The Superior Spider-Man Appreciation Thread 2018

[NelsonMagus]

But what you're saying is they're trying to make us see Otto as a hero and I absolutely don't think that was the intention at all. Your kids aren't supposed to look up to him, he has done lots of terrible things and hasn't done enough to truly redeem him. But he has still done some good things, and that's why he would classify as an anti-hero, someone like Venom, who we don't necessarily root for all the time, but are still interested to follow along to see what he does next. And that's why I personally overall enjoyed the series, because I thought he was a compelling character to want to read along to.

Okay, I get that. I mean, I have some villains I've enjoyed watching or reading about too, guys like The Joker. But you know what's the difference between SpOck and The Joker for me? The latter's not boring (in my opinion).

I believe I already mentioned this, but after #10 (though technically, it was after #5, after Massacre's execution), nothing SpOck has ever done from that point impressed me. He was basically doing his super villain thing, setting up his base, hiring henchmen, not to mention setting up his Big Brother Spider-bot surveillance system. That last point, the surveillance, was the only interesting thing out of the three, and it wasn't even a concept fully explored till the last stretch of the series, when Peter Parker was about to make his return. And even when it was touched on later on (by having the citizens calling out on SpOck's surveillance as unethical), it was very briefly touched on in one or two panels, then forgotten about entirely, never to be mentioned again. I wish there could have at least been an entire issue exploring the subject of whether if SpOck's surveillance had any pragmatic value. That would at least have been interesting.

You know what was the most interesting thing that SpOck has done after #5? Torturing Blackout. I was interested to see what SpOck does next too, to see how far he would take his "heroics," and that was the first time since #5 that The Superior Spider-Man has caught my attention by doing something different, by trying out something no other hero would have done. I wish there was more of such extremity in SSM, because all of that Spider-bot and Spider-henchmen nonsense was just so generic.

On a sidenote, I really wanted to see more of Cardiac. His parallel with SpOck as an unethical hero doing good through unorthodox methods was a great reflection of SpOck's methods. Shame we never got to fully explore the parallels between him and SpOck. That was another interesting concept in SSM that was briefly touched on but never coming to fruition because it was overstuffed with other stuff.

[Inversed]

Okay, I get that. I mean, I have some villains I've enjoyed watching or reading about too, guys like The Joker. But you know what's the difference between SpOck and The Joker for me? The latter's not boring (in my opinion).

I believe I already mentioned this, but after #10 (though technically, it was after #5, after Massacre's execution), nothing SpOck has ever done from that point impressed me. He was basically doing his super villain thing, setting up his base, hiring henchmen, not to mention setting up his Big Brother Spider-bot surveillance system. That last point, the surveillance, was the only interesting thing out of the three, and it wasn't even a concept fully explored till the last stretch of the series, when Peter Parker was about to make his return. And even when it was touched on later on (by having the citizens calling out on SpOck's surveillance as unethical), it was very briefly touched on in one or two panels, then forgotten about entirely, never to be mentioned again. I wish there could have at least been an entire issue exploring the subject of whether if SpOck's surveillance had any pragmatic value. That would at least have been interesting.

You know what was the most interesting thing that SpOck has done after #5? Torturing Blackout. I was interested to see what SpOck does next too, to see how far he would take his "heroics," and that was the first time since #5 that The Superior Spider-Man has caught my attention by doing something different, by trying out something no other hero would have done. I wish there was more of such extremity in SSM, because all of that Spider-bot and Spider-henchmen nonsense was just so generic.

On a sidenote, I really wanted to see more of Cardiac. His parallel with SpOck as an unethical hero doing good through unorthodox methods was a great reflection of SpOck's methods. Shame we never got to fully explore the parallels between him and SpOck. That was another interesting concept in SSM that was briefly touched on but never coming to fruition because it was overstuffed with other stuff.

And that's all completely fair, you have your reasons why you didn't care for him or the story and it's all understandable. I was just arguing against the point you make that we were supposed to see him as a completely redeemed hero, which I believe we were not.

[Michael Watkins]

Let me emphasize something... SpOck will never be a hero. Believe all you want. It AIN'T happening. Put SpOck in a spider-suit or showing off his stupid Spider-bots in EVERY message board avatar in the world. Still never happening. Ever. Ever. Ever. I'm sure I'll be here next year telling you the same thing. Not happening. Over a quarter of a century has been spent by Marvel to define what a true hero is. It ain't happening. Sorry. Ever.

This isn't a "let's argue about it" or "let's debate about it". This is fact. This is in stone. There is no administration in the near or distant future that will ever reinstate SpOck as a true hero in Superior Spider-Man EVER. Could he be redeemed by other writers in the future? Yes. That could happen. Could there be an alternate continuity where Doc Ock was never a villain and merely helped humanity with his intellect? You bet. And I wouldn't mind paying to see that. Will his actions in SSM be considered heroic? Never. Is there some future person out there who loves SpOck and will someday wind up a creator or editor at Marvel? Could happen. Will he be able to reinstate SpOck as a hero? No. A person who believes that's a scenario that could happen does not have a proper grasp on what the definition of "hero" means. That's the reality of the situation.

