View Poll Results: Do you feel the legacy aspect in DC does more harm than good?

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  • Yes

    26 21.85%
  • No

    53 44.54%
  • Depends on the character

    40 33.61%
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  1. #61
    Mighty Member Iconic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Godlike13 View Post
    Its a role, a different perspective, that can and have made for interesting narratives. Like with Wally who took over for a substantial time after Barry died, or with Dick who rebelled against the legacy of Batman, distanced himself, and created Nightwing. Just because they might never ultimately reach the mantle, or only might for a limited time, doesn't mean they can't and don't play with the idea of it or use it to help create stories and add drama. It also creates the idea of having a legacy for their respective mentors, and adds a sense of reason to them mentoring proteges.
    Its a glass ceiling. As a fan, why invest in a character that will permanently reside in another's shadow? It's not enjoyable to follow a dead end for the sake of 1 or 2 cool arcs. No matter what, there's no expansion.

  2. #62
    Astonishing Member Vinsanity's Avatar
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    Depends on the character. It's not black or white.

  3. #63
    Astonishing Member El_Gato's Avatar
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    How does everyone feel about the introduction of a new generation of legacy sidekick characters? It seems like we are on the cusp of one! With Damien/Robin, Jonathan/Superboy, Wallace/Kid Flash, Jackson/Aqualad, Emiko Queen...etc I'm not sure how I feel about it.


    Dick/Tim/Damien
    Wally/Bart/Wallace
    Garth/?/Jackson
    Donna/Cassie/?
    Roy/Cissie/Emiko
    ?/Conner/Jonathan
    Tula/Lorena/?


    It seems gen 1 is missing a Superman family member, although some could make the argument for Supergirl. Gen 2 is missing a male Aquaman family member. And gen 3 is missing both a Wonder Woman family member and a female Aquaman family member.
    Done with DC. Can't handle the constant whiplash! Time to go on a hiatus!

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by El_Gato View Post
    How does everyone feel about the introduction of a new generation of legacy sidekick characters? It seems like we are on the cusp of one! With Damien/Robin, Jonathan/Superboy, Wallace/Kid Flash, Jackson/Aqualad, Emiko Queen...etc I'm not sure how I feel about it.


    Dick/Tim/Damien
    Wally/Bart/Wallace
    Garth/?/Jackson
    Donna/Cassie/?
    Roy/Cissie/Emiko
    ?/Conner/Jonathan
    Tula/Lorena/?


    It seems gen 1 is missing a Superman family member, although some could make the argument for Supergirl. Gen 2 is missing a male Aquaman family member. And gen 3 is missing both a Wonder Woman family member and a female Aquaman family member.
    Eventually the New Teen Titans will be reunited, cause DC can't escape that lineup, and Damian's Teen Titans will be left with some empty slots. So I agree with your idea, DC might even be setting it up right now with Jon, Emiko etc. But not for a few years, I like how things are at the moment but planning ahead is always good. Throw in a new Young Justice team and everything is literally perfect.

  5. #65
    Spectacular Member Earth-2 Refugee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post
    I actually do not care for the legacy stuff. It works for SOME characters, but just a few. The Flash, Green Lantern, maybe a few second and third tier guys and gals (Starman, Hourman, etc). For the most part it's needless.

    Superman is Clark Kent/Kal-El. Batman is Bruce Wayne. Wonder Woman is Diana. Aquaman is Arthur Curry. Giving everyone a legacy is detrimental to the brand and the core of the characters themselves. Having 35 Robins does nothing but water down what it means to see Dick Grayson hand those pixie boots over to a new kid. Occasionally it can be a fun story (Batman Beyond was a solid show), but largely it does little to help.

    Honestly I'd even move the Flash away from legacy stuff. It gets in the way of seeing a fast dude in scarlet, defying space/time, and fighting giant apes.
    If we didn't have the Legacy, we'd lose 6 Green Lanterns (Hal Jordan, Guy Gardner, Jon Stewart, Kyle Rayner, Simon Baz, Jessica Cruz), 3 Flashes (Barry Allen, Wally West, Bart Allen), a Mr. Terrific (Michael Holt), 6 Sandmen (Garrett Sanford, Hector Hall, Dream, Daniel Hall, Sandy Hawkins, Kieran Marshall), 2 Hourmen (Rick Tyler and Matthew Tyler), 7 Starmen (Mikaal Tomas, Prince Gavyn, Will Payton, David Knight, Jack Knight, Thom Kallor, Farris Knight, Victor Sono), a Hawkgirl (Kendra Saunders), 4 Robins (Jason Todd, Tim Drake, Stephanie Brown, Damian Wayne), a Wonder Girl (Cassie Sandsmark), a Aqualad (Kaldur'ahm), 2 Blue Beetles (Ted Kord and Jaime Reyes), and so much more. The DC Universe is all about Legacy, and taking away that Legacy only hurt the DC Universe in the New 52. No matter what, the Legacy needs to stay.
    If you're going to argue about accessibility, there's the Internet. You can get the history on all of these characters in moments. When I first read comics, I didn't know a lot, but I learned by reading stuff online and paying attention to the small details in comics. Will it be a challenge to get in? Yes, but nothing good comes easy.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash Gordon View Post
    I actually do not care for the legacy stuff. It works for SOME characters, but just a few. The Flash, Green Lantern, maybe a few second and third tier guys and gals (Starman, Hourman, etc). For the most part it's needless.

