Detective Comics #935 discussion (spoilers!)

[Lhynn]

Liked it. Focus on the character, not on the villain, especially when starting an arc. The speed at which things are moving is fine.

[somacula]

Liked certain pairing, I wanted more Cass and Steph but that's just me, I always want more Cass

[WhipWhirlwind]

This book is some crazy fan-servive, but I don't mean that as a bad thing - this is the stuff fans have been clamoring to see. One complaint - does everyone in the world know Bruce is Batman? it seems The Colony is going to be a government sponsored army to take out capes, but that's too simple right?

It doesn't necessarily have to be government, just someone with resources who believes in militarizing the batman concept.

And it makes sense too. Looking on the outside its kind of messed up that one guy is the final word re: law enforcement in gotham city. Yes, Gordon could tell him he's gone too far blah blah blah, but we all know if Batman thinks something needs doing it is getting done. Also, the idea of solo vigilantes patrolling the city is really outdated.

Applying Batman's training and resources to a unit/militia based concept just makes sense, conceptually at least. While azrael is a trained assassin (so dangerous), I hope we see the colony try to turn some of the team. I know if I were in charge of the colony Tim, Cass, and to a lesser degree steph would be valuable assets. Same with Karlo since he's controllable.

[Caivu]

This book is some crazy fan-servive, but I don't mean that as a bad thing - this is the stuff fans have been clamoring to see. One complaint - does everyone in the world know Bruce is Batman? it seems The Colony is going to be a government sponsored army to take out capes, but that's too simple right?

This is one thing I really want to find out. I want to know what happened 18 months ago that made Kate figure out Batman's identity.

The government angle works a bit better for some things; it better explains the Colony's funding if they're not just Jacob Kane's private army, for example. But it doesn't really explain the Bat motif or how they were completely able to stay off Batman's radar (both literally and figuratively).

[bat_girl_cc]

Another great issue! i knew Tynion wouldn't let me down.
Everyone is in character, and the threat is belivable, and Batman is badass as always.
I went a bit lol when Kate told Cass: "you know you're the best fighter in the room so you try to fight everyone's battles for them, and even you can't fight 12 battles at once" like, does Kate know who she's talking too? if i was Cass, i would say: "get in that room with me, and i will show you".
Also, i hope Batwoman eventually starts doing something, she and Batman should lead by exemple, so far she talks alot, but doesn't do much...for a moment i was sure, she and Tim would figh eventually, i don't like heros vs heros much, but it could be good story-wise Tim vs Kate.

[WhipWhirlwind]

This is one thing I really want to find out. I want to know what happened 18 months ago that made Kate figure out Batman's identity.

The government angle works a bit better for some things; it better explains the Colony's funding if they're not just Jacob Kane's private army, for example. But it doesn't really explain the Bat motif or how they were completely able to stay off Batman's radar (both literally and figuratively).

To me the bat motif is easily explained, basically taking over an established brand. All else remaining equal, who do you think is more effective when it comes to fighting crime in gotham city and their effect on the criminal element, bat branded or non bat branded?

[bat_girl_cc]

This is one thing I really want to find out. I want to know what happened 18 months ago that made Kate figure out Batman's identity.

The government angle works a bit better for some things; it better explains the Colony's funding if they're not just Jacob Kane's private army, for example. But it doesn't really explain the Bat motif or how they were completely able to stay off Batman's radar (both literally and figuratively).

I think the idea is that most people connected to Batman and that work on some basis with or near him for some time, eventually figure it out, even if they don't say it, for exemple, many times has been implyed that some Batman's villains know who he is, like The Joker and others, but they don't care.
Btw, the colony being sponsored by the goverment would be awesome, imagine, Amanda waller, Argus, etc, the possibilities for more awesomeness are huge.

[bat_girl_cc]

To me the bat motif is easily explained, basically taking over an established brand. All else remaining equal, who do you think is more effective when it comes to fighting crime in gotham city and their effect on the criminal element, bat branded or non bat branded?

Bat-branded...also, its easy to put the blame on vigilantes, because you can't really point the finger to Batman cause' people don't know who he is...sometimes vigilantes have to do some not-so-polite choices...police can't/shouldn't.
Also, Batman trains other possible vigilantes like no other, police officers even the best ones don't come close to Bruce's family and friends, even in the end of this isse it was 15 agents of this secret group the colony against 1, and i bet Bruce will take most of them down...what i mean, is, you can take the idea and some of the basis that made that idea work, but it doens't mean you'll do it as good.

[Caivu]

I went a bit lol when Kate told Cass: "you know you're the best fighter in the room so you try to fight everyone's battles for them, and even you can't fight 12 battles at once" like, does Kate know who she's talking too? if i was Cass, i would say: "get in that room with me, and i will show you".
Also, i hope Batwoman eventually starts doing something, she and Batman should lead by exemple, so far she talks alot, but doesn't do much...for a moment i was sure, she and Tim would figh eventually, i don't like heros vs heros much, but it could be good story-wise Tim vs Kate.

