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  1. #16
    the cloud surfer He-Kal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Know View Post
    Weird thing is, SR also had a muted color filter for it's film as well.





    I don't even consider SR a Superman movie. It's a Lois Lane movie featuring Superman, and the story Singer told about them was boring. It's just Lois' life drama. How she copes with her job, how she copes with receiving an award for trashing Supes, how she copes with her old flame coming back into her life, who she copes as a mother to Superman's child, how she copes with being engaged to a man who is the son of her boss, and how she copes with realizing she was wrong for writing that editorial about Superman (over her own bruised feelings). Two hours and 35 minutes of this. No thanks.
    See, I absolutely loved this scene...It reminded me of the Superman from the 50-70's who was insanely powerful and could to things like move planets,etc... I'm not saying this movie had it's faults, but at least Routh's Superman actually smiled and seemed personable like Superman should (unlike the current version). TBH, at the time (and I still wonder today a little) why they didn't just have Smallville go from the tv to the movies and have Welling become Superman in the movies (would have given a fresh start and with the fan base for the tv show at the time the movie should have done well)...

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by DayoftheHero View Post
    I can see Superman being lost in space (not by his own choice) but you're right, I don't see Superman leaving for five years.
    I agree. I love the idea of a 'lost' Superman in space, trying to get back home - there was a great run of tales like this a year or two after Byrne's reboot. But he'd never abandon Earth on purpose. And it's particularly annoying that he does this in SR precisely because the movie is a sequel to the Reeve films. I think that particular version of Superman had to learn that his obligation to Earth and its people comes before his own personal happiness after the events of Superman II.

  3. #18
    Extraordinary Member Cyke's Avatar
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    Shout out to Routh, who I thought was such a good successor to Christopher Reeve that sometimes I was watching him. Sure, at the end of the day, Routh is supposed to be playing Clark and not Reeve, but it showed that Routh did his homework (and had the chops to pull it off), and that he'll put effort. I feel like his career should be bigger at this point, even with Legends of Tomorrow.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dazzler View Post
    it's greatest sins were Lois and the kid being terrible. the overall film was more boring than bad...I'd call it one of the most forgettable superhero movies of all-time before I called it one of the worst.
    yeah GL was more memorable than SR
    Quote Originally Posted by Spacedog2k5 View Post
    Indeed! See, Snyder should have looked at Spacey's Lex Luthor instead of the approach that Jesse Eisenberg brought to the character in BvS.
    I actually find Eisenbergs Luthor to be WAY more better as a Villian than Spacey's (my top Lex is still the one from S:TAS).

  5. #20
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    I enjoyed this film when I saw it in the theater and was really surprised by all the criticism. Just too many persnickety never satisfied comic fans, I guess. Probably the same ones who hate Man of Steel (which I also enjoyed).

  6. #21
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    Kevin Spacey blows away Mark Zuckerberg as Lex Luthor. 'nuff said!

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by LordLeviathan View Post
    yeah GL was more memorable than SR
    I think you're kidding? The only way GL is more memorable than SR is by how horrifically bad GL is. Honestly, GL is not much better than the last Fantastic Four movie. Just a horrible job by DC/Warner on that one. If they had released GL in conjunction with Man of Steel or BvS it could've derailed their entire cinematic universe. Thankfully it came out early enough in the process that it could be swept under the rug and we can all pretend it never happened.

  8. #23
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    I don't understand how anybody can call SR one of the worst superhero movies when such movies as Batman & Robin, and Wolverine Origins exist. SR isn't even close to being the worst Superman movie. Others have already pointed out it's flaws (boring, long, Kate Bosworth, love child), but here's the list of Superman movies rated best to worst.
    1. Superman The Movie - Richard Donner created the superhero movie before there was a genre. It's a little dated for modern audiences but it's a fun, breezy, action comedy that I still enjoy as much as I did when I was a kid.
    2. Superman II - is only okay. It's a good sequel but it never has the sense of wonder that the first one has.
    3. Superman Returns - By placing it here I'm able to complete the trilogy in the way that Singer wanted. Also this movie for all it's flaws is better than any of the following Superman movies. Not only is it not the worst superhero movie but there are 3 Superman movies that are worse than it.
    4. Superman III - Pretty much a terrible movie hijacked by Richard Pryor. This movie might have been better is Christopher Reeve had been replaced by Gene Wilder but just slamming Richard Pryor into the DC universe pretty much as himself was a terrible idea.
    5, 6. Superman IV, Man of Steel - I'm rating these on the same level because while IV is just terrible filmmaking in every respect, I personally loathe MoS as betraying what Superman actually is. Personally I would place MoS as last on this list and in my top 10 for most hated movies of all time, but from a filmmaking standpoint it's a competent example of 21st century disaster porn. If it were a Transformers movie I wouldn't hate it nearly as much - it would just be stupid, but turning comicdoms shining beacon of hope into the equivalent of a giant asteroid or a giant robot and just destroying everything around him made me so angry that I won't support any WB comic book movies. They just don't get it.
    Note - BvS is not listed only because I haven't seen it (and I will never see it, or any movie that Snyder gets to decide tone and story for the character of Superman.)

  9. #24
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    @gleality -

    Agreed on every point.

  10. #25
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    Superman IV is light-years ahead of Man of Steel, even though it's a rather sad rehashing of plots from the first two Superman films. I'll take Gene Hackman saying 'Nukular Man' over the murderous Man of Steel any day. Superman III is hard to rate - it's so awful, in so many ways, but it has Annette O'Toole as Lana Lang and Reeve playing a more interesting Clark than he'd been able to portray in the first two films. Reeve is in great shape in III (he was quite skinny/lanky in the earliest scenes shot for the first two), and his flying sequences look better than elsewhere. And there's that great junkyard fight.

