Superman in Dawn of Justice

[darkseidpwns]

A lot of the writers who give us BatGod have also given us some of the greatest Superman stories of all time. I'm no fan of Miller but for how long are Superman fans going to blame him? he's written Superman in a grand total of 6 comics or so in 30 years. Conversely Johns has been writing Batman non stop for the last 5 years and a few times before that yet his writing has not tanked Batman's character. Grant Morrison gave birth to BatGod but he also wrote All-Star Superman and has probably the only readable nu-52 Superman run,Waid of Tower of Babel fame also wrote Kingdom Come and Birthright, Loeb wrote All Seasons in addition to Hush, Red Son had Batman decisively owning Superman yet it is considered one of the best Superman stories of all time,Azz has TDK 3: Master Race and Luthor:Man of Steel both under his belt,a special mention to For Tomorrow as well. If Superman fans really think that losing to Batman would destroy him then its time to realize that maybe there isnt much to Superman's character after all. Superman's decline has nothing to do with Batman's popularity or Frank Miller,it has everything to do with his envious and self hating fan base. When some Superman fans hate pre-52 Superman and Lois while others hate new-52 Superman for no reason other than just cause then you there's a serious problem.
I generally avoid posting on this side of the forums but I do skim through the threads and I find myself laughing over the shipper debates and the ridiculous ultimatums like "If Pre-Flashpoint Superman returns I'll stop reading",really? Superman is Superman,if the writers can come up with an engaging story then what's the problem? even the much maligned Superman editorial merely reinforces and imposes the view points of such fans. Take a look at what the writers who are generally free from too much interference have produced,look at Snyder and Johns, neither of them for instance bothered with Superman x Diana in their Superman runs,Johns reverted some of the changes that the reboot had ushered in,Snyder's characterization was more in line with the pre-52 Superman.
To stay on topic,BvS is not going to destroy Superman and this is coming from someone who doesn't think highly of Zack Snyder.

P.S: Not even going to touch Bruce Timm.

[DieHard200904]

A lot of the writers who give us BatGod have also given us some of the greatest Superman stories of all time. I'm no fan of Miller but for how long are Superman fans going to blame him? he's written Superman in a grand total of 6 comics or so in 30 years. Conversely Johns has been writing Batman non stop for the last 5 years and a few times before that yet his writing has not tanked Batman's character. Grant Morrison gave birth to BatGod but he also wrote All-Star Superman and has probably the only readable nu-52 Superman run,Waid of Tower of Babel fame also wrote Kingdom Come and Birthright, Loeb wrote All Seasons in addition to Hush, Red Son had Batman decisively owning Superman yet it is considered one of the best Superman stories of all time,Azz has TDK 3: Master Race and Luthor:Man of Steel both under his belt,a special mention to For Tomorrow as well. If Superman fans really think that losing to Batman would destroy him then its time to realize that maybe there isnt much to Superman's character after all. Superman's decline has nothing to do with Batman's popularity or Frank Miller,it has everything to do with his envious and self hating fan base. When some Superman fans hate pre-52 Superman and Lois while others hate new-52 Superman for no reason other than just cause then you there's a serious problem.
I generally avoid posting on this side of the forums but I do skim through the threads and I find myself laughing over the shipper debates and the ridiculous ultimatums like "If Pre-Flashpoint Superman returns I'll stop reading",really? Superman is Superman,if the writers can come up with an engaging story then what's the problem? even the much maligned Superman editorial merely reinforces and imposes the view points of such fans. Take a look at what the writers who are generally free from too much interference have produced,look at Snyder and Johns, neither of them for instance bothered with Superman x Diana in their Superman runs,Johns reverted some of the changes that the reboot had ushered in,Snyder's characterization was more in line with the pre-52 Superman.
To stay on topic,BvS is not going to destroy Superman and this is coming from someone who doesn't think highly of Zack Snyder.

P.S: Not even going to touch Bruce Timm.

I liked the Bruce Timm solo series of Superman. Among my favorite portrayals of him. I had my share of fun out of Pre and New 52 as it was.

[Prime]

Lol Pak showed that Superman as a character can be charming. It's just that Truth sucked major balls.

