Fate of "Prime Earth" (New 52) Superman Speculation

[Beorg]

The Mr. Oz plot in Superman was set in motion by Geoff Johns way back in Superman #39 to set this up.

The hooded guy carrying a book with an S symbol on it? I was wondering what happened with him...

[NYCER]

They should just be running a two universe deal. I can't see why not, unless DC is too scared of failure or something.

I don't get that either. Put the relics on Earth-2. Or revive the ELSEWORLDS line.

[Ascended]

We have 2 supermen and 2 hal jordans,divergent since convergence,but both are the real deals (i guess),now does it matter if the old clark and hal are in the newly reformed universe or are they something that needs eliminated to stabilize the universe as is

I dont think having doppelgangers running around the same universe is, in and of itself, a bad idea. Its been done before in various fictions and sometimes done quite well (Power Girl made it work, for example). Its a hard line to walk and easy to screw up, but there's nothing *wrong* with it conceptually.

That said, I much prefer a single Superman in the DCU, for a lot of reasons. Many of those reasons are wrapped up in my own fandom and sentimentality for the character, a few of those reasons are business-based to one degree or another.

My main reason is that DC cant seem to get one Superman right, so why should I expect them to get another one right?

I think there's potential in having two Supermen running around. Its not something I really *want* to see, but in theory it could work out pretty well and be fun for as long as it lasts.

In Hal's case, I dont see that as something that can maintain, just from a character perspective. Parallax-Hal doesnt strike me as the kind of guy who would let another version of himself exist, even if Parallax-Hal himself is the aberration.

[Ascended]

The hooded guy carrying a book with an S symbol on it? I was wondering what happened with him...

Its actually Nuperman.

Totes legit.

[Sacred Knight]

I'm guessing he's Jonathan. The "real" Jonathan, if they do indeed plan on giving the middle finger to the past five years of continuity. If Johns is getting his way and its all post-Crisis all the time, then Superdad gets at least one parent back in this huge mess that they're trying to pass off as a viable main setting. I think he was originally always going to be some variation of Jonathan, just without all the other Superman-ruining Rebirth effects.

[stephens2177]

I dont think having doppelgangers running around the same universe is, in and of itself, a bad idea. Its been done before in various fictions and sometimes done quite well (Power Girl made it work, for example). Its a hard line to walk and easy to screw up, but there's nothing *wrong* with it conceptually.

That said, I much prefer a single Superman in the DCU, for a lot of reasons. Many of those reasons are wrapped up in my own fandom and sentimentality for the character, a few of those reasons are business-based to one degree or another.

My main reason is that DC cant seem to get one Superman right, so why should I expect them to get another one right?

I think there's potential in having two Supermen running around. Its not something I really *want* to see, but in theory it could work out pretty well and be fun for as long as it lasts.

In Hal's case, I dont see that as something that can maintain, just from a character perspective. Parallax-Hal doesnt strike me as the kind of guy who would let another version of himself exist, even if Parallax-Hal himself is the aberration.

The only reason superdad and powergirl is.different is that superdad was taken and "maybe" messed up somehow the alteration to the nuperman.he wasnt there to be used for the change,so how was nuperman created?

[Patrick Gerard]

The only reason superdad and powergirl is.different is that superdad was taken and "maybe" messed up somehow the alteration to the nuperman.he wasnt there to be used for the change,so how was nuperman created?

I'd go back and reread the Mr. Oz stuff from Johns' run. There were clues back there. Mr. Oz trained and placed Nuperman. The same Mr. Oz who's involved here.

[superduperman]

The hooded guy carrying a book with an S symbol on it? I was wondering what happened with him...

He's Superman's son from the Whatever Happened To The Man Of Tomorrow universe.

[manofsteel1979]

I'm guessing he's Jonathan. The "real" Jonathan, if they do indeed plan on giving the middle finger to the past five years of continuity. If Johns is getting his way and its all post-Crisis all the time, then Superdad gets at least one parent back in this huge mess that they're trying to pass off as a viable main setting. I think he was originally always going to be some variation of Jonathan, just without all the other Superman-ruining Rebirth effects.

You know...I thought that too at the time. Especially how Johns telegraphed that he thought killing off both Kents was a mistake of the New 52 ( ironic given it was he who killed pre 52 Jonathan at the end of his Brainiac arc way back when.) I was thinking that maybe it was going to be something akin to the PreCrisis story " the amazing return of Jonathan Kent".

Of course I forgot about Mr. OZ until the other day and all the spoilers. Lol

[Sacred Knight]

I suspect that this is exactly what it is.

I wouldnt be surprised to see new people in charge of DC within a year or two. I dont see this latest gimmick as having any more staying power than DCYOU, and far less than the initial reboot in 2011. Im guessing that by six months sales level out, by eight months they're dropping like a stone, and by twelve months new people are being prepped for management. By eighteen months we'll know about it, and by two years those new people will be actively running the show.

And I dont pay attention to WB, but havent they been plagued with internal problems the last few years?

