Should We New52 Superman Fans Resign Ourselves to SuperDad, and, if so, How?

[Sacred Knight]

He knows how these guys operate better than any of us. I'm sure he's not surprised.

[adrikito]

The more I think about the "Its not a reboot...and it never was" .

NOW I UNDERSTAND THIS.. AND I HATE THIS.

I regret for coming to DC.. I chose the worst years .. For now they will change the things. Never was my initially idea see superman(I thought the same thing of now about him.), starting with rebirth would not have had false hopes, crushed now.

I should not have started in DC until now, because I would not hate this, I do not know what happened... because I would have ignored this..

Each new fact gives me more desire to leave DC or just buy Batman.. This character younger or older(I do not trust in the end of rebirth..) can not be changed.

[BeefBourguignon]

I really enjoyed the Byrne stuff starting at the Man of Steel 6 issue mini then he did issues of Action until it went weekly and the main Superman title. after the events of that run it goes into exile which was fantastic I don't want to drop spoilers of why things are going on if you never read it. Lex Luther the unauthorized biography was a really cool deluxe format book as was the Odyssey.

I loved the issues with Maxima, Panic in the Sky, a couple of the Armageddon annuals were cool just off the top of my head.

The triangle era people speak of was Jurgens Roger Stern and Louise Simonson and while each book had it's own feel they all acknowledged the events of the others and the A plot would string through them while they all explored their own B plot.

Yes, agreed with your thoughts. I would also recommend late 1980s Superboy Pocket universe story, then first Brainiac story and then Supergirl/Pocket Universe story, and from there is a straight line through the consequences of Superman dealing with Zod and other Kryptonian villains. Finally then comes Exile (my favorite, and has George Perez writing and art) and Krypton Man arcs. All one big epic saga made up of smaller arcs. Back then having writers work closely together allowed this kind of epic storytelling and cohesive continuity. One arc would lead to another and then another, etc., logically. It was great times for Superman imo. That was even a few years before the triangle system.

[Robotman]

They're really going out of their way to make Superdad seem more conservative and "traditional". The serious family man wearing the tucked in flannel shirt. What I loved about the New 52 Superman was that he went back to his social crusader roots and that he actually had a sense of humor.

[adrikito]

They're really going out of their way to make Superdad seem more conservative and "traditional". The serious family man wearing the tucked in flannel shirt. What I loved about the New 52 Superman was that he went back to his social crusader roots and that he actually had a sense of humor.

Conservative and Traditional.. So I thought it would Superman in the comics 2 years ago.. and I lost 2 years supporting one superman who would fall within a few years.. I regret not having started earlier and not starting now.. I would never have read superman because now is not the kind of hero I like..

IS A NEW BEGIN? MAYBE.. but I still remember the past and that can not be changed.

Now SM lose what little fun and cool it could be the character for superdad.

[Kuwagaton]

Spidey is still Peter Parker, from Queens, has the powers, and....far as I know hasn't had a stable job in years, just a string of short-lived careers since leaving the Bugle. But Parker Industries isnt so far off from Horizon Labs, really. Parker's just moved up the corporate ladder. I dont think you can really say that Stark-lite Parker is a big change in the character but post-Crisis wasn't.

But, as I understand it, you're not that well versed in the older pre-Crisis stuff, so its not surprising you dont see the differences.

If you have to be well versed to see it, I don't think it's the same as Spider-Man. Compare 1985 to 1995, 1981 to 1991, 1998 to 2008, or 2001 to 2011 for both characters. Look at the difference between 2006 and 2016 Spider-Man, and realize that this character has never rebooted.

Once Loeb came in around 2000 with his run, all traces of Superman disappeared and Clark himself just became a big dumb lovable farmboy. Which in and of itself wasn't in keeping with Clark's traditional characterization. That guy might have come from a farm but was fairly cosmopolitan. Even the Triangle Era got that part right.

This isn't wholly true. Schultz and Casey wrote him the same as ever. Maybe the farm thing came up way more frequently after 1999, but "big and dumb" isn't something you came away with reading so many of his good comics.

Best example is the excellent Adventures of Superman #599.

he actually had a sense of humor.

Maybe, but not a good one, haha. Mileage varies with that sort of thing.

[Agent Z]

They're really going out of their way to make Superdad seem more conservative and "traditional". The serious family man wearing the tucked in flannel shirt. What I loved about the New 52 Superman was that he went back to his social crusader roots and that he actually had a sense of humor.

And how long did the social crusader last in Morrison's run exactly? Also, being a family man and social crusader aren't mutually exclusive. You seem to be basing this on how the guy dresses rather than how he acts.

