SPOILERS: Marvel Kicks off "Civil War II" Event with Major Casualties

[MCBT]

are you sure? he really likes to kill characters.

Not only did I see her in that splash page for a future issue of the event, Kelly Thompson mentioned She-Hulk having an important role in the tie-ins with A-Force.

[dogwelder]

Any death in a Marvel comic does not surprise me.
Marvel giving out free comic books surprises me.

[FF-Fighter]

That seems like a bit of a stretch. You're suggesting that the inhuman has a vision... of himself having a vision? That sounds like a pretty over-complicated way to launch this event.

That would be a twist.

But I don't think it would work out if it was.

[MyriVerse]

I don't understand how this would lead to civil war. How is acting on someone saying, "I have a vision Thanos is going to attack." any different than acting on someone saying, "I've found evidence that Thanos is going to attack."? I haven't read the issue, so maybe I'm missing something.

Added.. I thought Civil Was 2 was going to be more Minority Report. The morality of arresting someone for a crime they haven't committed yet. Is that what they did in this issue? Go pick a fight with Thanos, before he's actually done anything?

I'm pretty sure there's going to be a slippery slope whereby they start punishing innocent people for things they've not yet done.

Why is Thanos packing like he's Cable? Usually, the guy goes hand-to-hand against people like Thor. Now he's got guns?

[BradleyFan]

I respect your opinion. but humor me for a second. isn't it possible that (if Rhodey's the one to die) this decision had nothing to do with Rhodey's race? you're kind of dismissing the character's historical importance by focusing on his skin color. he's Tony Stark's longtime friend and Carol Danvers' current bootycall. Carol and Tony represent the two sides of this event. Rhodey dying impacts both characters. back to it having nothing to do with race, they have just introduced a new black female character (Riri) over in Iron Man's book. 10 bucks says that they are positioning her to "fill in" for Rhodey. Marvel Comics, the company, isn't a collection of racists. there is more than enough evidence that they are reaching out to minority groups; probably market driven. War Machine doesn't have a book. he's not on a team. that already puts him on the chopping block. remember Disassembled? 2 white guys and a synthezoid were murdered. they were replaced by 2 white females and a young synthezoid. if you're looking for a pattern, there it is.

I respect your opinion on this matter, however, the fact of the matter still remains. A black man was killed off (if he is killed off) for the emotional narratives of two white people. There's no getting around that. Rhodey didn't (or doesn't) have to die for Carol and Tony to be at odds. He could have just been badly injured, or some other storyline that allowed him to still be alive. You even said so yourself, Rhodey dying impacts both characters, but how exactly does it serve Rhodey as a character himself? All it does is erase one black character so two white people can argue about it.

Second, Rhodey's skin color is JUST as important to his personal history. He's a lot of things, he's a military man, he's a super hero, he's a good friend, a lover, AND he's black. Why is it that when it comes to these characters, people are always trying to erase their ethnicity? Stop trying to erase his race.

Third, whether you like it or not (from your post, I can tell you don't) race is always a factor. Always. And while Marvel may not have meant to fall into this kind of trope (a black character bring used as a prop for white people's conflict) it doesn't mean the trope isn't being enacted, and it also doesn't mean people can't call it out when they see it.

Fourth, Rhodey not being in a book is no excuse to kill him off. They could have placed him in Ultimates. They could have found room for him in another Avengers book. And while I am excited for Riri as a character, (I like that we're getting more black women heroes) her appearance doesn't mean Rhodey has to die. They BOTH can be in action at the same time.

And while Marvel isn't "a collection of racists" as you say (which is something I believe as well) it doesn't mean that their somehow exempt from making racist decisions (such as killing off a black character so two white people can argue, and have big moments for their own narratives)

[Coal Tiger]

Any death in a Marvel comic does not surprise me.
Marvel giving out free comic books surprises me.

Why would it surprise you? They've been doing it this time every year for the past 10 years or so.

[UltimateTy]

Bendis's reasoning for killing Rhodey is so lame

I was aware of what happened to Rhodey in the Civil War movie when we were putting this book together. The idea of an inciting incident that could equally affect both Tony and Carol very personally was something I wanted to do. I wanted them on equal emotional footing. And, oh my god, guess who is Tony’s best friend and Carol’s sometimes lover? Both Tony and Carol could say of their actions, “Rhodey would want this,” and they would both maybe be right. I didn’t want to do anything too close to the movie but at the same time there just was no other character that could represent something so meaningful to both leading characters.

Couldn't you have done this without killing the character?

So I brought it up to the room [of writers] and certain people who were very involved in the movie agreed that there was no other character who could serve this function. It has to be character and story first so don’t worry about the other stuff. So yeah, Rhodey is having a tough time at the moment. (Laughs.) But for those fans of Rhodey I will say that in the next few issues of Iron Man, there will be quite a celebration of War Machine as a character and his friendship with Iron Man. He hasn’t been a big part of the books in a while so it’s nice to have them reunited again and experience their relationship.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/article...a=twitter_page

Yeah the arc that's clearly setting up his replacement character.