One can only hope. If DC, or at the very least Superman, is to survive they cannot be given another FIVE years to fudge things up. They've already had, what, 15? Something in that ballpark at least as far as Didio and Johns are concerned. As someone who loves these characters I HAVE to be that guy at this point and root for the entire thing to fail. Even the potentially good things (not that there's that many to begin with).
Once this fails and everyone's fired, I'd honestly start all over. AGAIN. Amidst the cries of ANOTHER REBOOT??" I'd do it anyway. Only market it as a reboot done right. A complete start over. A reimagining and recreation of and lead up to the rich history of the DCU from day one. No origins and then a five-ten year time jump. No dropping you right in the middle of something with exposition on how it got here. Everything, ev-er-y-thing, starts at year one and moves forward at its own individual paces from then on. Gradually rebuilding the tapestry of the verse. Letting people know some of your favorite things won't be there right away because they come later only with the growth, but if you join in the journey they will come eventually while your appetite is whet with new ideas along the way.

But in the end maybe my idea sucks too and is not viable or feasible. I dunno, I'm not in the biz. But there has to be a group of qualified individuals out there, deserving of promotion, who know what they're doing, that can formulate a plan. Because these guys in the current seats sure as hell can't.

[Prime]

This is all horrible guys. 5 years of someone who might not be Superman.

I'm getting flashbacks to that JL episode with the Justice Guild.

Wonder Woman: why do I feel like this? He was never real in the first place.

Batman: He gave his life for us Diana, he was real to me.

[Sacred Knight]

The least these numbskulls could do for fans who became invested in the past five years would be to shell out an Ultimate line, even if its small.

[Prime]

Or you know, not make things more complicated than they already are.

[manofsteel1979]

One can only hope. If DC, or at the very least Superman, is to survive they cannot be given another FIVE years to fudge things up. They've already had, what, 15? Something in that ballpark at least as far as Didio and Johns are concerned. As someone who loves these characters I HAVE to be that guy at this point and root for the entire thing to fail. Even the potentially good things (not that there's that many to begin with).

If this fails I really don't know what happens.

Perhaps things will improve for the better and Didio and co are finally and mercifully let go , or at the very least , quarantined from Superman.

Or, given our luck, Didio and his minions stay and Warners blames the Superman character itself for its selling problems and they cease publication of the main solo Superman titles and either make him a supporting cast member in Batman books or they get rid of him and keep the " s" trademark via Supergirl or this Chinese Superman character.

And anyone thinking this couldn't happen, just Ask fans of the fantastic Four over at Marvel. And Disney is doing their damnest to sabotage the X-Men due to politics with Fox. I could definitely see WB eventually writing off new material with Supes and rely on reprints of the back catalogue and keeping the S around on secondary characters so they can still sell lunch boxes and t shirts and merchandise with that symbol on it. After all, they own THAT lock stock and barrel.

The crazy conspiracy theorist in me sometimes wonders if that is the ultimate endgame. To poison the character and franchise so badly as to push Superman completely aside as the corporate lynch pin of the comics publishing division and further increase Batmans profile within the company. The trend seems to be moving in that general direction.

After all, Batman profits, as far as I know don't have to be divided up and a portion given to Bob Kane and Bill Fingers heirs , or at least not to as significant degree, unlike the situation with Superman and the siegel and Shuster heirs.it is infamous and still ongoing. I could see them side lining Superman as a huge F--k You to them for all the years of legal fights.

[Ascended]

One can only hope. If DC, or at the very least Superman, is to survive they cannot be given another FIVE years to fudge things up. They've already had, what, 15? Something in that ballpark at least as far as Didio and Johns are concerned. As someone who loves these characters I HAVE to be that guy at this point and root for the entire thing to fail. Even the potentially good things (not that there's that many to begin with).
Once this fails and everyone's fired, I'd honestly start all over. AGAIN. Amidst the cries of ANOTHER REBOOT??" I'd do it anyway. Only market it as a reboot done right. A complete start over. A reimagining and recreation of and lead up to the rich history of the DCU from day one. No origins and then a five-ten year time jump. No dropping you right in the middle of something with exposition on how it got here. Everything, ev-er-y-thing, starts at year one and moves forward at its own individual paces from then on. Gradually rebuilding the tapestry of the verse. Letting people know some of your favorite things won't be there right away because they come later only with the growth, but if you join in the journey they will come eventually while your appetite is whet with new ideas along the way.

But in the end maybe my idea sucks too and is not viable or feasible. I dunno, I'm not in the biz. But there has to be a group of qualified individuals out there, deserving of promotion, who know what they're doing, that can formulate a plan. Because these guys in the current seats sure as hell can't.

You know, I really hate that we're at this point where we're....maybe not actively looking for DC to fail, but open to the idea. I mean....us, man, we've always tried to look on the bright side. If Myskin is the "uncomfortable truth" guy then we're the optimists. And I dont think either of us have felt too optimistic for a while.

Ive followed DC for twenty five years. Ive given them the benefit of the doubt when everything I was hearing was turning me off (the New52 being the most recent example) and more often than not, they come through on one level or another.

But this whole thing just feels like a whole new low to me. Certainly not the company's lowest point, but certainly one of their lowest creatively since Ive been reading. When you start blaming Watchmen for stuff in the DCU.....yeah, I gotta think you're beyond the point of no return. Im not one of those fans who feels like Watchmen is sacred and cant be touched, but....when was the last time we saw anything close to a forward-thinking attitude from DC? Its like they've become so creatively bankrupt they're just pulling out the old classics, looking to catch lightning in a bottle again (Before Watchmen, Dark Knight 2-3, Final Days of Superman, etc)

I want DC to do well. I want it to be successful. But I am starting to think thats not possible with the current people in charge, both at DC, and at WB, which I suspect might be the real root of the problem.