[Cmbmool]

I've been a great fan of Marvel comics Spider-girl and the MC-2 Universe of next generation heroes that came from it. I have been a huge Batman/Catwoman supporter that I've supported the original Earth-2 Huntress/Helena Wayne and not the current Robin, Damien Wayne.

I've never been a great fan of the New 52 Superman, mostly due to how he was introduced and how his own history turned out, and I never was a fan of the new 52 Superman costume.

So yeah I'm a great supporter to the Lois and Clark Marriage and I'm ready to throw in my support to Superdad.

[BeefBourguignon]

Superman has been accused of being "too old-fashioned" by detractors for the longest time. It is like a badge of honor!

[suemorphplus209]

I sort of made a similar point in another thread recently.

People dismiss when I say that the whole situation with the Superman/ Wonder woman romance thing and how they treated Lois in the first year or two of the New 52 was done on purpose to create fan controversy. People don't want to believe their long wished for ship being brought into continuity for the purpose of creating "team clois" and " team cliana" factions battling it out on the web to create buzz in fandom and sales. I often said as soon as DC had tired of this and squeezed as much controversy they could out of the situation, they'd find another target and angle. They did then with having Lois outting Clark and then Clark subsequently becoming a douche nozzle. Once they bled that dry, now they are now trolling fandom again with this whole " which Superman is the 'real' one ?"stuff that the rebirth special is teasing us all with now and looks like they dont intend on giving clear answers anytime soon.

The New 52 was one long troll and it looks like Rebirth is following suit, at least for Superman. Its quite sad.

I saw New 52 as essentially being like 1938. Back in that year, Lois Lane started off as an ******* to Clark Kent while liking Superman. She put sleeping pills in Clark Kent's drink, tried to get him fired, etc. Obviously, that changed in the Golden Age, but that's how it started off in 1938.

[adrikito]

A little part of n52 superman will be in superdad... all advantages for him.

THE ANSWER.

-This rebirth start with super dad, now clark kent appears suddenly..
-Then, Clark Kent appears in the arms of super dad..
-Justice League, superdad is here.. But... you see his face? Is superdad but seems an arrogant man(like n52 superman)

they have merged I not see other explanation..

-Is a method to not completely remove it? maybe..
-Gives advantages for superdad in the justice league? enough and with it the memory of superman.

A method to join the fans of both sides........ the two halves together.. Remember this, superdad begin his serie without all his powers..


You saw hairstyle superwoman .. and the disease.. the two halves here also be rejoined .. They will adapt Super Dad and his wife into this world, adding them the memories of their versions here and the thing makes sense.. now we have superdad, superson(superboy) and supermom.. it sounds ridiculous


With This I do not to say that I am in favor to this. We live the life of superdad before flashpoint and his family. Every time I have less desire to the Super Tittles of rebirth They will suffer more changes than the other characters.

[suemorphplus209]

Well, Im not going to apologize for my opinion, and if people left because of the opinions myself and other like-minded posters have, that's on them. Its not like we're out here accusing people of not being "real fans" or telling them they "dont get the character" or they're "sexists" or somesuch BS. I've yet to see anyone chased away with pitchforks and torches.

Personally, its not even Superdad that has me ready to leave. Yes, what you say applies to me pretty much across the board, but Superman as a father is something Ive always wanted to see (along with the beard, which is bitchin'), Jon has my interest, and in the early-mid 90's the line was running on a high point I wouldnt mind seeing return. Really, just looking at the broad strokes, this is a status quo Ive been waiting fifteen years to see.

What's pissed us off (well me anyway) is the manner in which DC has brought about these changes. Its not about any particular version. This is just not good storytelling. This isn't being respectful to the source material or the fans. This is just insulting, lazy, and shows that DC has no interest in long-form storytelling and are just chasing short-term gains. Its bad business, bad for consumer confidence, and Id be saying the same thing if they were bringing back the original Kal-L. Granted, if that were the case I might be slightly more inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt, but bottom line is DC has become incapable of telling good stories regardless of what version of Superman they're using. If they were rolling out Kal-L the stories would likely still be questionable as hell and the execution likely just as bad as what Nuperman has had the last year or two, and what Superdad had before him.