    Superman is Clark Kent/Kal-El. Batman is Bruce Wayne. Wonder Woman is Diana. Aquaman is Arthur Curry. Giving everyone a legacy is detrimental to the brand and the core of the characters themselves. Having 35 Robins does nothing but water down what it means to see Dick Grayson hand those pixie boots over to a new kid. Occasionally it can be a fun story (Batman Beyond was a solid show), but largely it does little to help.

    Honestly I'd even move the Flash away from legacy stuff. It gets in the way of seeing a fast dude in scarlet, defying space/time, and fighting giant apes.
    This has literally never happened. The Flash has had all that stuff and legacy.

  7. #67
    BANNED colonyofcells's Avatar
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    Maybe split into 2 lines : a traditional line with the traditional stuff like legacies, and a newer line that is simpler for newer customers. The internet is probably large enough for multiple lines of dc comics.

  8. #68
    Ultimate Member SiegePerilous02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Earth-2 Refugee View Post
    If we didn't have the Legacy, we'd lose 6 Green Lanterns (Hal Jordan, Guy Gardner, Jon Stewart, Kyle Rayner, Simon Baz, Jessica Cruz), 3 Flashes (Barry Allen, Wally West, Bart Allen), a Mr. Terrific (Michael Holt), 6 Sandmen (Garrett Sanford, Hector Hall, Dream, Daniel Hall, Sandy Hawkins, Kieran Marshall), 2 Hourmen (Rick Tyler and Matthew Tyler), 7 Starmen (Mikaal Tomas, Prince Gavyn, Will Payton, David Knight, Jack Knight, Thom Kallor, Farris Knight, Victor Sono), a Hawkgirl (Kendra Saunders), 4 Robins (Jason Todd, Tim Drake, Stephanie Brown, Damian Wayne), a Wonder Girl (Cassie Sandsmark), a Aqualad (Kaldur'ahm), 2 Blue Beetles (Ted Kord and Jaime Reyes), and so much more. The DC Universe is all about Legacy, and taking away that Legacy only hurt the DC Universe in the New 52. No matter what, the Legacy needs to stay.
    If you're going to argue about accessibility, there's the Internet. You can get the history on all of these characters in moments. When I first read comics, I didn't know a lot, but I learned by reading stuff online and paying attention to the small details in comics. Will it be a challenge to get in? Yes, but nothing good comes easy.
    I'd argue that having 6 Earth based Green Lanterns and 4 Robins is hardly a good thing.

    It wasn't the lack of legacy that hurt the New 52, it was the fact that it was so poorly planned out. It was a rush job, and it showed in the product. Even so, there were some bright spots. Morrison's Action Comics were the best Superman comics in years and restored a lot of pre-Crisis elements that the character badly needed. Wonder Woman's corner had been dead in the water since Rucka got kicked off, and while I'm not wild about the Azzarello reboot, a clean slate was desperately needed. We got the best Aquaman run ever, and Shazam was pretty great too. None of these things were negatively impacted by a lack of legacy.

  9. #69
    Spectacular Member Earth-2 Refugee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    I'd argue that having 6 Earth based Green Lanterns and 4 Robins is hardly a good thing.

