Your Unpopular/Controversial Opinions on the X-Universe

[Sutekh]

As far as that last statement for all intents and purposes, Xavier copies and transfers all up to date memories to the new body. In the case of Wolverine before, while Xavier may not have been able to fully read him before, the information is still there. Think of it like an encrypted folder

Still a copy though. Not a continuation of consciousness.

That said, every time a human goes to sleep, the brain re-organizes itself. It *could* be argued that the person we are *now* dies when we lose consciousness and a new person with the same basic programming boots up and lives a 16 hour life the next day, before it all happens again.*

But that's not an argument I'm hearing from Hickman. It's just 'copies of people treated as if they were the same people,' for reasons.

What does happen if they end up with two copies of someone? (Like Vulcan.) Do they kill one? Which one? (In Vulcan's case, the crazyevil one, who is the original? Or the reasonably well-adjusted copy?) Do these copies have souls? Do they have *the same* souls, or different ones? Is there going to be some weird metaphysical consequence of A) them not having souls, or B) them creating new souls and somehow creating some sort of imbalance that affects (overjoys?) soul-predators like Mephisto and Hela, etc. ("Yess! Make more souls! Er, I mean, mutants. Whatever." -Mephisto)

*Edit: I should add that I *like* that these heady concepts are being poked at, and do not feel bad that an explanation hasn't all been spoon-fed to be me in the first month. It's cool, and I'm here for the ride. There are a lot of writers that I wouldn't trust to have even thought of this stuff, and would be worried about huge plot holes or whatever (like some other writers, who drop ideas like grenades on their way out the door, and then does not a ****ing thing with them), but so far Hickman has a better rate of follow-through and isn't prone to just leaving a mess for the next writer to (probably) pretend never happened and ignore.

[Havok83]

Still a copy though. Not a continuation of consciousness.

That said, every time a human goes to sleep, the brain re-organizes itself. It *could* be argued that the person we are *now* dies when we lose consciousness and a new person with the same basic programming boots up and lives a 16 hour life the next day, before it all happens again.*

But that's not an argument I'm hearing from Hickman. It's just 'copies of people treated as if they were the same people,' for reasons.

What does happen if they end up with two copies of someone? (Like Vulcan.) Do they kill one? Which one? (In Vulcan's case, the crazyevil one, who is the original? Or the reasonably well-adjusted copy?) Do these copies have souls? Do they have *the same* souls, or different ones? Is there going to be some weird metaphysical consequence of A) them not having souls, or B) them creating new souls and somehow creating some sort of imbalance that affects (overjoys?) soul-predators like Mephisto and Hela, etc. ("Yess! Make more souls! Er, I mean, mutants. Whatever." -Mephisto)

*Edit: I should add that I *like* that these heady concepts are being poked at, and do not feel bad that an explanation hasn't all been spoon-fed to be me in the first month. It's cool, and I'm here for the ride. There are a lot of writers that I wouldn't trust to have even thought of this stuff, and would be worried about huge plot holes or whatever (like Bendis, who drops ideas like grenades on his way out the door, and then does not a ****ing thing with them), but so far Hickman has a better rate of follow-through and isn't prone to just leaving a mess for the next writer to (probably) pretend never happened and ignore.

Vulcan's not a copy. The guy in the books is the original. X-Factor exists to address the question you pose so we'll have to wait and see. I have my own theory that Jean didnt die on space mission and she'll run into this issue

[Zelena]

Still a copy though. Not a continuation of consciousness.

That said, every time a human goes to sleep, the brain re-organizes itself. It *could* be argued that the person we are *now* dies when we lose consciousness and a new person with the same basic programming boots up and lives a 16 hour life the next day, before it all happens again.

Even when we are awake, the brain is changing… every time, we have a strong emotion (brains of people who suffered a trauma have visible traces), or when we learn something, the brain is rewired. We are living processes.

But are we that conscious of always being what we are? It’s not that we are thinking all the time about ourselves… At the postface of his “World of Ā”, a novel where the hero has gained some kind of immortality through cloning, Van Vogt said that the identity is memory. So, remembering having been that person.

[Chris0013]

“Cap” didn’t have very many heroes on his side, though. Vision was compromised. Scarlet Witch was possessed (lawl...). I’m still not sure WTF was up with Thor.

Despite some peoples’ mis-givings regarding certain characters (which usually boils down to either editorial mandate or lack of communication between offices), I doubt Marvel ever wants to portray their heroic characters as outrightly bigoted toward any minority group, mutants included.

But being this is a sort of “wishlist” thread, which heroes would you have liked to damn forever?

