Um, has Jonah Hex ever met a black person?

[Riv86672]

Not sure what more you want.
For every Hex story to be a treatise on slavery and the Confederacy being bad things?
For Jonah to stop in the middle of gunfights to give speeches on equality?
Not trying to be a Dick here, but that’s not good story telling, and I dont think ppl need to be hit over the head w. these facts every two pages.

[Johnny Thunders!]

I am a fan of comics, I think there has been a ton of great Jonah Hex comics, having said that, I don't think it would be a bad idea to get rid of the character. I just don't see how you make it work.

"He was a hero to some, a villain to others, and where ever he rode people spoke his name in whispers. He had no friends, this Jonah Hex, but he did have two companions: one was death itself. The other, the acrid smell of Gun-smoke."

That could be anybody's story and that's why the character works. The confederate uniform is not a must for that quote to work. The sun has set on romanticizing the confederacy. I don't know how they continue the character to be honest? Or if they should.

[JackDaw]

I think you mistake my point.

Palmiotti's et alii's take on Jonah Hex only means that his relation to the uniform, the Confederation, and slavery has been handled well once. It doesn't fix or redeem other takes that are less nuanced or less well-handled, nor does it manage to address the issue that Jonah Hex currently is DC's only western hero.

Not really convinced that it would make any real difference if DC was currently publishing a couple of other Western comics featuring likes of Bat Lash, Pow Wow Smith, Nighthawk, etc.

Jonah would still require good writing and DC would still need to be careful they didn't glamourise the Confederation. I've not read any JH comics that do glamourise the Confederation. Have you??

In many ways I think Batman is often written in a more troubling way...in a way that actually does glamourise violence and vigilantism.

Not arguing for a second, of course, that Batman should be "banned"...just that he and every other DC character can be written poorly, and in a way that champions poor values.

Surely in DC's adult line, even in the super hero section, we are expecting some real complexity in the lead characters, some reflection of the reality that vast majority of people are not all good or all bad??

[kjn]

Not really convinced that it would make any real difference if DC was currently publishing a couple of other Western comics featuring likes of Bat Lash, Pow Wow Smith, Nighthawk, etc.

Jonah would still require good writing and DC would still need to be careful they didn't glamourise the Confederation. I've not read any JH comics that do glamourise the Confederation. Have you??

Glamourising doesn't matter here. The uniform matters.

And all I said was that it'd be easier for DC to defend the Confederate uniform if there were other, different, examples of Western heroes they could point to. With those, Jonah Hex could be an outlier and the exception, rather than the sole example. But the uniform would still be a source of contention.

In many ways I think Batman is often written in a more troubling way...in a way that actually does glamourise violence and vigilantism.

Not arguing for a second, of course, that Batman should be "banned"...just that he and every other DC character can be written poorly, and in a way that champions poor values.

Surely in DC's adult line, even in the super hero section, we are expecting some real complexity in the lead characters, some reflection of the reality that vast majority of people are not all good or all bad??

Yes, but this discussion is about Jonah Hex, not Batman. And while modern Batman is hugely problematic from several respects, he doesn't use racist imagery in his default presentation.

[Vakanai]

I am a fan of comics, I think there has been a ton of great Jonah Hex comics, having said that, I don't think it would be a bad idea to get rid of the character. I just don't see how you make it work.

"He was a hero to some, a villain to others, and where ever he rode people spoke his name in whispers. He had no friends, this Jonah Hex, but he did have two companions: one was death itself. The other, the acrid smell of Gun-smoke."

That could be anybody's story and that's why the character works. The confederate uniform is not a must for that quote to work. The sun has set on romanticizing the confederacy. I don't know how they continue the character to be honest? Or if they should.

Easy - have him get some other clothes. Boom, done. No need to ditch a good character over as easy a fix as what he wears.

[DrNewGod]

... There’s a reason Auschwitz wasn’t bulldozed at the first opportunity. Because ppl should never forget what happened ...

I get what you're saying, but that's not a good analogy to use. Auschwitz wasn't maintained in celebration of the nazis the way that remnants of and memorials to the confederacy have been. Remember the ugly parts of history? Yes. Provide the worst among us with fetishes to idealize? Probably not a great idea.

As for Hex, a change of clothes is probably in order.

[Alpha Male]

Jonah Hex encountered Black People before as others in this thread pointed out. In an issue of Hex, he meets a U.S. Black Soldier from the Vietnam War who refuses to shake his hand on the account he's from The South. I enjoyed him and Hex's interaction with each other. It was one of the highlights of that series.

