Marvel Comics and the repeated Captain Marvel (Mar-vell) red herrings

[EmeraldGladiator]

This is in regards to the recently released Marvel "hero teaser" stating a long awaited return, and what seems to be Mar-vell's chest emblem. This needs to stop. Captain Marvel as in Mar-vell is my absolute favorite Marvel comics character, but I have grown tired of Marvel comics repeated, Mar-vell's return red herrings. Constantly used to boost sales on their mini series du jor. Civil War the Return, Secret Invasion, Thanos Imperative, Chaos War, ect, ect. This shows me that Marvel comics realizes what the fans wants, and has no problem using that desire to boost sales however they refuse to give it to them. Instead they resurrect Warlock and Thanos dozens of times and gives fans the umpteenth relaunch of Moon Knight but refuse to give us Mar-vell. I would blame Joe Q and his silly beef with PAD over Genis but this predates his term as Marvel's top dog. Initially I assumed it was out of respect for Starlin but then again, these are fictional characters, and Jim has no problem invalidating the deaths of Adam Warlock and Thanos many times so why does Mar-vell only live once?

[dan12456]

The symbol in that teaser is a lot closer to Quasar's symbol than Mar-Vell's... Pretty sure that's who they are teasing.

[Moriarty]

well, while i agree with you it is tiresome they do have to use Mar-vell every few years to keep the copyright.

[EmeraldGladiator]

well, while i agree with you it is tiresome they do have to use Mar-vell every few years to keep the copyright.

I thought that was what Carol becoming Captain Marvel was for?

[Wiccan]

well, while i agree with you it is tiresome they do have to use Mar-vell every few years to keep the copyright.

They used Genis-Vell, Phyla and now Carol to keep the copyright, they don't really need Mar-Vell for it.

[Tofali]

The Adam Warlock in Infinity Entity is an alternate Warlock - Starlin didn't resurrect him.

[Holt]

Initially I assumed it was out of respect for Starlin but then again, these are fictional characters, and Jim has no problem invalidating the deaths of Adam Warlock and Thanos many times so why does Mar-vell only live once?

Because they're currently pushing a different character with the same name, complete with a live-action movie.

[protege]

Well, i'm always going to have a soft spot for the original mar-vell, but with carol in place, i've given up any hope of having him back, on a long term basis. Not interested in genis for any reason.

[EmeraldGladiator]

groan and thus it begins again...Though I wish it were true, history says otherwise.
http://www.cbr.com/secret-empire-cap...aptain-marvel/

[bigstupidjellyfish]

Jim Starlin wrote Death of Captain Marvel after his father died of cancer and when he was asked if Mar-Vell would ever come back, he replied "Yeah, when my dad comes back."

While this wouldn't stop other writers from bringing him back, they likely haven't out of respect for the story, which is one of the most impactful superhero deaths. There's also the trademark stuff. Losing the trademark would cause a lot of problems for Marvel.

[CentralPower]

If I could forgive DC for bringing back Barry Allen, I will eventually be able to forgive Marvel for bringing back Mar-Vell. But, I hope that I do not have to.

[Drops Of Venus]

groan and thus it begins again...Though I wish it were true, history says otherwise.
http://www.cbr.com/secret-empire-cap...aptain-marvel/

I found this theory a bit far-fetched. I mean, yeah, sure, maybe Nick Spencer is doing a reference to the Kree-Skrull War storyline, but there's not much evidence for you to jump from that to Mar-Vell coming back. Except for Generations, of course, but I'll wait and see with that one. Alonso said it was not time travel or AU, but BleedingCool (if they're to be trusted, that is) says otherwise. I'm not getting my hopes up until any solid information comes out.

Jim Starlin wrote Death of Captain Marvel after his father died of cancer and when he was asked if Mar-Vell would ever come back, he replied "Yeah, when my dad comes back."

While this wouldn't stop other writers from bringing him back, they likely haven't out of respect for the story, which is one of the most impactful superhero deaths. There's also the trademark stuff. Losing the trademark would cause a lot of problems for Marvel.

While that definitely explains how it's a sensitive subject to bring up, it doesn't change the fact that it has been brought up time and time again. Marvel teased and used Mar-Vell's return as a gimmick more than once. So I don't buy that respect for Jim Starlin is what motivates them, tbh.

Also, as some have said already, the trademark problem was with the title Captain Marvel, and they managed to keep it alive for years passing the title to multiple different people. And now Carol seems to have stuck as the Captain Marvel they've been looking for, so they don't need Mar-Vell anymore for trademark. If they keep bringing him back, it's simply because they can't let it go.

[EmeraldGladiator]

Marvel teased and used Mar-Vell's return as a gimmick more than once...
Also, as some have said already, the trademark problem was with the title Captain Marvel, and they managed to keep it alive for years passing the title to multiple different people. And now Carol seems to have stuck as the Captain Marvel they've been looking for, so they don't need Mar-Vell anymore for trademark. If they keep bringing him back, it's simply because they can't let it go.