I thought that was a very good assessment of Cass. Kate's recognizing and acknowledging her skill, but pointing out that she has a lot to work on in terms of teamwork, which seems very fair. I agree that Kate's been slightly lacking in the "doing" department, but it's only the second issue. #936 is where it looks like things are going to get really intense. It sounds like she's going to be forced to immediately take everyone out into the field to rescue Batman, and since the trainees will all still be recovering from the Mud Room and still aren't gelling as a unit anyway, they're going to get stomped.

That could very well lead to some heated exchanges (though I don't want to see them actually coming to blows); on the one hand you'll have the trainees going "We wouldn't have lost if you hadn't pushed us so hard" while Batwoman responds with "If I hadn't pushed you that hard, we'd be dead". And the thing is, they'd both be right in a way, though it would more underscore Batwoman's point, I think. I really hope this happens.

To me the bat motif is easily explained, basically taking over an established brand. All else remaining equal, who do you think is more effective when it comes to fighting crime in gotham city and their effect on the criminal element, bat branded or non bat branded?

This is a fair point. It doesn't seem so weird to me now.

[Aahz]

Another great issue! i knew Tynion wouldn't let me down.
Everyone is in character, and the threat is belivable, and Batman is badass as always.

The problem with Tynion is (based on the Eternals) usually not to get the characters right (except when he has to write Jason) but give everybody a relevant role and his moment to shine in the story. But to see if he manages it this time we will probably have to wait till the end of the arc.

[bat_girl_cc]

The problem with Tynion is (based on the Eternals) usually not to get the characters right (except when he has to write Jason) but give everybody a relevant role and his moment to shine in the story. But to see if he manages it this time we will probably have to wait till the end of the arc.

Actually, if you look at the second Eternal, all issues written by Tynion alone were considered the best ones by the majority of the reviewers, 1 and 2 were very good, so was the last one...the problem is, Snyder and Tynion told the other writters to follow a main-scrip but gave them freedom to do whatever they wantted on their issues, and those were the vast majority, and those were where characters got baddly written sometimes. In my opinion Tynion is the one that better gets all bat-family characters, not only that but hes the one who has read and knows more about them.

[WhipWhirlwind]

I thought that was a very good assessment of Cass. Kate's recognizing and acknowledging her skill, but pointing out that she has a lot to work on in terms of teamwork, which seems very fair. I agree that Kate's been slightly lacking in the "doing" department, but it's only the second issue. #936 is where it looks like things are going to get really intense. It sounds like she's going to be forced to immediately take everyone out into the field to rescue Batman, and since the trainees will all still be recovering from the Mud Room and still aren't gelling as a unit anyway, they're going to get stomped.

That could very well lead to some heated exchanges (though I don't want to see them actually coming to blows); on the one hand you'll have the trainees going "We wouldn't have lost if you hadn't pushed us so hard" while Batwoman responds with "If I hadn't pushed you that hard, we'd be dead". And the thing is, they'd both be right in a way, though it would more underscore Batwoman's point, I think. I really hope this happens.

I could definitely see something like this. I think we'll see more friction between Tim and Kate. Also, I think Tim's scholarship is going to come out at the worst possible time.

This is a fair point. It doesn't seem so weird to me now.

Yeah, outside of a Luthoresque ego maniac, it basically boils down to "why not?"

The problem with Tynion is (based on the Eternals) usually not to get the characters right (except when he has to write Jason) but give everybody a relevant role and his moment to shine in the story. But to see if he manages it this time we will probably have to wait till the end of the arc.

Obviously most of us are optimists, but I think we're giving him the benefit of the doubt since its all him, and its his story.

[new_onslaught]

Another great issue! I'm sold! Tynion's great! He got every character right! It's been so long since I was this excited about a Batman comic!

[Lhynn]

Not only that but hes the one who has read and knows more about them.

What? is it a thing that writers dont read everything ever published about who they are writing? that seems awfully unprofessional.

[Nix Uotan]

I liked it. I think it gave a lot what the fans wanted like a return for Tim, Steph and Cass dynamic. As villains go, there is the potential for the Colony as villains. I'm suspecting Jacobs tied to the some manner. Do t think he will be the big bad but one of those 'allies linked to the bad guy' thing. He either worked with them, helped train them or believes that they are doing things the right way. He did comment on how a team and army dynamic is better than the lone approach Batman does.

Speaking of Jacob, did this confirm his link to Martha or has that been done already? Haven't read Batwoman but I had been wondering where they ranked among the Kanes. So, does this mean that the elder Kanes had four kids; Nathan, Phillip, Martha and Jacob?