In Riders of The Worm and Such, Hex encounters a Black Cowboy on a Cattle Ranch.


On another note, I kinda wish DC would buy the rights to the Black Western Hero from the 1960's named Lobo and incorporate him into the DCU.

[JackDaw]

Yes, but this discussion is about Jonah Hex, not Batman. And while modern Batman is hugely problematic from several respects, he doesn't use racist imagery in his default presentation.

I don’t think Jonah Hex can fairly be discussed in a vacuum. And neither do you apparently...as you regard the absence of other DC western characters as critical.

I agree that Jonah’s confederate uniform could be ditched (and should be)...apart from those scenes set back in the days when he was in the army fighting, of course.

[Riv86672]

My final thoughts here (final, because the thread is an exercise in dead horse beating, as nooobody is changing their minds on the matter) on this subject are...

I've never 'met' anyone who had a problem w. Jonah's uniform prior to this thread in nearly 50 years of collecting comics.
I've also never 'met' anyone who has a problem w. Japanese heroes (at DC, Marvel, Image etc.) having costumes w. stylized depictions of the Rising Sun symbol, which was an actual flag, flown by the Japanese while they were our enemies in WWII, as they, among other things, bombed Pearl Harbor.
Heck, DC actually has a hero NAMED Rising sun...:

Also, when one of my brothers, and some uncles and cousins came back from Vietnam, they chose to wear the OD Green jackets in civilian life.
They often got **** for that from their fellow Americans; garbage thrown at them and even spit on. And they were, as i said fellow Americans, who'd gotten drafted and did their duty, not rebels who'd seceded to form their own country over slave rights then lost.
Bottom line for me is, that one, ppl are selective in what they choose to perceive as wrong, and two, characters like Hex, who fought on the wrong side, but is still a hero and good man, make ppl uncomfortable, because God forbid human beings should be flawed.

Thanks and goodnight.

[Nite-Wing]

In many ways its all the same problem
The flag, The confederate generals, the confederate soldiers, etc
Its all one big touch point in history where America decided it needed to honor and respect an army conventionally was fighting for something enlightened society wants to move past/forget/denigrate
In many ways putting the confederate uniform on a character or object that has garnered fans or a nostalgia is glamorizing it. DC should absolutely want to step away from that image.
I mean a couple of years ago Dukes of Hazzard got pulled from syndication for the same reason. I would hate to see Jonah Hex be another casualty

[Username taken]

In many ways its all the same problem
The flag, The confederate generals, the confederate soldiers, etc
Its all one big touch point in history where America decided it needed to honor and respect an army conventionally was fighting for something enlightened society wants to move past/forget/denigrate
In many ways putting the confederate uniform on a character or object that has garnered fans or a nostalgia is glamorizing it. DC should absolutely want to step away from that image.
I mean a couple of years ago Dukes of Hazzard got pulled from syndication for the same reason. I would hate to see Jonah Hex be another casualty

Quoted in agreement.

[Holt]

You can just get rid of the uniform, tbh. The disfigured face is the much stronger visual. When I was younger I didn't even notice his costume was a confederate uniform until someone pointed it out to me.

[batnbreakfast]

Easy - have him get some other clothes. Boom, done. No need to ditch a good character over as easy a fix as what he wears.

Yes, please. Tone down all the morally grey characters. Think of the kids and the market. I only want to read what the Zeitgeist dictates.

[Frontier]

You can just get rid of the uniform, tbh. The disfigured face is the much stronger visual. When I was younger I didn't even notice his costume was a confederate uniform until someone pointed it out to me.

Or just redesign it so it's not as pronounced.

[Vakanai]

You can just get rid of the uniform, tbh. The disfigured face is the much stronger visual. When I was younger I didn't even notice his costume was a confederate uniform until someone pointed it out to me.

Yep, damn good visual.

Yes, please. Tone down all the morally grey characters. Think of the kids and the market. I only want to read what the Zeitgeist dictates.

Dude, just stop. We can disagree without resorting to sarcasm and condescension. First off, being morally grey as a character has not a damn thing to do with a costume, it's in the damned writing where the real touch stones of morality come into play. And second off, like Holt said, the messed up face is far more important than wearing some clothes he put on a decade or two ago in story. Dear lord, even in the 1800s people got new outfits every decade or so.