[skyvolt2000]

I respect your opinion. but humor me for a second. isn't it possible that (if Rhodey's the one to die) this decision had nothing to do with Rhodey's race? you're kind of dismissing the character's historical importance by focusing on his skin color.

Yes it possible that is true-his race had nothing to do with his death.

However that does not excuse fans from getting sick and tired of black guy killed to build up white ones.

he's Tony Stark's longtime friend and Carol Danvers' current bootycall.

Booty call? So translated to English I am suppose to believe Carol is that mad at Starks-that we get this big event over Carol mad that her sex toy is gone? That fall into the DEEPEST pit of trope.

Sorry there has to be more to that.

[skyvolt2000]

Bendis's reasoning for killing Rhodey is so lame

So a big event that will hold all books hostage will be over a dead black guy?

Carol is that mad her lover is dead? Enough to cause a Civil War again?

If she is that mad I'm sure BP will get his behind handed to him by her.

[BradleyFan]

Bendis little spiel is ridiculous. They're going to "celebrate War Machine" now? Isn't it interesting that we can only celebrate black characters when they're dead? And by "interesting" I mean infuriating.

[gurkle]

I don't actually think Rhodey being injured will have the same impact. I know death is really cheap in comic books, but it's still less cheap than serious injuries. Even in the movies, people react more strongly to deaths than injuries.

Now, that doesn't rule out people being annoyed at an important black character being offed (if indeed he is being offed). The essence of a "systemic" problem is that every individual decision may be justified on some level, but all the decisions seem to go in the same direction. Black characters are rarely leads, they're rarely merchandised and valued as much, they're often not fleshed out very much by the writers; all these and many other things go into making a character like Rhodey seem "expendable." They don't alone decide what happens to him, but they're part of the background.

Still, saying that someone is contributing to a systemic problem doesn't necessarily mean their decision was wrong. There are lots of reasons why, in individual cases, it might be the right thing to have a damsel in distress or Black Dude Dies First or any number of other familiar tropes. Tropes are not bad, so contributing to a systemic problem is at most one mark against it.

[Ms Lola]

llllllllll

[BradleyFan]

Hollywood Reporter did a write up of this new Civil War, here

This article makes a good point. This is the second time Marvel has used a black man's death to kick off some huge event. Bill Foster was the first.

It's a sad (and, almost certainly, accidental) fact that, no matter the medium or the plot, the most obvious victims of a Marvel Civil War happen to be black superheroes — an under-represented demographic in all other respects — especially when there are far more deserving white heroes primed for retirement

[gurkle]

If I were Robbie Robertson I'd be hoping I'm not in any Marvel events any time soon.

[Danileriver23]

I respect your opinion on this matter, however, the fact of the matter still remains. A black man was killed off (if he is killed off) for the emotional narratives of two white people. There's no getting around that. Rhodey didn't (or doesn't) have to die for Carol and Tony to be at odds. He could have just been badly injured, or some other storyline that allowed him to still be alive. You even said so yourself, Rhodey dying impacts both characters, but how exactly does it serve Rhodey as a character himself? All it does is erase one black character so two white people can argue about it.

Second, Rhodey's skin color is JUST as important to his personal history. He's a lot of things, he's a military man, he's a super hero, he's a good friend, a lover, AND he's black. Why is it that when it comes to these characters, people are always trying to erase their ethnicity? Stop trying to erase his race.

Third, whether you like it or not (from your post, I can tell you don't) race is always a factor. Always. And while Marvel may not have meant to fall into this kind of trope (a black character bring used as a prop for white people's conflict) it doesn't mean the trope isn't being enacted, and it also doesn't mean people can't call it out when they see it.

Fourth, Rhodey not being in a book is no excuse to kill him off. They could have placed him in Ultimates. They could have found room for him in another Avengers book. And while I am excited for Riri as a character, (I like that we're getting more black women heroes) her appearance doesn't mean Rhodey has to die. They BOTH can be in action at the same time.

And while Marvel isn't "a collection of racists" as you say (which is something I believe as well) it doesn't mean that their somehow exempt from making racist decisions (such as killing off a black character so two white people can argue, and have big moments for their own narratives)

While I don't really agree with the point's you've made, I guess I could understand how some people be upset with this. A counterpoint though: I think it's a little disingenuous to say that Rhodey can't die because he's black. I don't want to live in a world where nothing bad can happen to minority characters because there minorities. This isn't like when goliath got killed and they just killed a guy who happened to be black. Rhodey is connected to both of the main players (Stark and Carol) in a major way. Just because people claim that his death has nothing to do with his race doesn't mean they are erasing his race, it's jus that some people see his death and don't factor in his race because in this scenario it shouldn't matter. It doesn't matter that his girlfriend and best friend are white, it matters that they are his girlfriend and best friend.

Also, lets be frank for a moment, Rhodey has no place in Ultimates. What would could he really do on that team? And while it's true, he could have been in another book ,its possible that no one wanted to use him, which is perfectly fine. Marvel was going to kill a character regardless. Rhodey just happened to make the most sense.