OK with dealing with the act of killing. BUT I want that when it may happen it's something important --I don't wanna this stuff to become something trivial.
    Agreed for the most part and especially on the bold.

    I'm glad that many of the X-Men have grown past the belief that killing is never acceptable, but I'm also glad it is still a standard they strive toward. Justification can be quite subjective, though I wouldn't equate the X-Men's kills, at least not for most of them and the related circumstances, murder. There are some obvious cases in which "murder" is quite clear (i.e. - X-Force) - and is more along the lines of my dark moral compass -, and there are circumstances where I think the kill is justified and necessary (i.e. Havok vs Divebomber (Brood), Storm vs Marrow, Rogue vs Vargas...?).
    Be the change you wish to see in the world.

  11. #26
    Uncanny Member JustAnotherFan's Avatar
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    I think that at this point it would just be best for them to forget that tired old mantra since plenty of X-Men have killed plenty of people over the years. Repeating an archaic mantra like that only makes the characters seem hypocritical and or senile fossils who've totally forgotten their own past actions.

    Besides, in fiction (and possibly in real life as well) there are some a-holes who do deserve to be killed because they are such irredeemable monsters and many x-villains fall into this category. Superheroes who have the no kill policy and always find a way to not kill their enemies don't really work as well in the modern age where the villains are constantly depicted as heinous enough to outright kill innocents in cold blood. For example, villains like Joker constantly escape whatever facility they are being held in and go out to murder people and still heroes like Batman return them to those ineffectual jails just for them to escape and kill again. All this does is make the hero look bad like they hold keeping their own conscience clean more important than the lives of the innocents (who they should protect) that are lost due to villains who just won't stop until they are dead.

    And considering the lack of meaning deaths have in comics (even in-universe!) it seems weird for heroes not to kill the villains since they all seem to know that the villain will somehow return anyway so what does it matter if they do kill them to stop them at least momentarily. They know full well that it won't last.

  12. #27
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    Killed him dead she did.

  13. #28
    All-New Member Colossonaut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JediMindTrick View Post
    That wasn't Jean though.
    It was Jean when she killed Prism during the Mutant Massacre though - she telekintetically shattered him.

  14. #29
    The Queen of Maggots Izanami's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tazirai View Post
    Killed him dead she did.
    Considering what was going to happen next... I don't blame the poor girl. Quite disturbing.

    I come when there's something to take but I never give anything back.
    I know what you want. But it is not here. It's gone and it will never ever come again...

  15. #30
    Protect the weak. Darth Phoenix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Izanami View Post
    Considering what was going to happen next... I don't blame the poor girl. Quite disturbing.

    Thats funny in Austin the police chief was arguing about females to not use guns to stop sexual assualt and said to "just go to cousling and get over it" I like Psylocks idea better.

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