[Nite-Wing]

A lot of fans do have some huge complex about blaming Batman's popularity for any given issue in the DCU.
Its not gonna be this movie that destroy's superman's credibility with the public it will be the succession of bad movies since Superman 3 that did it.
Superman is already getting disrespected frankly the movie's marketing has basically been come see Batman and Wonder Woman... oh and Superman too
If this performance doesn't stand out akin to how the Hulk or Iron Man stood out in Avengers its gonna be hard to change minds or get new attention on the character

[Prime]

A lot of fans do have some huge complex about blaming Batman's popularity for any given issue in the DCU.
Its not gonna be this movie that destroy's superman's credibility with the public it will be the succession of bad movies since Superman 3 that did it.
Superman is already getting disrespected frankly the movie's marketing has basically been come see Batman and Wonder Woman... oh and Superman too
If this performance doesn't stand out akin to how the Hulk or Iron Man stood out in Avengers its gonna be hard to change minds or get new attention on the character

Well that depends on the people behind it because Superman is a fictional character and cant do anything without the writer. So I hope Zack and Terrio give Superman some goddamn justice because he ia f*cking Superman.

[Blade Wolf]

I swear to God, if Batman fights friggin Doomsday for more than two seconds, I'm gonna walk out of the theater.

Say what you want about Marvel Studios, but they respect the comicbook power hierarchy, Robert Downey Jr the best paid actor and main face of MCU was completly ragdolled by Loki in Avengers, as it should be.

[vasir12]

I swear to God, if Batman fights friggin Doomsday for more than two seconds, I'm gonna walk out of the theater.

Say what you want about Marvel Studios, but they respect the comicbook power hierarchy, Robert Downey Jr the best paid actor and main face of MCU was completly ragdolled by Loki in Avengers, as it should be.

Not alone, but with the others than there's no reason why he shouldn't be there.

[Stanlos]

*Sigh* I am getting really nervous, because if Batman beats Superman is over. Everyone will be "See Batman beats sSuperman!Superman SUCZ!

That is not going to happen.

[The True Detective]

I swear to God, if Batman fights friggin Doomsday for more than two seconds, I'm gonna walk out of the theater.

Say what you want about Marvel Studios, but they respect the comicbook power hierarchy, Robert Downey Jr the best paid actor and main face of MCU was completly ragdolled by Loki in Avengers, as it should be.

Actually that was Captain America who was rag dolled by Loki, Iron Man took Loki down with one blast. Stark also had a decent showing against Thor and beat Hulk in Age of Ultron. Because of his popularity Iron Man has been able to hold his own or beat people who should one-shot him. He's no different than Batman in that respect. And even Cap held his own against Ultron for awhile, so Marvel doesn't exactly respect the power hierarchy like you say.

[darkseidpwns]

Actually that was Captain America who was rag dolled by Loki, Iron Man took Loki down with one blast. Stark also had a decent showing against Thor and beat Hulk in Age of Ultron. Because of his popularity Iron Man has been able to hold his own or beat people who should one-shot him. He's no different than Batman in that respect. And even Cap held his own against Ultron for awhile, so Marvel doesn't exactly respect the power hierarchy like you say.

People just make things up when it comes to Batman. Every single Avenger humiliated Loki one way or another and as you mentioned Cap fought both him and Ultron evenly(let that thought sink in for a moment).
Iron Man and Cap are ridiculously impressive,even moreso than their comic counterparts in some ways as I dont recall Hulkbuster ever beating Hulk in the comics. But ofcourse Batman shouldn't fight a villain in his own movie because of the insecurity of some fanboys. If anything Doomsday is the garbage plot device that does whatever it wants with no regard for established power levels just to make Superman look good. I'm curious to see how fanboys will react if Superman does not deliver the final blow to Doomsday.

[Agent Z]

People just make things up when it comes to Batman. Every single Avenger humiliated Loki one way or another and as you mentioned Cap fought both him and Ultron evenly(let that thought sink in for a moment).
Iron Man and Cap are ridiculously impressive,even moreso than their comic counterparts in some ways as I dont recall Hulkbuster ever beating Hulk in the comics. But ofcourse Batman shouldn't fight a villain in his own movie because of the insecurity of some fanboys. If anything Doomsday is the garbage plot device that does whatever it wants with no regard for established power levels just to make Superman look good. I'm curious to see how fanboys will react if Superman does not deliver the final blow to Doomsday.

