Can Someone Explain the Criticism of Bendis' Avengers?

[Ultimate Captain America]

Ron Marz and Keith Giffen were pretty faithful to Starlin's Thanos i think.

I have read the Green Lantern / Silver Surfer crossover. Thanos seems to be like Starlin's one, but it was all a charade, he just wants to destroy two universes because death.

[pageturner]

Hey guys so I recently jumped off of Marvel comics and decided to work my way backwards through time (I barely recognize Marvel, that's a convo for another thread). I started with Hickman's Avengers/New Avengers run and enjoyed it but missed the classic trappings of the Avengers. Then I heard Bendis' run was spectacular especially with Spidey and Wolvie joining the Avengers. So I picked up the Omni and I am immensely enjoying it. Especially because he does not have a cynical outlook on heroes, even after Disassembled there was optimism and I love it.

I tried finding some sites to help me figure out all of the supplemental reading (and there is A LOT, man he wrote SO much), and there are lot of comic sites and forum posts that were highly critical of his run.

My question to you is, why? I mean he must have been doing something good he wrote so much and for so long and I'm assuming it sold a lot. He created so many iconic characters and concepts (Daisy, Maria Hill, Secret Warriors etc).

He added stuff, changed stuff, some characters "died", He let two of the biggest names ( spidey and Wolverine) on the team, too much luke cage, they talk to much, they should be fighting galactic enemies not the Hood.

take your pick i have heard all of that and more. Me I enjoyed most of it.

[pageturner]

What "42nd street thug" says something like "whores heart"?

maybe a guy on the Deuce?

[CaptainMar-Vell92 of the Kree]

I have read the Green Lantern / Silver Surfer crossover. Thanos seems to be like Starlin's one, but it was all a charade, he just wants to destroy two universes because death.

To be fair, that was an out of continuity crossover. Marz was pretty solid on Thanos in Cosmic Powers and Cosmic Powers Unlimited.

[CaptainMar-Vell92 of the Kree]

He added stuff, changed stuff, some characters "died", He let two of the biggest names ( spidey and Wolverine) on the team, too much luke cage, they talk to much, they should be fighting galactic enemies not the Hood.

take your pick i have heard all of that and more. Me I enjoyed most of it.

I didn't had much issue with Spiderman as an Avenger, since It helped the team become more famous, because sadly, before the MCU if you weren't a Spider-Man or X-Men related character, almost nobody will give a s*** about you and your series.

[XPac]

He added stuff, changed stuff, some characters "died", He let two of the biggest names ( spidey and Wolverine) on the team, too much luke cage, they talk to much, they should be fighting galactic enemies not the Hood.

take your pick i have heard all of that and more. Me I enjoyed most of it.

Yeah, I'm sort of in the same boat. I do think there's a lot you can credibly criticise Bendis run for as far as characterization, continuity, pet charcters, etc.

That said, it was one of my favorite Avengers runs. It was a fun book using a lot of fun characters. And it made the Avengers feel as important as I at least felt it should have ALWAYS been. I think towards the end there, but I don't think he can be faulted for not. I don't believe anyone has ever written more issues of Avengers than him, and I'm not sure anyone ever will again.

[Electricmastro]

2. Somewhat related, Spider-Man and Wolverine had never been Avengers and traditionalists felt that it was breaking that tradition for the sake of pumping up sales (which, again, is true).

Well at that point, I think it's fair enough to say that the "tradition boat" had sailed away long before the New Avengers, considering how Spider-Man and Wolverine had worked together on the Defenders in 1993, once again no doubt because of a desire to sell more books.

[XPac]

Well at that point, I think it's fair enough to say that the "tradition boat" had sailed away long before the New Avengers, considering how Spider-Man and Wolverine had worked together on the Defenders in 1993, once again no doubt because of a desire to sell more books.

In all fairness Spider-Man actually already was a reserve Avenger prior to Bendis making him a full time member. So turning an Avenger reservist into a full fledge Avenger isn't the biggest step in the world.

[GenericUsername]

Scarlet Witch has become such a dynamic and interesting character.

I wish this were true. But she was dynamic and interesting before. That just fridged her, and pulled her from comics for seven years. She's never restored her status with the Avengers.

[mr_crisp]

I wish this were true. But she was dynamic and interesting before. That just fridged her, and pulled her from comics for seven years. She's never restored her status with the Avengers.

Or some readers. I can't look at her the same way again.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Well at that point, I think it's fair enough to say that the "tradition boat" had sailed away long before the New Avengers, considering how Spider-Man and Wolverine had worked together on the Defenders in 1993, once again no doubt because of a desire to sell more books.

The diffrence between this team and New Avengers is that the 'new' Fantastic Four actually acted as foils to one another (and was intended as goofy)

[davew128]

He added stuff, changed stuff, some characters "died", He let two of the biggest names ( spidey and Wolverine) on the team

Not for nothing, but Spidey has a long history associating with the Avengers. He had been a reserve member since the early 90's.

[Michael Watkins]

He only respects his own continuity and often failed to adhere to that

He called the Avengers bottom-feeders before disbanding them

He kills characters for sport instead of furthering the story and for attention

Jessica Jones' involvement with the team was 100% self-fan-service and nepotism of the highest order

He uses his own voice in lieu of writing characters as if they existed before him

A lot of the damage he did was written to be permanent or at least hard to undo ex. Having Cage impregnate and marry his pet character/having Doom impregnate that Perrara woman

He's, ironically, awful at writing women. I'm still angry about him having Carol Danvers cry in front of Norman Osborn. try to imagine Hawkeye doing the same.

I'm glad that he's gone. I wish they would erase all of his continuity and start fresh. One of Quesada's biggest failings was letting friendship influence his decision making.

[XPac]

He only respects his own continuity and often failed to adhere to that

He called the Avengers bottom-feeders before disbanding them

He kills characters for sport instead of furthering the story and for attention

Jessica Jones' involvement with the team was 100% self-fan-service and nepotism of the highest order

He uses his own voice in lieu of writing characters as if they existed before him

A lot of the damage he did was written to be permanent or at least hard to undo ex. Having Cage impregnate and marry his pet character/having Doom impregnate that Perrara woman

He's, ironically, awful at writing women. I'm still angry about him having Carol Danvers cry in front of Norman Osborn. try to imagine Hawkeye doing the same.

I'm glad that he's gone. I wish they would erase all of his continuity and start fresh. One of Quesada's biggest failings was letting friendship influence his decision making.

It wasn't JUST friendship. Bendis was arguably the top selling writer in the entire industry for the better part of a decade. I'm betting that had something to do with the amount of influence he had.

[Michael Watkins]

It wasn't JUST friendship. Bendis was arguably the top selling writer in the entire industry for the better part of a decade. I'm betting that had something to do with the amount of influence he had.

That just makes me think less of the readership.