My Joker Theory (rebirth #1 spoilers)

[Media_Cultus]

Hi everyone, this is my first post. I'm trying to get back into DC now that more of the Post Crisis universe is coming back. After reading rebirth #1 I'm quite excited with the direction Rebirth is going in. There's plenty of mystery to create exciting story arcs, but one that has got my interest is the mention of there being three Jokers.

I have a theory that I'd like to share and would like to know what readers think. FYI - I have not come accross this theory anywhere else, it is entirely my own. But if something similar has alreday been posted elsewhere by coincidence then sincere apologies, great minds think alike I guess! (or not if my theory is rubbish)


So here goes - what if the “there are three” is not a reference to there being three separate jokers in existence right now. Rather, it is of reference to three separate people who have become the same joker in different rebooted universes.

Let’s make an assumption – no matter what the DC universe, Batman and the Joker will always exist. The Flashpoint universe supports this. Bruce dies, yet the universe conspires to ensure that Batman and the Joker still exist. So maybe the Joker is the antidote to Batman or vice versa. Call it fate, but one will always exist and therefore the other will also always exist, no matter what happens in that timeline/universe.

The DC universe has gone through many reboots, where Bruce was Batman. However, what if in each of these reboots, the Joker’s origin was different? i.e. the initial identity was a different person, but they all become the same joker. This would explain the “there are three” when he asks the identity of the Joker; because pre-crisis, post-crisis and new 52 jokers all had different identities prior to becoming the Joker. For example, pre-crisis was a criminal in a red-hood, post-crisis was a failed comedian, New-52 I cannot say.

I’d take this further and say that although they all had different original identities, they are all the same identity upon becoming the joker i.e. their old lives are deleted and upon becoming the joker they are in sync with all other versions. This would explain the insanity or super-sanity that is used to describe the Joker’s mind. He’s crazy because he’s inexplicably connected to all of these other psyches. This also explains how the joker’s mind can recall things that no-one else can e.g. how in death of the family he remembers storylines from before the New 52, how he remembers a non-canon meeting with Spiderman in Marvel vs DC.

This in some ways supports the idea that the joker’s original identity doesn’t need to be known – because it doesn’t matter! Think of the joker as something that is inevitable. An unstoppable universal force. In some ways I think this would make the Joker’s lore more interesting and finally put to bed any questions regarding his identity because it would be a pointless question. This also ties Batman and Joker into the overall rebirth story.

I know of one major flaw in my theory and that is that there does appear to be (at least) two Jokers making a physical appearance following Batman and Alfred’s. Personally I think one of these will be the Comedian, but he will be completely unconnected to the actual true Joker identity story. I just think the Comedian and his involvement will be there to distract Batman from what is going on with Dr Manhattan because removing Bruce and his brilliant mind from the larger overall threat would be a priority for any antagonist.

I could be way off, but this definitely seems more believable than there being 3 separate people at once and the world's greatst detective has never noticed.

So, do you think this could work as an explanation?

[Confuzzled]

Not bad. Not bad at all.

[AlexanderLuthor]

Welcome aboard. Scott Snyder played around with these issues during the Endgame arc and long story short, yes it seems that there is always a Joker as a counterbalance to Batman. If you are interested, the N52 Future's End issue and Batman 35-40 get into this aspect of the Joker

[Metamorphosis]

Hi everyone, this is my first post. I'm trying to get back into DC now that more of the Post Crisis universe is coming back. After reading rebirth #1 I'm quite excited with the direction Rebirth is going in. There's plenty of mystery to create exciting story arcs, but one that has got my interest is the mention of there being three Jokers.

I have a theory that I'd like to share and would like to know what readers think. FYI - I have not come accross this theory anywhere else, it is entirely my own. But if something similar has alreday been posted elsewhere by coincidence then sincere apologies, great minds think alike I guess! (or not if my theory is rubbish)


So here goes - what if the “there are three” is not a reference to there being three separate jokers in existence right now. Rather, it is of reference to three separate people who have become the same joker in different rebooted universes.

Let’s make an assumption – no matter what the DC universe, Batman and the Joker will always exist. The Flashpoint universe supports this. Bruce dies, yet the universe conspires to ensure that Batman and the Joker still exist. So maybe the Joker is the antidote to Batman or vice versa. Call it fate, but one will always exist and therefore the other will also always exist, no matter what happens in that timeline/universe.

The DC universe has gone through many reboots, where Bruce was Batman. However, what if in each of these reboots, the Joker’s origin was different? i.e. the initial identity was a different person, but they all become the same joker. This would explain the “there are three” when he asks the identity of the Joker; because pre-crisis, post-crisis and new 52 jokers all had different identities prior to becoming the Joker. For example, pre-crisis was a criminal in a red-hood, post-crisis was a failed comedian, New-52 I cannot say.

I’d take this further and say that although they all had different original identities, they are all the same identity upon becoming the joker i.e. their old lives are deleted and upon becoming the joker they are in sync with all other versions. This would explain the insanity or super-sanity that is used to describe the Joker’s mind. He’s crazy because he’s inexplicably connected to all of these other psyches. This also explains how the joker’s mind can recall things that no-one else can e.g. how in death of the family he remembers storylines from before the New 52, how he remembers a non-canon meeting with Spiderman in Marvel vs DC.

This in some ways supports the idea that the joker’s original identity doesn’t need to be known – because it doesn’t matter! Think of the joker as something that is inevitable. An unstoppable universal force. In some ways I think this would make the Joker’s lore more interesting and finally put to bed any questions regarding his identity because it would be a pointless question. This also ties Batman and Joker into the overall rebirth story.