Loki has never been the strongest of the Asgardians physically and the MCU version isn't a god, he's an alien. Steve never fought Ultron evenly. He mostly dodged his attacks and spends more time running from him. Every other time he's fighting the Ultrons along side the other Avengers.

There's a huge difference between the Hulkbuster doing what it was designed to do and Batman being able to fight nigh unstoppable killing machine he's not familiar with.

Also, Tony lost to Thor in the first Avengers film and the Civil War trailer shows him getting pounded on by Steve and Barnes.

[darkseidpwns]

Loki has never been the strongest of the Asgardians physically and the MCU version isn't a god, he's an alien. Steve never fought Ultron evenly. He mostly dodged his attacks and spends more time running from him. Every other time he's fighting the Ultrons along side the other Avengers.

There's a huge difference between the Hulkbuster doing what it was designed to do and Batman being able to fight nigh unstoppable killing machine he's not familiar with.

Also, Tony lost to Thor in the first Avengers film and the Civil War trailer shows him getting pounded on by Steve and Barnes.

Loki has plenty of powers that would put him leagues ahead of Cap America,a simple illusion from a mind as crafty as his could be devastating. Him being a God or alien doesn't mean anything,God is just a throwaway term unless you're dealing with TOAA or Overmonitor. Loki was humiliated by every single Avenger,that is a fact and Cap has no business fighting him period.
If the other guy is struggling to even touch you and cant do any real damage after a considerable stretch of time then that is fighting even with him. Also the poster said Marvel was truer to their comic power levels,do you even know what comic Ultron is capable of? joketron's energy blast was less powerful than a bullet.
Again Hulkbuster has never beaten Hulk in the comics so the point is moot, MCU wanked Iron Man period and they wanked Cap. A fight between Cap and Ultron/Hulk or Tony vs Ultron in the comics is no different from Batman vs Doomsday. Besides we dont even know what happened,for all we know Batman goes to Lexcorp and tries to shutdown Doomsday,maybe he fights Mercy or Anatoli Knyazev? Iron Man vs Thor was a stalemate,I recall Tony actually absorbing his lightning and powering his suit. Imagine the outcry if Batman does the same to heat vision.
Its just a movie, no one is going to care who did what except some disgruntled fanboys.

[Stanlos]

I think it's going to be a real surprise to most movie goers that Batman can hold his own against Superman, so I would expect an excellent showing. I am more concerned that there are mixed reactions to the movie according to Fatman on Batman.

Thanks for the LOLs!

[Stanlos]

Not gonna happen...no way.

Besides. This movie sounds like it could be all Wonder Woman.

If it is such and this is the same Zack Snyder that did SUCKERPUNCH then that will bode extremely ill portent for the Wonder Woman indeed. It would mean she is there to be hot and pose but ultimately ineffectual and of course dominated by whoever is designated as "The Man". In SUCKERPUNCH, for all the flipping and shooting and kicking the women's only power was their ****holes. I do NOT want that for Wonder Woman (although one could make a solid argument that this totally is in alignment with the view of the TPTB at DC lo these last couple decades).

[Stanlos]

People just make things up when it comes to Batman. Every single Avenger humiliated Loki one way or another and as you mentioned Cap fought both him and Ultron evenly(let that thought sink in for a moment).
Iron Man and Cap are ridiculously impressive,even moreso than their comic counterparts in some ways as I dont recall Hulkbuster ever beating Hulk in the comics. But ofcourse Batman shouldn't fight a villain in his own movie because of the insecurity of some fanboys. If anything Doomsday is the garbage plot device that does whatever it wants with no regard for established power levels just to make Superman look good. I'm curious to see how fanboys will react if Superman does not deliver the final blow to Doomsday.

Please tell me you are not talking about Captain America. If you are, that had better be the product of the unique qualities of his shield (meaning they never actually strike him)