I don't know, but the fact that knowing that there were two Supermen during some shitty times for the other guy made me ask where the f^&* the other guy is. It certainly didn't make me admire DC's writing. I don't care which alternate universe Superman has to show up, just make him enter the universe in the middle of an incident, make it known to the regular universe superheroes that there's two plus a Superboy, and work from there. Grounded was boring, but it was an open-ended and an okay sendoff in the end in the sense that he's back to work and back to doing the Superman routine. This whole, bizarre, storyline kills appeal for a character that I actually had some liking for, because it tells a story with plotholes in an unappealing way. I don't like the idea of pondering where the f^&* the other guy is. I like Superman as a father, heck, I have plenty of stories where he is one. But this story is f#%& stupid. It makes me feel like some people who hate the character are kind of right. I guess it comes with the territory of wanting to see Superman go help another person or something.

If they brought back Kal-L to go and do exactly the kind of story that they have done with Superdad, it would be similarly unappealing to me.

[DieHard200904]

Well, Im not going to apologize for my opinion, and if people left because of the opinions myself and other like-minded posters have, that's on them. Its not like we're out here accusing people of not being "real fans" or telling them they "dont get the character" or they're "sexists" or somesuch BS. I've yet to see anyone chased away with pitchforks and torches.

Personally, its not even Superdad that has me ready to leave. Yes, what you say applies to me pretty much across the board, but Superman as a father is something Ive always wanted to see (along with the beard, which is bitchin'), Jon has my interest, and in the early-mid 90's the line was running on a high point I wouldnt mind seeing return. Really, just looking at the broad strokes, this is a status quo Ive been waiting fifteen years to see.

What's pissed us off (well me anyway) is the manner in which DC has brought about these changes. Its not about any particular version. This is just not good storytelling. This isn't being respectful to the source material or the fans. This is just insulting, lazy, and shows that DC has no interest in long-form storytelling and are just chasing short-term gains. Its bad business, bad for consumer confidence, and Id be saying the same thing if they were bringing back the original Kal-L. Granted, if that were the case I might be slightly more inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt, but bottom line is DC has become incapable of telling good stories regardless of what version of Superman they're using. If they were rolling out Kal-L the stories would likely still be questionable as hell and the execution likely just as bad as what Nuperman has had the last year or two, and what Superdad had before him.

As I mentioned earlier, this is all about being focused on events above focus on character. Personally, I am sick of reboot after reboot with DC. Look, if they want to reset their universe and have that itchy trigger finger to do so, they are getting rediculous. I mean Marvel retcons a bit here and there, but actually rebooting the whole deal in a couple years isn't exactly something they do. Right now, it appears that DC just wants to essentially chicken out and hit the reset button when they could just try sticking to something and telling a story, which is downright lazy. At this point, it would be nice to see DC tank, and have their leadership change. Honestly, with the talent moving away, something tells me that the higher ups at DC are probably not great people to work with.

[DieHard200904]

A little part of n52 superman will be in superdad... all advantages for him.

THE ANSWER.

-This rebirth start with super dad, now clark kent appears suddenly..
-Then, Clark Kent appears in the arms of super dad..
-Justice League, superdad is here.. But... you see his face? Is superdad but seems an arrogant man(like n52 superman)

they have merged I not see other explanation..

-Is a method to not completely remove it? maybe..
-Gives advantages for superdad in the justice league? enough and with it the memory of superman.

A method to join the fans of both sides........ the two halves together.. Remember this, superdad begin his serie without all his powers..


You saw hairstyle superwoman .. and the disease.. the two halves here also be rejoined .. They will adapt Super Dad and his wife into this world, adding them the memories of their versions here and the thing makes sense


With This I do not to say that I am in favor to this. We live the life of superdad before flashpoint and his family. Every time I have less desire to the Super Tittles of rebirth They will suffer more changes than the other characters.

If they do, it's not winning me back, it's still chickening out and showing a lack of creative backbone.

[adrikito]

If they do, it's not winning me back, it's still chickening out and showing a lack of creative backbone.

I have come to this conclusion after talking to a user of ComicVine.. This said that this does not look like a clone saga.. and about 2 halves, he told me that both superman were valid..

Definitely. the pre-flashpoint was altered to new52... but.. two characters escaped of this, thanks brainiac Now these characters will be reunited with their other halves.. even superwoman is required to be part of this.. I was surprised that suddenly a young lois take his hair with that style.


We go to live the life of superdad adding superman heroic life... Because DC want to add in his memory everything that lived new52 superman.


It seems so convincing and flawless, superdad would know everything, nothing could remove him and olds fans happy, that this is the end.

For the new fans not say now that everything is in favor of the old continuity in superman... DC answers now that they are two halves together.. and so new fans can not say that they killed our superman.

AND THIS IS... REBIRTH OF SUPERMAN .. now we know the purpose .. who are interested will buy.. I am not interested


this is what the user manofsteel 1979 said.. Cut and paste.