Marvel Comics and the repeated Captain Marvel (Mar-vell) red herrings

[EmeraldGladiator]

I think you make some valid points, Ascended, and I agree with most of them.

It's true that Mar-Vell wasn't a particularly successful hero while he was alive. His struggle with sales and the fact that he is more remembered because of his death are definitely an indication that he is more of an idealized figure in the MU. The thing is: he died in the 80s and never had a proper return ever since. In that meantime, SO much has happened and SO much has changed and, like you said about Barry Allen, he kind of became this saint-like person. If he were to TRULY come back right now, with no gimmicks, I feel like the hype around his return would be so huge that MAYBE things could improve for the Captain Marvel title. And you're right, maybe things wouldn't improve in the long-term. Maybe after a while, the excitement would just die and things would go back to the way it was... but how will they know unless they try? Because their current approach with Carol is not working and it's getting tiring; this is something most fans, including her own, can agree. I'm just saying... they have to try something new, because movies are not always a guarantee to help. It didn't help Ant-Man, and it didn't help the solos of the GOTG characters. So if it doesn't help Carol, what are they going to do? Keep relaunching her forever? Something has to change.

As for Carol changing the landscape for female heroes, yes, this is definitely something to consider, which is why I would never make Mar-Vell take her place. I mean, there's absolutely no reason why he should. Marvel created a female Hawkeye and when Clint came back, Kate didn't go away. As a matter of fact, they had a very sucessful and critically acclaimed book together. So if there's precedent for this to work, what the hell, just give it a shot. Also, it's not just about Carol. Mar-Vell had his own mythlogy. He could still add a lot to the cosmic scene. He could still interact with a whole bunch of characters and have a bunch of new stories within the MU. Have I mentioned how I want him to interact with Genis, Phyla and Hulkling? Only a thousand times. Honestly, at this point I just want Marvel to get their shit together and decide what they'll do with him. If they truly want him back, then bring him back for real. If they don't, then let him rest in peace for good and stop giving fans false hope. I can make my peace with Mar-Vell not coming back ever again to the MU, but Marvel makes it really hard to do when they themselves can't seem to let him go.

very well said, I concur, as much as I want him back (and I do) I could make peace with him staying dead if MU wouldn't dig up and parade around his corpse for sales every other year.

[Ascended]

I think you make some valid points, Ascended, and I agree with most of them.

It's true that Mar-Vell wasn't a particularly successful hero while he was alive. His struggle with sales and the fact that he is more remembered because of his death are definitely an indication that he is more of an idealized figure in the MU. The thing is: he died in the 80s and never had a proper return ever since. In that meantime, SO much has happened and SO much has changed and, like you said about Barry Allen, he kind of became this saint-like person. If he were to TRULY come back right now, with no gimmicks, I feel like the hype around his return would be so huge that MAYBE things could improve for the Captain Marvel title. And you're right, maybe things wouldn't improve in the long-term. Maybe after a while, the excitement would just die and things would go back to the way it was... but how will they know unless they try? Because their current approach with Carol is not working and it's getting tiring; this is something most fans, including her own, can agree. I'm just saying... they have to try something new, because movies are not always a guarantee to help. It didn't help Ant-Man, and it didn't help the solos of the GOTG characters. So if it doesn't help Carol, what are they going to do? Keep relaunching her forever? Something has to change.

As for Carol changing the landscape for female heroes, yes, this is definitely something to consider, which is why I would never make Mar-Vell take her place. I mean, there's absolutely no reason why he should. Marvel created a female Hawkeye and when Clint came back, Kate didn't go away. As a matter of fact, they had a very sucessful and critically acclaimed book together. So if there's precedent for this to work, what the hell, just give it a shot. Also, it's not just about Carol. Mar-Vell had his own mythlogy. He could still add a lot to the cosmic scene. He could still interact with a whole bunch of characters and have a bunch of new stories within the MU. Have I mentioned how I want him to interact with Genis, Phyla and Hulkling? Only a thousand times. Honestly, at this point I just want Marvel to get their shit together and decide what they'll do with him. If they truly want him back, then bring him back for real. If they don't, then let him rest in peace for good and stop giving fans false hope. I can make my peace with Mar-Vell not coming back ever again to the MU, but Marvel makes it really hard to do when they themselves can't seem to let him go.

You've got some good points here man (or woman?).

Now, I'd say the only reason Marvel keeps parading Mar-Vell's corpse around (as someone else said) is because you guys always buy it! I'd say that the fact that he's been dead all this time and has never really come back, and Marvel has never really put any effort into actually bringing him back, tells us all we need to know about how they view the character. He's good for short-term hype, but not for long-term gains, which makes his return unlikely. If that is how they see him, then bringing him back weakens their line (in their minds) by removing a strong Event gimmick they can pull out of storage whenever they want.

However, you're also right that Carol is struggling to reach the levels of success Marvel obviously wants her to. And odds are they're looking at the movie for a big boost to her profile....maybe. Movies dont usually impact floppy sales very much, outside of a small, quick spike. I mean, it can be great for D-listers like the GotG, but Carol and the Captain Marvel brand aren't on that level so the film might not have much impact in any case. But if the movie doesnt increase interest and sales? Well, Mar-Vell is showing up in Generations so maybe they are planting the seeds for an actual return, to help boost the brand name. I wouldn't put my money on it, but never say never. Even Bucky came back eventually.