I know of one major flaw in my theory and that is that there does appear to be (at least) two Jokers making a physical appearance following Batman and Alfred’s. Personally I think one of these will be the Comedian, but he will be completely unconnected to the actual true Joker identity story. I just think the Comedian and his involvement will be there to distract Batman from what is going on with Dr Manhattan because removing Bruce and his brilliant mind from the larger overall threat would be a priority for any antagonist.

I could be way off, but this definitely seems more believable than there being 3 separate people at once and the world's greatst detective has never noticed.

So, do you think this could work as an explanation?

Nu52 Joker was also a criminal in a Red Hood. But we never learned his identity there either.

[Media_Cultus]

Welcome aboard. Scott Snyder played around with these issues during the Endgame arc and long story short, yes it seems that there is always a Joker as a counterbalance to Batman. If you are interested, the N52 Future's End issue and Batman 35-40 get into this aspect of the Joker

Thanks. I might have to take a look. I'm not so familiar with the New 52 material, but from what I've heard Snyder's has been pretty much perfect so if I do give N52 a chance I'll probably read anything and everything Batman!

[Yohei72]

This seems as good a place as any to ask a related question: Where did the Joker come from all of the sudden in Rebirth #1?

I just really got into comics for the first time in the past year and a half, and am a fan of both Snyder's and Peter Tomasi's Batman (Batmen?). Of course, the Joker supposedly bit it during Snyder's "Endgame" arc. We all knew he'd be back, but I'd assumed it would be a big event with a lot of mystery and narrative hocus-pocus (the park bench encounter in "Superheavy" seeming to be a possible foreshadowing thereof). Then in the first few pages of Rebirth, I see Batman casually mention "the Joker was caught outside Baltimore three hours ago."

Did I miss a Joker re-emergence in one of the other innumerable Bat-titles that I haven't followed? Or is the implication that there are copycat Jokers springing up?

This is one of the frustrating things about reading comics from the Big Two, with all their sales-grubbing multi-titles and crossovers and "events." Preaching to the choir, I know.

Thanks for any enlightenment you guys have to offer.

[Icefalcon]

Hi everyone, this is my first post. I'm trying to get back into DC now that more of the Post Crisis universe is coming back. After reading rebirth #1 I'm quite excited with the direction Rebirth is going in. There's plenty of mystery to create exciting story arcs, but one that has got my interest is the mention of there being three Jokers.

I have a theory that I'd like to share and would like to know what readers think. FYI - I have not come accross this theory anywhere else, it is entirely my own. But if something similar has alreday been posted elsewhere by coincidence then sincere apologies, great minds think alike I guess! (or not if my theory is rubbish)


So here goes - what if the “there are three” is not a reference to there being three separate jokers in existence right now. Rather, it is of reference to three separate people who have become the same joker in different rebooted universes.

Let’s make an assumption – no matter what the DC universe, Batman and the Joker will always exist. The Flashpoint universe supports this. Bruce dies, yet the universe conspires to ensure that Batman and the Joker still exist. So maybe the Joker is the antidote to Batman or vice versa. Call it fate, but one will always exist and therefore the other will also always exist, no matter what happens in that timeline/universe.

The DC universe has gone through many reboots, where Bruce was Batman. However, what if in each of these reboots, the Joker’s origin was different? i.e. the initial identity was a different person, but they all become the same joker. This would explain the “there are three” when he asks the identity of the Joker; because pre-crisis, post-crisis and new 52 jokers all had different identities prior to becoming the Joker. For example, pre-crisis was a criminal in a red-hood, post-crisis was a failed comedian, New-52 I cannot say.

I’d take this further and say that although they all had different original identities, they are all the same identity upon becoming the joker i.e. their old lives are deleted and upon becoming the joker they are in sync with all other versions. This would explain the insanity or super-sanity that is used to describe the Joker’s mind. He’s crazy because he’s inexplicably connected to all of these other psyches. This also explains how the joker’s mind can recall things that no-one else can e.g. how in death of the family he remembers storylines from before the New 52, how he remembers a non-canon meeting with Spiderman in Marvel vs DC.

This in some ways supports the idea that the joker’s original identity doesn’t need to be known – because it doesn’t matter! Think of the joker as something that is inevitable. An unstoppable universal force. In some ways I think this would make the Joker’s lore more interesting and finally put to bed any questions regarding his identity because it would be a pointless question. This also ties Batman and Joker into the overall rebirth story.

I know of one major flaw in my theory and that is that there does appear to be (at least) two Jokers making a physical appearance following Batman and Alfred’s. Personally I think one of these will be the Comedian, but he will be completely unconnected to the actual true Joker identity story. I just think the Comedian and his involvement will be there to distract Batman from what is going on with Dr Manhattan because removing Bruce and his brilliant mind from the larger overall threat would be a priority for any antagonist.

I could be way off, but this definitely seems more believable than there being 3 separate people at once and the world's greatst detective has never noticed.

So, do you think this could work as an explanation?

I can see where you're going with that. I'm not so sure about the Comedian idea though he's not exactly Jokeresque to my mind.

[Lhynn]

Hate the idea of there always being a bat and a joker. its so stupid once you think about it.

[AUScowboy]

That same premise was used (well) during RIP/Final Crisis between Batman and Darkseid. The concept of Batman is eternal, Joker? Not so much IMO.

[Confuzzled]

Hate the idea of there always being a bat and a joker. its so stupid once you think about it.

Just a take on the yin yang concept.