    It wasn't the lack of legacy that hurt the New 52, it was the fact that it was so poorly planned out. It was a rush job, and it showed in the product. Even so, there were some bright spots. Morrison's Action Comics were the best Superman comics in years and restored a lot of pre-Crisis elements that the character badly needed. Wonder Woman's corner had been dead in the water since Rucka got kicked off, and while I'm not wild about the Azzarello reboot, a clean slate was desperately needed. We got the best Aquaman run ever, and Shazam was pretty great too. None of these things were negatively impacted by a lack of legacy.
    Imagine the fans lost though. Jon Stewart fans? Hal Jordan fans? Alan Scott fans? Kyle Rayner fans? What about Red Hood fans? Tim Drake fans? Damian Wayne fans? These legacies have improved the DC Universe. Jaime Reyes gave us one of the best Blue Beetle comics showing that embracing Legacy can make something great and epic. The Dr. Fate comic currently out is technically a Legacy book and people like that.
    Yes, parts of the DC Universe improved from the clean slate, but a lot suffered. Blue Beetle for instance. Flash took a big hit, and Batgirl fans were split after the loss of Stephanie and Cassandra. Titans fans lost all of their history, and three of the original Titans were nowhere to be found. In the end, killing the legacy did hurt the New 52 just as much as it helped.

  10. #70
    Mighty Member Samm's Avatar
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    Bringing back this old thread because I feel it’s relevant to a debate going on in the 5G thread in regards to diversity (Legacy vs Original).

    Legacy: Jaime Reyes, John Stewart, Jessica Cruz, Cassandra Cain, Michael Holt, Ryan Choi, Jason Rusch

    Original: Jefferson Pierce, Mari McCabe, Beatriz DaCosta, Cisco Ramone, Derek James, Karen Beecher, Mal Duncan

    Which do you prefer?

  11. #71
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    The problem with I have with Legacy is how pointless it is. If they're not going to replace the originals eventually, then they're pretty redundant. This is something that's become more blatant as new legacy characters get created, but the old ones never seem to age. It's especially ridiculous with the amount of Robins that Batman goes through.

    How many people that love Legacy characters are prepared to have them replace the old ones?

  12. #72
    The Man Who Cannot Die manwhohaseverything's Avatar
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    It depends on character and writing.
    Quote Originally Posted by SiegePerilous02 View Post
    I'd argue that having 6 Earth based Green Lanterns and 4 Robins is hardly a good thing.

    It wasn't the lack of legacy that hurt the New 52, it was the fact that it was so poorly planned out. It was a rush job, and it showed in the product. Even so, there were some bright spots. Morrison's Action Comics were the best Superman comics in years and restored a lot of pre-Crisis elements that the character badly needed. Wonder Woman's corner had been dead in the water since Rucka got kicked off, and while I'm not wild about the Azzarello reboot, a clean slate was desperately needed. We got the best Aquaman run ever, and Shazam was pretty great too. None of these things were negatively impacted by a lack of legacy.
    Good luck having just jsa, superman, batman, mm.. Etc in the shared universe and getting rid of justice league. Personally, wouldn't mind that.But,wally west fans alone would be giving a backlash.Having all them silverage and modern age guy/gal/other fans rioting would be a fun treat. I would get my popcorn ready.
    Last edited by manwhohaseverything; 09-19-2020 at 10:47 PM.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by PCN24454 View Post
    The problem with I have with Legacy is how pointless it is. If they're not going to replace the originals eventually, then they're pretty redundant. This is something that's become more blatant as new legacy characters get created, but the old ones never seem to age. It's especially ridiculous with the amount of Robins that Batman goes through.
    That's an issue with DC's refusal to let characters age than a problem with legacy itself.

    How many people that love Legacy characters are prepared to have them replace the old ones?
    I'd imagine just about any fan of legacy characters has no issue with this.

  14. #74
    Extraordinary Member Restingvoice's Avatar
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    When they first made Legacy characters like Wally replacing Barry, Kyle replacing Hal, and Cass Cain replacing Barbara, they have no intention of resurrecting or returning anyone, so Legacy is good (I'm not saying that killing or maiming previous heroes good, just that there is a purpose to the Legacy)

    However since DC now made it clear that they want some characters to stay the way they are they should stop making new ones

    The Robins are in a better position than most because when they graduate they create new identities for themselves, though even that's getting more vague these days because DC treats whoever's the current Robin and the Robin graduates as the same type of characters instead of one as a sidekick while the others are their own heroes.

    Their insistence of holding them all under Batman while at the same time keeping their distance from him make each of them feels more like Batman Extension #1 #2 #3 instead of heroes with their own stories. They're neither his full supporting cast nor fully independent.

  15. #75
    Kon-El "The Scion" SuperX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Z View Post
    That's an issue with DC's refusal to let characters age than a problem with legacy itself.



    I'd imagine just about any fan of legacy characters has no issue with this.

    Most characters with legacy t characters H as ve powers thst "could" keep them young or young looking, I think DC should take advantage of thst.

    I don't want my favorite leg ft characters to take over mantles, I like the mantles right where they are I want the legacy characters to get "nightwinged" and get new hero identities.

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