It's not happening. Ever. It's never, ever going to happen. There is no person, no matter how passionately they cared about the SSM setup who could ever make it through all the steps and paces to get to a position of editorial power AND change the foundation of what Spider-Man and true heroism really mean. There is no lottery ticket BIG enough that anyone could win it, buy Marvel, and make this ludicrous notion happen. It's NEVER, EVER, EVER coming about. No matter how much Slott wants it. It ain't happening. There is NO possible path to this.

Still not clear enough? To quote someone truly heroic... I've seen his "heroism." The only thing he really fights for is himself. He's not the guy to make the sacrifice play, to lay down on a wire and let the other guy crawl over him. If there's a fire, he would just phone for the firemen, risking the possibility that they might not be able to save everyone. That's somehow more "superior" than what Peter did, naively trying to save everyone trapped in that burning building. If there's a mugging, he would just phone for the cops, risking the possibility of another Ben Parker dead on the streets. SpOck might not have been a threat, but Slott better stop pretending he's a hero.

If you need a reminder of why Peter was truly the superior Spider-Man, go read ASM #700.2 and how he saved the people trapped in the burning building instead of just calling it in and forget about it. Oh yeah, and it wasn't written by Slott. Big surprise.

no, you're wrong.

[Batman Begins 2005]

NelsonMagus: Did you ever read Christopher Yost's works using the Superior Spider-Man?

[NelsonMagus]

NelsonMagus: Did you ever read Christopher Yost's works using the Superior Spider-Man?

Yes, and I enjoyed his take on the character much more than Slott's. My previous post (mostly a satirical parody of Slott's rant about anti-marriage on social media if you couldn't tell by now from how I copied his words verbatim) was referring to Slott's depiction, not any one else's (everyone else did a better job by the way, Gage included).

By the way, I've finished reading Superior at last, and I'm currently working on a very lengthy review. Surprisingly though, it will not be a scathing review, as I'll try to be objective about it and not let my personal feelings get in the way like I've displayed here over the past few days.

[Batman Begins 2005]

Yes, and I enjoyed his take on the character much more than Slott's. My previous post (mostly a satirical parody of Slott's rant about anti-marriage on social media if you couldn't tell by now from how I copied his words verbatim) was referring to Slott's depiction, not any one else's (everyone else did a better job by the way, Gage included).

By the way, I've finished reading Superior at last, and I'm currently working on a very lengthy review. Surprisingly though, it will not be a scathing review, as I'll try to be objective about it and not let my personal feelings get in the way like I've displayed here over the past few days.

Cheers. I also prefer the way Christopher Yost wrote SpOck.

[Kurolegacy]

Looks like SpOck is back for Spidergeddan.

[Celgress]

And I for one couldn't be more pleased.

[Spiderfang]

Looks like SpOck is back for Spidergeddan.

I'm curious as to why Kaine isn't featured on here.

[NelsonMagus]

Okay, so I have an apology to make, both to @Michael Watkins and to every fan of Superior Spider-Man. I was at best rude and at worst passive-aggressive, and I'm sorry. Furthermore, after some reflection, I realized that Watkins and @Inversed might actually be right about me being wrong after all. Because of my review on Superior, I've been starting to think about whether if Superior Spider-Man was just a satirical take on violence being a solution.

In my defense, it's not exactly a clear subtext. Most satire isn't.

I've said before that my review wasn't going to be scathing, and now with this new information, I think it might even be a positive one for all I know. I don't know. I've been working on it for days now, and I'm not even halfway done yet since I'll also be covering Superior Team-Up and Superior Foes in the same review to parallel the three different writers' take on the entire saga (Superior Foes is included because I want to talk about his depiction of a likable villain).

Anyway, I understand if you still hate me for it, but there it is. Peace.

[Celgress]

I think I'm more excited to see SpOck back than I am any other Spider featured on that cover. I'm giddy with anticipation.

So, I wonder if the SpOck feature will be from an alternate universe where Otto kept Peter's body as well as the role of Spider-Man after Goblin Nation?

[KC]

Otto, as you said yourself, is someone who acts for himself and who's justice only regards what is "right" or "wrong" for him. I don't think at the end of the day he would do the right thing unless it still benefited him somehow, not out of any sense of altruism or heroism.

This isn't true. In Superior Spider-Man, Cardiac Stole one of Otto's inventions and Otto tried to steal it back. But when he found out that Cardiac was using it to save the life of a little girl who was affected by one of Otto's previous schemes Otto not only let him Cardiac use it, he helped do the surgery.

[KC]

Looks like SpOck is back for Spidergeddan.

SpOck being back is the only thing that would make me read this event.

[Pav]

Maybe the hidden figure is Spidey from the upcoming video game???

-Pav, who's just spitballing...

[comicscollector]

Looks like SpOck is back for Spidergeddan.

Hello?
Hello?
Is this thing on?

Okay Marvel,not that i don´t apreciate cool comic books.But can you try to publish less cool comic books?
My wallet would apreciate that.

Jokes aside,this looks great.
Happy to know that Spider-Man 2099,Spider-Man Noir will be apearing again in this story.