I believe that was due to Stevil lifting Mjolnir. He was seen as worthy in Thor's eyes. Even though it was a scam made possible by a Cosmic Cube fragment.

[Devaishwarya]

While I understand the transfer of mind/psyche isn't a "continuation of consciousness" (as the Cerebro protocols operate) per se...it is their mind with all the memories and experiences and emotions and characteristics pertaining to that singular person and that person only. Same goes for the bodies into which the psyches are transferred.

So for me...that person is the "real deal" in body, mind and spirit, regardless. (Yes, I get they aren't the originals in the truest sense of the word but as I stated before...a lot of X-Men haven't been in their original bodies for a long time.)

[Chris0013]

While I understand the transfer of mind/psyche isn't a "continuation of consciousness" (as the Cerebro protocols operate) per se...it is their mind with all the memories and experiences and emotions and characteristics pertaining to that singular person and that person only. Same goes for the bodies into which the psyches are transferred.

So for me...that person is the "real deal" in body, mind and spirit, regardless. (Yes, I get they aren't the originals in the truest sense of the word but as I stated before...a lot of X-Men haven't been in their original bodies for a long time.)

Would love to see them get the order wrong when bringing back a group...a few minds in the wrong bodies. Ooops.

[Devaishwarya]

That would be hilarious.

[Sutekh]

While I understand the transfer of mind/psyche isn't a "continuation of consciousness" (as the Cerebro protocols operate) per se...it is their mind with all the memories and experiences and emotions and characteristics pertaining to that singular person and that person only. Same goes for the bodies into which the psyches are transferred.

So for me...that person is the "real deal" in body, mind and spirit, regardless. (Yes, I get they aren't the originals in the truest sense of the word but as I stated before...a lot of X-Men haven't been in their original bodies for a long time.)

Oh yeah, definitely a real person, just not necessarily *the same* person.

Which makes the question of what to do with multiples of them running around more fun. It's not really any different than a bunch of Alternate Universe versions of characters meeting up, they can't just start killing off the AU folk because 'they aren't real,' cause they are *real,* just not the same person.

It's the sort of stuff that sci-fi stories deal with (particularly transhumanist stuff), but comic books rarely have, and I'm kinda loving it.

[Sutekh]

Vulcan's not a copy. The guy in the books is the original.

Didn't the book recently suggest that there was an entirely different Vulcan somewhere floating in a void between worlds, the original 'Emperor Vulcan' dude (whose mind was somehow quantum-entangling with 'our' Vulcan, so that he was dreaming about this place he'd personally have no memories of)?

That was the impression I got, anyway.

Another Jean would be interesting. Way to give that character some oomph, to have her be the one to blow it all up by descending from space, all fiery and out of sorts, because she was 'left for dead' and a new copy decanted...

[Havok83]

Didn't the book recently suggest that there was an entirely different Vulcan somewhere floating in a void between worlds, the original 'Emperor Vulcan' dude (whose mind was somehow quantum-entangling with 'our' Vulcan, so that he was dreaming about this place he'd personally have no memories of)?

That was the impression I got, anyway.

Another Jean would be interesting. Way to give that character some oomph, to have her be the one to blow it all up by descending from space, all fiery and out of sorts, because she was 'left for dead' and a new copy decanted...

The last issue of X-men was a Vulcan spotlight issue and answered the question about how he got back. He wasnt resurrected and this is the original

[Kitty&Piotr<3]

Unpop opinion: she should go by Katherine instead of Kate.

[Will Evans]

Make Dani and Rahne a couple

[Kingdom X]

Make Dani and Rahne a couple

Not until my girl Karma gets a love interest and some shine

[Will Evans]

Not until my girl Karma gets a love interest and some shine

She’s the fourth corner in the Kate-Illyana-Rachel quadruple.

[Hulkout42]

Unpopular you say? Well here goes.

To this day i do not understand what was the point of Iceman coming out as Gay after so many years of him being portrayed as heterosexual or why they need a teen version of Jean to ot him nor why she was involved in a conversation between him and his older self.

What was the point of Prodigy portrayed bisexual in Young Avengers to the current timeline? What was the payoff to that?

People need to stop ragging on Beast and Scarlett Witch, it has gone from annoying to downright offensive and Marvel should do everything they can to fix the mess they made.

The Victim card needs to stop being used when in correlation to the X-men.

Hickman's X-men are a cult now, not a team. It has my interest but there moments outside my comfort zone.

Xavier was wrong to mindwipe Richards and that will come back to haunt them.

Destiny will come back, be proven right and end Krakoa because it turns out Moira has gone crazy.

Well let the mockery and insults begin!