I could care less about the trademark/mantle I want Mar-vell back and MU passed the name around for trademark issues but that doesn't explain why his 'return' has been teased so many times. More than once is badly underselling it. If it was just about the trademark, the last 7 returns wouldn't have been needed. It is done because there is a desire for the character but also powers at Marvel that continue to resist the notion.

[Ascended]

I think Mar-Vell's return gets teased every few years because his is one of the few deaths that stuck. Playing with that story offers a lot of narrative tools. I mean, when I first saw the cancer-verse version of Mar-Vell, I immediately knew sh*t was hitting the fan. And I only had that reaction because he's probably the most famous dead guy at Marvel this side of Uncle Ben.

Now, I dont mean any disrespect to the character or his fans when I say this, but from what I understand Mar-Vell never managed to hold down a title with consistent, strong sales. And a lot of the love for the character appears to be a case of nostalgia more than anything. That's not to say he doesnt have his fans, because clearly he does, but it appears that he does not have enough to make his return viable from a financial standpoint. And since his death is the most important thing he's ever done and had the biggest impact on the MU, undoing that kills a lot of interest.

Its like Barry Allen. He died, and over the years he attained a sort of saint-like quality to him. People, within the universe and in the real world, often spoke about Barry as if he were the greatest, most heroic hero to ever hero. But reading the guy's actual material, he doesnt live up to that hype. He had some amazing stories, no doubt, but he wasn't the ultra-hero of DC who could do no wrong that he ended up being remembered as. People *missed* Barry, but I think they (most people anyway) missed the idea of him more than the actual character. And look at Barry's sales; he sold well initially when he had the one-two combo of Geoff Johns writing him and the hype of a newly revived character, but once that excitement wore off the character has largely been a mid-tier seller ever since (outside of Flashpoint, which we knew was going to lead into a company wide reboot so of course sales were strong there).

It seems that its more lucrative for Marvel to tease Mar-Vell's return and use that to hype an Event than it is to actually bring him back from the dead, so he can end up selling what Carol is already making. For Marvel it's a zero-sum gain; Carol sells decently but not amazing, odds are that's the best that could be expected of Mar-Vell, and to top it off, Carol has a lot of externalities in her favor Mar-Vell doesnt; Carol taking the mantle actually created new fans, which the industry had been trying to do for years. It opened the floodgates for the likes of Kamala Khan, America, Moon Girl, and others to get titles, and all the female creators now working in the bullpen point to Carol and 2012 as being a turning point for female representation in Marvel. Compared to that, there's very little incentive to replace her with another straight white guy who didn't really sell better anyway, except the time he died.

[Drops Of Venus]

I think you make some valid points, Ascended, and I agree with most of them.

It's true that Mar-Vell wasn't a particularly successful hero while he was alive. His struggle with sales and the fact that he is more remembered because of his death are definitely an indication that he is more of an idealized figure in the MU. The thing is: he died in the 80s and never had a proper return ever since. In that meantime, SO much has happened and SO much has changed and, like you said about Barry Allen, he kind of became this saint-like person. If he were to TRULY come back right now, with no gimmicks, I feel like the hype around his return would be so huge that MAYBE things could improve for the Captain Marvel title. And you're right, maybe things wouldn't improve in the long-term. Maybe after a while, the excitement would just die and things would go back to the way it was... but how will they know unless they try? Because their current approach with Carol is not working and it's getting tiring; this is something most fans, including her own, can agree. I'm just saying... they have to try something new, because movies are not always a guarantee to help. It didn't help Ant-Man, and it didn't help the solos of the GOTG characters. So if it doesn't help Carol, what are they going to do? Keep relaunching her forever? Something has to change.

As for Carol changing the landscape for female heroes, yes, this is definitely something to consider, which is why I would never make Mar-Vell take her place. I mean, there's absolutely no reason why he should. Marvel created a female Hawkeye and when Clint came back, Kate didn't go away. As a matter of fact, they had a very sucessful and critically acclaimed book together. So if there's precedent for this to work, what the hell, just give it a shot. Also, it's not just about Carol. Mar-Vell had his own mythology. He could still add a lot to the cosmic scene. He could still interact with a whole bunch of characters and have a bunch of new stories within the MU. Have I mentioned how I want him to interact with Genis, Phyla and Hulkling? Only a thousand times. Honestly, at this point I just want Marvel to get their **** together and decide what they'll do with him. If they truly want him back, then bring him back for real. If they don't, then let him rest in peace for good and stop giving fans false hope. I can make my peace with Mar-Vell not coming back ever again to the MU, but Marvel makes it really hard to do when they themselves can't seem to let him go.