    It's likely a sign of my age that I don't understand why younger audiences today don't respond to Superman: the Movie. I saw it in 1978, during Christmas with my dad, and when he saved Lois and the helicopter the whole audience stood up to cheer. Nothing like that will ever happen nowadays. I guess when you get old you stop caring that tights don't look like realistic alien garb, and you care more about whether you actually like the movie's protagonist. Old man raving aside, I guess I don't get why it would've been difficult for Z. Snyder to create a Superman who actually cared about helping people. Geez, Ruffalo's Banner is more of a hero than Cavill's Clark, because he's stricken with guilt after going on a rampage. In Man of Steel, Clark never even acknowledges the damage.

    With respect to what's come after it, as the years pass, Superman Returns looks better and better.
    Last edited by dittobeetle; 06-26-2016 at 12:21 PM.

  11. #26
    Extraordinary Member Doctor Know's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dittobeetle View Post
    Superman IV is light-years ahead of Man of Steel, even though it's a rather sad rehashing of plots from the first two Superman films. I'll take Gene Hackman saying 'Nukular Man' over the murderous Man of Steel any day.
    Did you forget the part of Superman IV where Superman kills Nuclear Man by dropping him in a Nuclear Reactor?




    Quote Originally Posted by dittobeetle View Post
    It's likely a sign of my age that I don't understand why younger audiences today don't respond to Superman: the Movie. I saw it in 1978, during Christmas with my dad, and when he saved Lois and the helicopter the whole audience stood up to cheer. Nothing like that will ever happen nowadays. I guess when you get old you stop caring that tights don't look like realistic alien garb, and you care more about whether you actually like the movie's protagonist. Old man raving aside, I guess I don't get why it would've been difficult for Z. Snyder to create a Superman who actually cared about helping people. Geez, Ruffalo's Banner is more of a hero than Cavill's Clark, because he's stricken with guilt after going on a rampage.
    I think your hyperpole got away from you there, mate. Cavil's Superman does nothing but help people. It's the first thing he does in MOS and the last thing he does in BvS. With regards to Banner, he was mentally manipulated (again) and set to attack innocent people. The Hulk coming to his senses (briefly, as he was about to continue his rage out) and demonstrating guilt and suffering over the destruction he caused, stems from Scarlet's Witch spell breaking. Banner is not a bad person and wouldn't do those things. And if you're looking for Superman expressing a form a pathos, look no further.



    Last edited by Doctor Know; 06-26-2016 at 12:51 PM.

  12. #27
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    Fair enough. My hyperbole does rather easily get away from me, and it's helpful to be called on it. Additionally, you're right about Hulk/Banner being manipulated to do horrible things.

    Still, the Superman of MoS does inflict a great deal of damage on an urban population, simply by choosing not to try to shift the ground of battle. Reeve's Superman makes the same mistake at first, but is allowed to correct it - I guess I just wish that Cavill's Clark had the same opportunity. I agree, in light of your comments, that the Superman of the Snyder-verse does actually reflect on and care about these matters. I suppose my wish is that we could see more of him in the hero's role - as he is, as you point out, at the beginning of his first film and at the end of his latest.

    As to the Nuclear Man's demise in Superman IV, you're right again - Superman would never kill Bizarro, and the Nuclear Man is little more than an 80s MTV Bizarro with terrible hair. Nevertheless, at the end of Superman IV, I feel I've watched a (yes, terrible) movie about a superhero. I don't feel that way with Man of Steel. The big problem with Man of Steel is that, whether he cares or not, Clark isn't shown dramatically, effectively, to choose to be Superman, of his own volition, without inspiration by his father. I guess I feel that the whole idea of Superman should be Clark's invention, with maybe some help from John and Martha Kent, as it has been in other versions. In MoS, he's bequeathed a suit, and with it an assumed heroic persona. It just doesn't ever feel like he stands for something. But I do admit that, yes, he helps people, and at times, we can see that he cares. Superman needs to be about more than that, don't you think?

  13. #28
    Extraordinary Member Zero Hunter's Avatar
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    With the cast they had in this movie it could have been great if they had not gotten so hung up to doing a love letter to Donner instead of telling a Superman story for modern audiences. The Donner films are very much a thing of their time and trying to do a movie with that tone today us why ti was a failure. I have seen younger people try and watch the old Donner movies and they just laugh at how corny and dumb they are, and Superman Returns had that tone in spades.

    Like I said the cast was not the problem. It was the filmakers trying to do a movie that was 30 years behind the times. It was sad they wasted Spacey on this movie because he would have been amazing as Lex if they had done it right instead of just having him do and over the top version of Hackman's Luthor (and Hackmans Luthor was garbage to begin with).

  14. #29
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    I actually watched this on HBO not too long ago and it was even more boring than I remember. I don't understand how so many talented people could make something so un-entertaining.
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  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Know View Post
    I think your hyperpole got away from you there, mate. Cavil's Superman does nothing but help people.


    It's the first thing he does in MOS and the last thing he does in BvS. With regards to Banner, he was mentally manipulated (again) and set to attack innocent people. The Hulk coming to his senses (briefly, as he was about to continue his rage out) and demonstrating guilt and suffering over the destruction he caused, stems from Scarlet's Witch spell breaking. Banner is not a bad person and wouldn't do those things. And if you're looking for Superman expressing a form a pathos, look no further.



    Those are very funny gifs you posted, funnier if you remember the stupid scenes they're part. Does pathos mean something different now?

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